Understanding Blade Gap/Exposure combos and efficiency to blade feel ratio

[SaguaroSmart]

Greetings people!

I am fairly new to B&B. I have been wet shaving for a few years now mostly with 2 or 3 razors (after trying several that did not work well). After reading many posts here, I've come to realize I know very little about DE razors in the sense that I keep reading about lots of different brands and models I had never heard of before.

I have a difficult combo of beard and skin to please. I tend to have quite dense and coarse beard hair but also fairly sensitive skin. I also shave everyday. Obviously sensitive and coarse is all relative so here a few examples of razors that did well or poorly for me:

Better performers:

• Razorock GameChanger .84P
• EJ 3one6
• Henson medium

Ok but not great:

• Razorock GameChanger .68P --> (still a bit low on the efficiency scale, I do not get BBS unless I go a full 3 passes + a lot of touch ups)

Poor performers:

• EJ DE89 (too inefficient, keep having to repeat passes until irritated)
• Lupo 95 (very efficient but combination of gap and blade exposure just gives me irritation after 2 passes)

As I prepare to accept my fate, dive deep down the rabbit hole, and potentially acquire more razors, I am interested in learning more about razors in general. I am curious to find out more about what makes a razor mild with fairly low blade feel yet highly efficient. So far, this is what I experienced:

• Low blade gap and negative blade exposure --> usually inefficient especially where my hair grows parallel to my neck or jawline.
• High blade gap and high blade exposure (Lupo 95) --> Very efficient but unfortunately I don't have the skin for it, gives me irritation too quickly.
• High blade gap and neutral blade exposure (GC 84P ??) --> Efficient and decently comfortable

Recently I read about razors offering combinations of blade gap / exposure I had never seen before like the Chiseled Face Legacy that seems to have a high blade gap (1.12) but not a ton of exposure or the Lambda Athena offering a low blade gap and neutral exposure and it got me wondering what combination of blade gap and blade exposure leads to the best efficiency to blade feel ratio as in retaining high efficiency but low blade feel (not necessarily no blade feel but not something that is much higher than a GC .84P or EJ 3one6).

I've seen a lot of people mentioning the Karve Overlander, also people mentioning combinations of the tatara masamune cap + nodachi baseplate (high gap / slightly negative exposure) and nodachi cap + masamune baseplate (low gap + neutral exposure). I've recently read about the Athena or some of the Timeless razors as well.

Please weigh in and let me know your experience with all the different combos of blade gap / exposure and what you found to be very efficient while retaining low blade feel and low risk of irritation. Also let me know about all the razor brands and models I don't know about, there seems to be so much out there, I feel like I'm Alice in wonderland and I just fell down the rabbit hole.

 

[NorthernSoul]

So, what exactly is wrong with your better performers like the 3one6 or GC 84P or Henson medium?

If you don't think your shaves are close enough or comfortable enough with these, the best thing to do is improve your skills, instead of finding some golden equipment.

 

[ButterfaceX]

Too add to the great NorthernSoul tip..Skills, Techniques...you can 't buy.
I try to convey that wet shaving has so many variables. When the sum of all are aligned in will all start to click. Technique, skills, patience, consistency os the solid foundation .From face, skin, stubble thickness, face mapping, stubble density..Razor, blade, weight..
Prep can be key also, in shave process and post shave skin recovery.
Software used?
You could be buy and trying for a long time. Stick with one that works the best...and you will be tasked next to make it better!
Couple of suggestions..
I have from your description somewhat similar stubble.
Consider trying a slant down the road. Parker semi slant. I may work for you.
Got to fly...
BFX...

 

[Alex Jr]

High blade gap and neutral blade exposure (GC 84P ??) --> Efficient and decently comfortable

P stands for positive exposure.

I’m not into positive exposure if I’m doing an ATG pass, it always feels a little too much for me. I prefer neutral for that pass. Rockwell, vintage Gillettes are fine examples.

If it’s WTG/XTG, give me R41 exposure, I’m all in.

 

[Phoenixkh]

I have some of the razors you mentioned. I love my Lamda Athena and my Timeless Titanium 0.68OC (open comb base plate).

I've never been able to wrap my mind around the offerings from Tatara. I know the names but not how they shave depending on the top cap and base plate selections. Lots of people here love them, as you noted.

I found out fairly early on.... I'm not a razor designer. The numbers don't tell the complete story. Why is the Athena mild but can give a very efficient shave? There are people here who understand this stuff, that I can tell you. As you hang around a bit and read the new posts and search out topics that interest you, you'll meet lots of interesting folks, including the people who have already responded to this thread you started. The wealth of information here is staggering... a bit overwhelming at the start, at least for me.

But you'll feel comfortable in no time. Thanks for introducing yourself.

 

[SaguaroSmart]

So, what exactly is wrong with your better performers like the 3one6 or GC 84P or Henson medium?

If you don't think your shaves are close enough or comfortable enough with these, the best thing to do is improve your skills, instead of finding some golden equipment.

Nothing wrong. I get great shaves from these. I was just looking to learn more about other razors to branch out for the fun of it. It's becoming more of a hobby at this point, like collecting nice watches. I was looking to explore others brands / models but still want to select something that I can use even if it's to collect.

 

[SaguaroSmart]

P stands for positive exposure.

I’m not into positive exposure if I’m doing an ATG pass, it always feels a little too much for me. I prefer neutral for that pass. Rockwell, vintage Gillettes are fine examples.

If it’s WTG/XTG, give me R41 exposure, I’m all in.

Interesting, I looked up the website of italianbarber and they do list even the GC .68P as positive in blade exposure. I gotta say I'm puzzled because I feel like it has so little blade feel and it is not that efficient for me at least. They do not publish the exact numbers for blade exposure. I wonder how different the GC line is from the Lupo line because to me the Lupo 95 had quite a bit more blade feel than the GC .84P and it made it too much for everyday shaving.

 

[SamplingNature]

Wow. I just smear soap on my face, then drag the razor across it. Then repeat in a different direction. I may, occasionally, change the setting on my Super Adjustable...

That said, you've said nothing about the blades that you've used with the various razors. In my experience, that can be a major variable...and it's by far the cheapest and easiest to experiment with.

If you really want a thrill as a collector, start hunting for vintage razors in the wild.

 

[SaguaroSmart]

Wow. I just smear soap on my face, then drag the razor across it. Then repeat in a different direction. I may, occasionally, change the setting on my Super Adjustable...

That said, you've said nothing about the blades that you've used with the various razors. In my experience, that can be a major variable...and it's by far the cheapest and easiest to experiment with.

If you really want a thrill as a collector, start hunting for vintage razors in the wild.

Haha, your post had me chuckle. You are right, I tend to overanalyze things but when it is about hobbies, it's actually kind of fun.
I've experimented with several blades, not all of them of course since there are so many. I get great shaves from the GC .84P and 3one6 or Henson with Gillette Nacet, Gillette Platinum and Gillette Silver Blue. Derby Extra, RK, gave me uncomfortable shaves, Feather were fine but the Gillette Nacet, Platinum and Silver Blue were more comfortable. This is what I've tried so far.

 

[SamplingNature]

Haha, your post had me chuckle. You are right, I tend to overanalyze things but when it is about hobbies, it's actually kind of fun.
I've experimented with several blades, not all of them of course since there are so many. I get great shaves from the GC .84P and 3one6 or Henson with Gillette Nacet, Gillette Platinum and Gillette Silver Blue. Derby Extra, RK, gave me uncomfortable shaves, Feather were fine but the Gillette Nacet, Platinum and Silver Blue were more comfortable. This is what I've tried so far.

Don't get me wrong. I tend to do similar on other fronts and have to find pursuits that require that kind of analysis. And I probably got lucky and hit the lottery with a combo cheap blade, a cheap soap and a vintage (birth year and apparently last quarter for all-metal at that) razor deal that I actually managed to profit with...and did so fairly quickly.

 

[NorthernSoul]

Nothing wrong. I get great shaves from these. I was just looking to learn more about other razors to branch out for the fun of it. It's becoming more of a hobby at this point, like collecting nice watches. I was looking to explore others brands / models but still want to select something that I can use even if it's to collect.

I can relate to the collecting/curiosity/hobby aspect. You already are using some very good DE razors and blades so it's hard to guess what will scratch the itch. It just sounded like you were searching for a different experience beyond what you have tried so far.

Maybe something in another format would give you a different experience. What about injectors, AC type razors, slant razors? Or possibly a milder open comb DE? Just a thought.

 

[tm3]

You are right, I tend to overanalyze things but when it is about hobbies, it's actually kind of fun.

I feel your pain. I tend to overanalyze, and it can be both fun and somewhat of a curse.

You might try reviewing threads that discuss the razors you like, and see what B&Bers with taste similar to yours recommend.

 

[abies]

Greetings people!

I am fairly new to B&B. I have been wet shaving for a few years now mostly with 2 or 3 razors (after trying several that did not work well). After reading many posts here, I've come to realize I know very little about DE razors in the sense that I keep reading about lots of different brands and models I had never heard of before.

I have a difficult combo of beard and skin to please. I tend to have quite dense and coarse beard hair but also fairly sensitive skin. I also shave everyday. Obviously sensitive and coarse is all relative so here a few examples of razors that did well or poorly for me:

Better performers:

• Razorock GameChanger .84P
• EJ 3one6
• Henson medium

Ok but not great:

• Razorock GameChanger .68P --> (still a bit low on the efficiency scale, I do not get BBS unless I go a full 3 passes + a lot of touch ups)

Poor performers:

• EJ DE89 (too inefficient, keep having to repeat passes until irritated)
• Lupo 95 (very efficient but combination of gap and blade exposure just gives me irritation after 2 passes)

As I prepare to accept my fate, dive deep down the rabbit hole, and potentially acquire more razors, I am interested in learning more about razors in general. I am curious to find out more about what makes a razor mild with fairly low blade feel yet highly efficient. So far, this is what I experienced:

• Low blade gap and negative blade exposure --> usually inefficient especially where my hair grows parallel to my neck or jawline.
• High blade gap and high blade exposure (Lupo 95) --> Very efficient but unfortunately I don't have the skin for it, gives me irritation too quickly.
• High blade gap and neutral blade exposure (GC 84P ??) --> Efficient and decently comfortable

Recently I read about razors offering combinations of blade gap / exposure I had never seen before like the Chiseled Face Legacy that seems to have a high blade gap (1.12) but not a ton of exposure or the Lambda Athena offering a low blade gap and neutral exposure and it got me wondering what combination of blade gap and blade exposure leads to the best efficiency to blade feel ratio as in retaining high efficiency but low blade feel (not necessarily no blade feel but not something that is much higher than a GC .84P or EJ 3one6).

I've seen a lot of people mentioning the Karve Overlander, also people mentioning combinations of the tatara masamune cap + nodachi baseplate (high gap / slightly negative exposure) and nodachi cap + masamune baseplate (low gap + neutral exposure). I've recently read about the Athena or some of the Timeless razors as well.

Please weigh in and let me know your experience with all the different combos of blade gap / exposure and what you found to be very efficient while retaining low blade feel and low risk of irritation. Also let me know about all the razor brands and models I don't know about, there seems to be so much out there, I feel like I'm Alice in wonderland and I just fell down the rabbit hole.

I just noticed this thread... you might want to take a look at the figure in this thread if you haven't already:

Blade gap and exposure

You beat me to mentioning it, also Henson aggressive and Timeless .95. This is already starting to show a clear correlation between the measurements and the type of adjustment. I am wondering though about those three on the far right, that seems a bit strange. One other thing, it has been...

www.badgerandblade.com

Of all the razors I've used, the Tatara Muramasa is probably the one with the lowest blade feel to efficiency ratio. But I suspect there are other razors that offer a similar experience (Karve with the right plate is probably one).

 

[SaguaroSmart]

I just noticed this thread... you might want to take a look at the figure in this thread if you haven't already:

Blade gap and exposure

You beat me to mentioning it, also Henson aggressive and Timeless .95. This is already starting to show a clear correlation between the measurements and the type of adjustment. I am wondering though about those three on the far right, that seems a bit strange. One other thing, it has been...

www.badgerandblade.com

Of all the razors I've used, the Tatara Muramasa is probably the one with the lowest blade feel to efficiency ratio. But I suspect there are other razors that offer a similar experience (Karve with the right plate is probably one).

Hey, just wanted to thank you for posting this link. I had missed it and seems like the kind of thread I was looking for!

 

[jamesdeluxa]

Im trying to figure out the same.

Went from R89/EJ89 variants to a Rockwell 6C/6S and didn't like them due to specific blade gap issues with Indian Gillette Wilkinsons.. (left right bias). My 6S had manufacturing blemishes and the overly bulky head was no bueno for under nose.

Would get irritated with plates 1-3 due to having to go for multiple passes and 5-6 felt too aggressive. I would end up nicking myself too many times coming from a milder 89 variant. Plate 4 was okay as far as I remember.

The gaps on this razor are lower than most. IE: https://support.rockwellrazors.com/...at-are-the-blade-gaps-for-each-of-your-series

I'll admit, I could have been going at the wrong angle or pressing too hard... but still.. between the price and what not, I sent both mine back to Rockwell. Wasn't happy.

Fast Forward.. I Picked up a Razorock GC.84-P last year and ABSOLUTELY Loved it. Was considering GC1.05 for more efficiency, but I fear i'll have to go slower or end up with more irritation.. Not sure.. .76 seems like it could be a neutral side grade or a slight downgrade.

I used to shave with a full brush and soap, but lately just use Cremo or Proraso white in shower with hand lather. I find myself not to enjoy shaving like most here, but I do enjoy having a nice tool. Especially one as good as the .84 GC that I have. Just works..

 

[SaguaroSmart]

Im trying to figure out the same.

Went from R89/EJ89 variants to a Rockwell 6C/6S and didn't like them due to specific blade gap issues with Indian Gillette Wilkinsons.. (left right bias). My 6S had manufacturing blemishes and the overly bulky head was no bueno for under nose.

Would get irritated with plates 1-3 due to having to go for multiple passes and 5-6 felt too aggressive. I would end up nicking myself too many times coming from a milder 89 variant. Plate 4 was okay as far as I remember.

The gaps on this razor are lower than most. IE: https://support.rockwellrazors.com/...at-are-the-blade-gaps-for-each-of-your-series

I'll admit, I could have been going at the wrong angle or pressing too hard... but still.. between the price and what not, I sent both mine back to Rockwell. Wasn't happy.

Fast Forward.. I Picked up a Razorock GC.84-P last year and ABSOLUTELY Loved it. Was considering GC1.05 for more efficiency, but I fear i'll have to go slower or end up with more irritation.. Not sure.. .76 seems like it could be a neutral side grade or a slight downgrade.

I used to shave with a full brush and soap, but lately just use Cremo or Proraso white in shower with hand lather. I find myself not to enjoy shaving like most here, but I do enjoy having a nice tool. Especially one as good as the .84 GC that I have. Just works..

If that can help you, I have most of the GC plates. Based on your post, I doubt you would like the 1.05P. It is more efficient than the .84P but you lose quite a bit a smoothness, too much smoothness is lost to gain too little efficiency in my opinion. The .76P is great, it's a bit smoother than the .84P and retains most of its efficiency.

Also based on what you are saying I think you could get much smoother and comfortable shaves with a good brush and a great face lather. I feel like mastering the art of whipping a perfectly hydrated lather can really change a shave.

Personally after reading a lot of posts on these forums, I think I'm starting to put together a short list of the most likely candidate for my next razor: it will probably be the Lambda Athena or the Karve Overlander. They keep being praised for being highly efficient and extremely comfortable.

Thanks for your post by the way.

 

[jamesdeluxa]

If that can help you, I have most of the GC plates. Based on your post, I doubt you would like the 1.05P. It is more efficient than the .84P but you lose quite a bit a smoothness, too much smoothness is lost to gain too little efficiency in my opinion. The .76P is great, it's a bit smoother than the .84P and retains most of its efficiency.

Also based on what you are saying I think you could get much smoother and comfortable shaves with a good brush and a great face lather. I feel like mastering the art of whipping a perfectly hydrated lather can really change a shave.

Personally after reading a lot of posts on these forums, I think I'm starting to put together a short list of the most likely candidate for my next razor: it will probably be the Lambda Athena or the Karve Overlander. They keep being praised for being highly efficient and extremely comfortable.

Thanks for your post by the way.

Kinda sucks that both .76 and 1.05 are OOS atm. Could buy a full razor of 1.05 GC, just hesitant. Was also thinking of trying .68 plate for the hell of it, but it might be "too mild".

My skin is like yours... fairly sensitive with coarse growth. I find less passes generally helps subjectively. This is regardless of what soap/lather and brush I use... Part of it is just me being lazy too lol

I can't let my facial hair grow either.. Skin turns red and gets irritated.

 

[Guido75]

Welcome to B&B! Lots of great information around. And I love your “Your Mileage May Vary” input regarding which razors work for you and which do less. In the lesser category are some of the razors that get much praise around these parts like the Lupo (which I personally have not yet had the opportunity of experiencing).

I do think that the effectiveness of your shave is more than just the razor so while I might be in favour of trying as much razors as you can and collect away, I would be inclined to also point out other equally important parts of the shave such as preparing the beard, lathering up, brushes, and most importantly mapping your beard growth and shaving accordingly. And then there is the summit of DE shaving which is no pressure. I am not saying you are not already doing this, but I have found that I can get consistent results with a variety of razors because I focus more on technique and getting ready than only the razor.

Just my 2ct - most important thing is that you are having fun and that you do what works for you.

Enjoy!

Guido

 

[kingfisher]

I like high-gap, neutral-ish exposure razors like the Chiseled Face Legacy and the Pils.

I used to do two passes every day but it was too much, so I switched to two passes four times a week. Over time the two passes turned gradually into three, as I chased that dolphin-smooth finish.

I finally realized that going after that completely smooth result isn't good for me. So now I am doing two passes four times a week, and stopping at two passes no matter what.

I think I could do a single pass every day, which would make it so that i was never completely smooth but never really had noticeable stubble, or I can continue with two passes four times a week, which gets me a great shave four times but allows a little bit of a shadow to occasionally be seen. The first method would be seven passes a week; the latter is eight, so they are pretty close to the same. For now I prefer two passes four times.

 

[BigJ]

I just noticed this thread... you might want to take a look at the figure in this thread if you haven't already:

Blade gap and exposure

You beat me to mentioning it, also Henson aggressive and Timeless .95. This is already starting to show a clear correlation between the measurements and the type of adjustment. I am wondering though about those three on the far right, that seems a bit strange. One other thing, it has been...

www.badgerandblade.com

Of all the razors I've used, the Tatara Muramasa is probably the one with the lowest blade feel to efficiency ratio. But I suspect there are other razors that offer a similar experience (Karve with the right plate is probably one).

Great link!

First, I do not think that one can reduce all the variables here to a single ’formula.’ Simply too many factors IMO.

For me, the ’answer’ was to combine a ‘mild/moderate’ razor with a sharp blade. That is once my technique was really solid. But that’s my answer, rather than a ‘holy grail’ razor.