Grudge Match: NEW Deluxe versus Raised Flat Bottom

[Copierguy]

Looking back on my tests, if I had not just received the Deluxe as a loan just prior to the first round, it may have come out as a tie start to finish.
The heavy head / light handle combo made it feel like I was driving someone else's car. After the first round it easily held it's own.

 

[imatabor]

Last 3 days of the match. Jump in while you can.

 

[Graydog]

I shaved with My #77 RFB today against My Probak , it was not even close The #77 blew the doors off the Probak
and the Probak gives me a good shave but like I said not even a match for The #77

 

[bosseb]

This third and final round again performed as two totally separate shaves as to not make a disadvantage for the razor on my troublesome left half of my face.

The equipment was both heads on an the same aftermarket 50 g solid brass handle, M&F Chief brush with Mystic Water Windjammer soap followed by DR Harris Windsor ASB and four drops of my own post shave oil. Both shaves were BBS 2 pass as usual. These were the 37th and 38th shaves on the red IP blade.

Smoothness: RFB
As expected but now with a much smaller margin as the blade has mellowed somewhat. The blade is now in prime buttery egde and extremely comfortable in both razors.

Efficiency: Deluxe

Again totally as expected. The difference was marginal this round as judged by the five o'clock shadow. I have had the opportunity to assess the 24 h stubble of both shaves and all I can say is that it is totally under control even without a cleanup pass when using the Deluxe, even if I am forced to night shaving by my job schedule.

Ease of Shave: Deluxe
The more the blade mellows the easier the Deluxe will perform and the RFB will have to struggle to avoid an excessive cleanup pass. I do not expect this to come into play until a few more weeks on the blade however. The Deluxe is now in its own territory...


Overall Experience and winner of round 2: the Deluxe.
This decision is quite clear and confirmed by a third shave just now with the RFB. From this point on in the life of the blade the Deluxe will totally dominate! Of course I will soon be loading the blade into my TTOs...

 

[lloydrm]

Here are my results.
Short answer and not numbers based: its a tie.
Now some numbers I ran based on Copierguy's table. First a couple of caveats: a. I cheated and did not stop at 3. I did two more 50/50 shaves (not enough time for the third one) but changed a bit things using a different Deluxe. b. for the first round I used the same top cap for both razors (kind of tedious btw) since the top cap of the RFB is ... well ... a head a stamp collector would like having and that I enjoy, but not very good for the test (you'll see what am talking about).
Method wise I used a well seasoned blade, same for all passes and shaves. I believe I used different brushes and soaps in all 5 runs, all face lathered and am a three-pass-plus-touchups shaver. I evaluated the quality of the shave running my fingers all around in between passes using more water than I normally do, then when applying ASB, and finally I used Myrsol Emulsion as preshave to check for differences in growth. BTW, I think the former evaluation method is non conclusive but does shows some differences between razors. I came to the same conclusion with the later two results-based evaluation methods.

Table



Up front I honestly thought the BB Deluxe was gonna win. It feels so great and I like its looks. Its a charming razor. The No.77 I have is not in very good shape, but I like it very much and was basically PIFed by a friend here so its cool in that way too. Its a very nice shaver but still, I thought the BB was gonna win hands down.
So the numbers show RFB as an overall winner. I think it is a well deserved win, yet I have to say I've been playing around with SE quite a bit largely so my DE technique has deteriorated. Something I didn't notice before this test. That is to say the last two shaves I went back to a very shallow angle (as in no-signs-of-combing-on-the-lather level of shallow) and it made a huge difference. Much more confortable, the results came closer together and the Deluxe benefited the most from shallow angle.
In conclusion, I would say if you play around with wither you will get very enjoyable shaves. If I have to choose I will pic the BB Deluxe, just because it is such a nice razor and I bet I could improve my technique enough to equal the others. Best thing is we do not always have to choose.
Some illustrative pics. Non of the are recent.

Phylatelic 77 top cap (hopefully you catch its uniqueness)



The Deluxe head as it was set up (shaves 4 and 5)



BB with the Deluxe head on a different handle


PS: If you have never doen this 50/50s I recommend you to give it a try. I learned a lot from the exercise, from lather hydration (it took me a while to switch top cap and blade and that happened 3 times per shave) to the more realistic comparison between razors.

 

[rabidus]

Here are my results.
Short answer and not numbers based: its a tie.
Now some numbers I ran based on Copierguy's table. First a couple of caveats: a. I cheated and did not stop at 3. I did two more 50/50 shaves (not enough time for the third one) but changed a bit things using a different Deluxe. b. for the first round I used the same top cap for both razors (kind of tedious btw) since the top cap of the RFB is ... well ... a head a stamp collector would like having and that I enjoy, but not very good for the test (you'll see what am talking about).
Method wise I used a well seasoned blade, same for all passes and shaves. I believe I used different brushes and soaps in all 5 runs, all face lathered and am a three-pass-plus-touchups shaver. I evaluated the quality of the shave running my fingers all around in between passes using more water than I normally do, then when applying ASB, and finally I used Myrsol Emulsion as preshave to check for differences in growth. BTW, I think the former evaluation method is non conclusive but does shows some differences between razors. I came to the same conclusion with the later two results-based evaluation methods.

Table
View attachment 641445


Up front I honestly thought the BB Deluxe was gonna win. It feels so great and I like its looks. Its a charming razor. The No.77 I have is not in very good shape, but I like it very much and was basically PIFed by a friend here so its cool in that way too. Its a very nice shaver but still, I thought the BB was gonna win hands down.
So the numbers show RFB as an overall winner. I think it is a well deserved win, yet I have to say I've been playing around with SE quite a bit largely so my DE technique has deteriorated. Something I didn't notice before this test. That is to say the last two shaves I went back to a very shallow angle (as in no-signs-of-combing-on-the-lather level of shallow) and it made a huge difference. Much more confortable, the results came closer together and the Deluxe benefited the most from shallow angle.
In conclusion, I would say if you play around with wither you will get very enjoyable shaves. If I have to choose I will pic the BB Deluxe, just because it is such a nice razor and I bet I could improve my technique enough to equal the others. Best thing is we do not always have to choose.
Some illustrative pics. Non of the are recent.

Phylatelic 77 top cap (hopefully you catch its uniqueness)
View attachment 641446


The Deluxe head as it was set up (shaves 4 and 5)
View attachment 641447


BB with the Deluxe head on a different handle
View attachment 641449

PS: If you have never doen this 50/50s I recommend you to give it a try. I learned a lot from the exercise, from lather hydration (it took me a while to switch top cap and blade and that happened 3 times per shave) to the more realistic comparison between razors.

If you were using the Deluxe cap on the RFB, then you were ultimately using two Deluxe razors. The power is in the cap. The caps on those two razors are different.

 

[kingfisher]

Well, it's March. Is somebody gonna tally up the votes and tell us who won?

 

[lloydrm]

If you were using the Deluxe cap on the RFB, then you were ultimately using two Deluxe razors. The power is in the cap. The caps on those two razors are different.

I kind of wanted to use the same cap to see that for myself. I wish I had another N.77 top cap to a. visually compare them and b. make another run
But you seem pretty sure about what you are saying. You mind educating me/us?

 

[BigJ]

Really enjoyable thread! Thanks!

 

[imatabor]

The score:

Round one
RFB: 7
NEW Deluxe: 6
Tie: 1

Round Two
RFB: 7
NEW Deluxe:2
Tie: 5

Round Three
RFB: 4
NEW Deluxe:5
Tie: 3

The winner in a 2-3 decision is the British Raised Flat Bottom!

 

[Graydog]

Nice Match

 

[rabidus]

I kind of wanted to use the same cap to see that for myself. I wish I had another N.77 top cap to a. visually compare them and b. make another run
But you seem pretty sure about what you are saying. You mind educating me/us?

The RFB has a blade gap of .018" while the Deluxe has a blade gap of .023". Any cap that I put on the RFB baseplate raised its blade gap, and changed its performance.

 

[Useless shaver]

Wow... it wasn't that clear, was it?

Congrats to the players!

And congrats to John! If Deluxe followers don't mind...

 

[lloydrm]

The RFB has a blade gap of .018" while the Deluxe has a blade gap of .023". Any cap that I put on the RFB baseplate raised its blade gap, and changed its performance.

Interesting. Now am curious about how that feels. Thanks for sharing.
Maybe I can interest you in running a similar test using the same top cap to see if you find any differences between baseplates
Now I need three piece RFB head ...

 

[rabidus]

Interesting. Now am curious about how that feels. Thanks for sharing.
Maybe I can interest you in running a similar test using the same top cap to see if you find any differences between baseplates
Now I need three piece RFB head ...

I've tested many cap/baseplate combinations. My favorite combo for well over a year was the RFB baseplate and prewar Tech cap or the US NEW LC baseplate and prewar Tech cap. Both were smooth and efficient with the LC being a little more efficient than the RFB.

These days I use NEW SC that has squared off corner tabs on the cap as shown in the top picture. To me it shaves exactly like the Deluxe. The second SC in the picture came with the same exact cap as my Deluxe. All 3 shaves exactly the same, blades last longer in the SC. Other SCs I have are milder.

 

[Useless shaver]

Interesting. Thanls!

 

[nuclearblast]

So, the RFB won, huh?

OK ...

Spoiler

 

[rabidus]

So, the RFB won, huh?

OK ...

Spoiler

 

[TADIII]

So, the RFB won, huh?

OK ...

Winner? I guess if you are not confident in your technique or prep, smoothness might be important, but if whisker reduction and extending the length of time between shaves is more important, and you read all of these analyses, you might choose the Deluxe.



Tom

 

[imatabor]

winner?

Feeling a little sour?