Here we go again, why are we paying ATT 200$ and get 303 steel ?

I have just read this

I don't understnad
316L is way better than 303, right?! (steel types), and if Above the Tie was a cheap razor I could understand
But hack, their razors are propably one of themost expenisve out there today (along with some others)

So why are they using the 303 steel?! it isn't like the 316 is 10x times more or something, I am sure they could have use the 316L and even sell for the same price (or maybe a dollar more or a like) so?!

you pay like ~75$ only for a base!!! (amazing high, not?!) I would expect it to be 316L (and maybe even to have the option in the same price to have it coated like PVD and such)

Wish the owners of ATT could once and for all put a nice answer why they have chosen the 303 steel, and why aren't they offering their razors in 316L (maybe even giving the costumers the option to choose this or that)

Because they're flying off the shelves with the current scope and budget?

Would a 316L steel razor last 250 years instead of the 200 or so that you'll likely get out of the 303 steel one. I'll be long dead begore my ATT razor fails me so I guess what's the point. Plus, how much harder would the 316L steel be to machine over the 303 steel. I have no idea what other factors are involved. Maybe shoot Stan at ATT an email and ask him why he choose 303 over the other steels available.

What are the properties of 316L that you think will make it a better product?

I believe it's more to do with what the market is willing to pay.

It's a relatively niche product that has built a good brand image.

I believe growing options may displace some of that success or perhaps force ATT to use the higher grade steel.

Whether it'll last longer or not is not really the question to my mind...It's more why not use the higher grade since the product is one of the most premium priced products on the market?

Their customer service also leaves a lot to be desired. I sent an email over a month ago and no reply!...Hardly a premium experience!

ead said:

I have just read this

I don't understnad
316L is way better than 303, right?! (steel types),

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A general statement that 316L SAE is "better" than another grade is not accurate. I would argue that using 316L stainless for a safety razor is more of a marketing ploy than an indicator of quality or durability because of the perception that its better. It is just a razor after all. If you could explain in detail why exactly you would require a razor made of SAE 316L stainless rather than one of the many other grades I might be able to answer your question.

Quite often a machinist will use 316L because the local metal supplier has a better price on 316L than other grades of stainless. Machine shops tend to use local suppliers for steel due to transport costs, so if the local shop has it, that's what you buy and use.

Of course you could also purchase a razor made of brass, aluminum, titanium, or plastic, not to mention many other materials. I have to admit to being a bit confused as to why anyone would question the use of various grades of stainless steel for something as simple as a safety razor? Its sort of like arguing that a 100 kiloton thermonuclear warhead is "better" at destroying a 40 acre pasture than a 50 kiloton thermonuclear warhead. The only rational response of course is....who cares?

snowman said:

A general statement that 316L SAE is "better" than another grade is not accurate.

Machine shops tend to use local suppliers for steel due to transport costs, so if the local shop has it, that's what you buy and use.

The only rational response of course is....who cares?

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I agree with all of the above 3 statements completely. As a machinist and engineer I must say it doesn't matter one bit, 303 is a perfectly acceptable choice for this application. If you want to really go overboard you could make it from 420SS and through harden it then give a mirror polish. It would be way "better" then! But.... why?

I own a commercial metal finishing business. We often have to fabricate custom hangers from stainless for various jobs that come through the door. I've had some 420 laying in the stock room for about 8 years. No one wants to use it up, not even for g-jobs. It chews all of the tooling up and if you back off for even a second it becomes work hardened so quickly it becomes almost impossible to work with. Very frustrating. Hmm...maybe I could see if ATT will trade me some razors for 420 stock.

Economic reasons.....

Caveat emptor and economic choice. If you don't like the price or product performance or specs, pass on it. If someone does like then, they'll buy. Capitalistic choice.

What's wrong with 303 stainless steel? It's a beautiful and marvelous razor that functions just as it should as a shaving tool.

I'm afraid I can't understand your mindset ead. This is the product they produce. If you don't like it, don't buy it.

If you don't think it's worth the money, keep stepping.

If you really want to know why 303 was their alloy of choice, instead of just casting shade on a really wonderful razor, why don't you email Stan and ask him?

jcs266 said:

What's wrong with 303 stainless steel? It's a beautiful and marvelous razor that functions just as it should as a shaving tool.

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I'm with you I love my ATT and am not very concerned over the SS grade used.
Nor really sure what the OP's problem is,
as others have suggested "higher" grades of SS don't guarantee a better shave,
or a significantly longer life for the razor.
I suspect that the 303 is easier to machine to tolerance than harder grades.
Regardless....I liked the razor, I bought the razor, and I have been happy with the razor.
If the OP thinks 303 isn't up to his standards by all means purchase a different razor,
maybe made of unobtainium.

Thanks,
Curt

It is the free machining modification of the basic 18% chromium / 8% nickel stainless steel. Alloy 303 was specially designed to exhibit improved machinability while maintaining good mechanical and corrosion resistant properties Due to the presence of sulfur in the steel composition, Alloy 303 is the most readily machineable austenitic stainless steel

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Alloy 303 is frequently used in applications that require parts to be heavily machined. Some examples include:

• Nuts and bolts
• Aircraft fittings
• Gears
• Screws
• Shafts
• Electrical switchgear components
• Bushings

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Mechanical Properties:

Grade	Tensile Strength ksi (min.)	Yield Strength 0.2% Offset ksi (min.)	Elongation - % in 50 mm (min.)	Hardness (Brinell) MAX	Hardness (Rockwell B) MAX
303	75	30	35	228

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More than adequate for a razor, and the best choice for ease of machining.




.

He was nuts over 316, now he wants 316L, next week he'll want 17-4 PH.

This is the good stuff, but it's just not necessary for a razor.

2507 is a super duplex stainless steel designed for demanding applications, such as chemical processing, petrochemical plants, and seawater equipment, which require exceptional strength and corrosion resistance. The product has excellent resistance to chloride stress, corrosion, and high thermal conductivity, with a low coefficient of thermal expansion. The high chromium, molybdenum, and nitrogen levels provide excellent resistance to pitting, crevice, and general corrosion. The impact strength is also high, and weldability is good. Features of this material include good resistance to uniform pitting, and crevice corrosion, heat resistance to stress-corrosion cracking and corrosion fatigue, high mechanical strength, good abrasion and erosion resistance and good weldability.

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Or go really overboard!

L605 is a cobalt-chromium-tungston-nickel alloy. It has good formability, high strength to 1500°F (816°C), and good oxidation resistance to 2000°F (1093°C). The material also has good sulfidation resistance and resistance to wear and galling. Alloy L605 is used in the hot sections of aircraft and land based gas turbines in combustor liners and other applications requiring moderate strength and good oxidation resistance at high temperatures. It can also be used in industrial furnace applications such as muffles and liners in high temperature kilns.

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If corrosion resistance is what he's after...

Alloy C-276 nickel is one of the most universally corrosion resistant meterials available today. The high molybdenum content imparts resistance to localized corrosion such as pitting. Low carbon minimizes carbide precipitation during welding, so the material maintains resistance to inter-granular attack in heat-affected zones of welded joints.

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I could do this all night!

Type 600 is a nickel-chromium alloy that provides excellent resistance to oxidation at high temperatures. It is also commonly used as a corrosion-resistant alloy due to its resistance to a wide range of acids and alkalis. Features of this material include excellent resistance to nitrogen, hydrogen and carburization and superior oxidation resistance at high temperatures.

Common Applications of Alloy 600 Nickel

• Nuclear power plants
• Heat exchangers
• Industrial chemical evaporators
• Industrial acid and alkali equipments
• Heat treatment furnace parts
• Afterburner parts and other components used at high temperatures
• Vacuum furnace fixtures
• Chemical & food processing equipment
• Paper mill & alkaline digesters
• Vinyl chloride monomer production
• Thermo couple sheathing in aggressive atmospheres
• Catalyst regenerators in petrochemical production

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TobyC said:

He was nuts over 316, now he wants 316L, next week he'll want 17-4 PH.

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http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showth...ongoose-Stainless-Steel-SE-made-of?highlight=