Show Us Your AR Pistols

[nortac]

I agree the whole NFA registry is completely ridiculous, but I'm happy to see clarity from the ATF, even though I'm not sure they've ever actually achieved it on anything . Acting on the edge of their interpretations is a recipe for a ruined life, at the whim of some judge. If you end up on the wrong side of that you end up a felon, very likely bankrupt, and never able to own a firearm for the rest of your life. For myself, I would be immediately fired from my job just for being charged with a felony, let alone convicted. So I'm steering clear of anything even remotely close the lines, which means suck it up and just play by the rules and get the tax stamp. Honestly, I think the stubbie pistol stocks (even without the blade thing or a strap) are too close to the edge, and at the mercy of an errant court ruling.

+1. I to cannot see the appeal of an AR pistol, particularly in .223. An SBR carbine in a pistol caliber would be very cool OTOH. I shot a CAR 45 once, difficult to control the muzzle rise on full auto, but easy to keep em all in the black on a B 27 target with 3 round bursts. A hoot to shoot with OPA (other peoples' ammo!)

 

[jkingrph]

The point of AR pistols is incredibly simple. You can make a carbine SBR without an NFA stamp, that's the entire point. They're not supposed to replace handguns.

ETA they're kind of stupid now anyways, since you can no longer legally shoulder them with a sig brace on. Idiots couldn't leave well enough alone and had to send in a bunch of clarification requests to the ATF.

A SBR is defined as having a barrel less than 16" or overall length less than 26". Anything meeting those specs "must" have a tax stamp. You can have a short barrel, with a permanently attached, ie, pinned and welded muzzle brake or flash hider that makes the barrel exceed 16" and avoid the tax stamp requirement. Personally I would rather have the extra barrel length.

 

[jamesspo]

A SBR is defined as having a barrel less than 16" or overall length less than 26". Anything meeting those specs "must" have a tax stamp. You can have a short barrel, with a permanently attached, ie, pinned and welded muzzle brake or flash hider that makes the barrel exceed 16" and avoid the tax stamp requirement. Personally I would rather have the extra barrel length.

Well, but that's where it gets murky. All handguns fit the definition of <16" Barrel and <26" overall length, but they aren't SBRs. What's different is whether it's shoulderable ( I know, not a word ), and that's something that's a bit hard to define. It's when the overall length starts to get longer than most pistols, and the butt end starts to be something that you *could* shoulder that the ambiguity comes into play. These AR pistols fit right in that zone.

 

[Clausewitz]

A SBR is defined as having a barrel less than 16" or overall length less than 26". Anything meeting those specs "must" have a tax stamp. You can have a short barrel, with a permanently attached, ie, pinned and welded muzzle brake or flash hider that makes the barrel exceed 16" and avoid the tax stamp requirement. Personally I would rather have the extra barrel length.

If you're going to throw around chapter and verse you should at least know the chapter and verse. There's more to it than the length of the barrel.

 

[dreadpirate]

Those are mostly SBR-cheater "wrist strap" non-stocks.

And that's exactly why I got interested; a buffer tube AR pistol is not nearly as good as a "stabilizing" brace. SBR-cheater, but legal.

 

[dreadpirate]

+1. I to cannot see the appeal of an AR pistol, particularly in .223. ...

I don't know - one reason for 223/5.56 is to have a caliber that is in-between a pistol and a rifle caliber (like 308). 223 is perfect for that. If I get a 45 or 9mm, then I would get a conventional pistol like a Glock.

It is my intent to SBR this; but ATF has ruled on this device (Shockwave Blade) as being legal (so long as it is not modified) for a pistol build.

 

[dreadpirate]

I suspect the AR pistols are blasty indeed.

Those are mostly SBR-cheater "wrist strap" non-stocks.

Agree @jamesspo Have you seen a Marlin Camp Carbine in .45 ACP? a handy thing.


AA

Those are cool - same can be said for an M1 Carbine (and their clones) which is essentially a pistol round. [EDIT - ok - not quite true when I said I would only get a conventional pistol for a pistol caliber]

 

[Acmemfg]

Rifle..pistol.
Never could see the need to muddy the waters with the gimmicks and all. But then to each his/her own

 

[Ad Astra]

Beauty shots, Acme.

But seeing that M-1 Carbine above it reminded me that the Ruger Blackhawk in .30 Carbine would be a neat thing ... but so, too, would be that same pistol in the new .327 Mag.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.327_Federal_Magnum

Eight shots, too.

http://www.ruger.com/pdf/specs/327-NMBHawk.pdf

But if Santa wants to bring an AR pistol, I'd be glad to unwrap it.

They do make them in .300 Blackout; another carbine crossover.


AA

 

[Sergio721]

My 10.5" 9mm Quarter Circle 10 SBR.
Uses the same magazines as my Glock, much quieter than my 5.56 especially when using 147grn ammo. When suppressed makes for a great home defense carbine.

 

[jamesspo]

My 10.5" 9mm Quarter Circle 10 SBR.
Uses the same magazines as my Glock, much quieter than my 5.56 especially when using 147grn ammo. When suppressed makes for a great home defense carbine.

Nice! That's where I'm headed, but in .45 and suppressed. Big hole, easy to move around with, rifle shootability, small noise, subsonic velocities (with heavy bullets). Perfect!

 

[Ad Astra]

Nicely done [MENTION=113395]Sergio721[/MENTION]; well thought-out carbine!


AA now I need one just like that, and i still don't have a 10/22 yet

 

[OkieStubble]

Nice! That's where I'm headed, but in .45 and suppressed. Big hole, easy to move around with, rifle shootability, small noise, subsonic velocities (with heavy bullets). Perfect!

I would take a shortcut and get a Glock threaded barrel and just do a Roni conversion kit.

 

[OkieStubble]

Nicely done @Sergio721; well thought-out carbine!


AA now I need one just like that, and i still don't have a 10/22 yet

That is really sweet!

 

[jamesspo]

I would take a shortcut and get a Glock threaded barrel and just do a Roni conversion kit.

View attachment 707633

Interesting. So is that considered an SBR, or just a pistol with a carbine shaped holder around it?

 

[OkieStubble]

Interesting. So is that considered an SBR, or just a pistol with a carbine shaped holder around it?

Just a pistol with a carbine shaped holder. But if you put your bang muzzle on the threaded end, it will lengthen your velocity tube.

That's a bunch of gun slang in an attempt to make me look cool...

A 10.5 SBR and many named brand suppressor's, will still have around a 16" carbine length together. While a shorter pistol length barrel will be a bit harder on a suppressor, the overall length with an added suppressor will be quite compact.

 

[jamesspo]

Just a pistol with a carbine shaped holder. But if you put your bang muzzle on the threaded end, it will lengthen your velocity tube.

That's a bunch of gun slang in an attempt to make me look cool...

A 10.5 SBR and many named brand suppressor's, will still have around a 16" carbine length together. While a shorter pistol length barrel will be a bit harder on a suppressor, the overall length with an added suppressor will be quite compact.

I'm actually looking at 6.5" uppers..with silencer should be pretty compact. Didn't think about it being hard on the can, but makes sense. I don't figure I'll be firing it all that much. Is that mostly just a cleaning statement, or do the baffles or tube actually break?

 

[OkieStubble]

I'm actually looking at 6.5" uppers..with silencer should be pretty compact. Didn't think about it being hard on the can, but makes sense. I don't figure I'll be firing it all that much. Is that mostly just a cleaning statement, or do the baffles or tube actually break?

I'm sure, since you are intending to use handgun ammo with a 6.5, your suppressor will be just fine in the long term. However, when it comes to the higher velocities of rifle rounds, suppressors very design decreases vertical recoil and bullet velocity, hence the benefits of noise reduction.

but rifle barrel designs, that are thicker but shorter, actually increase vertical recoil and maintains velocities. While this is all subjective and up for debate, I think at least with short barreled SBR's, these two opposite design factors of barrel vs. suppresor, along with more unburned powder and the increased energies from opposite types of recoil from the muzzle blast leaving the barrel and entering the suppressor, works against and causes alot of negative forces against not only the male and female threads on the barrel and the suppressor, but also against the baffles, seams and walls of the suppressor.

Again, you are using handgun ammo from a 6.5 barrel and not all suppressor brands are built alike, just as peoples opinions.

This is just my opinion.










[FONT=&amp]Suppressor decreases vertical recoil but increases bullet spread, and decreases bullet velocity (whether or not it affects damage is unconfirmed to my knowledge, it's all speculative as far as I've seen).[/FONT]

[FONT=&amp]Heavy Barrel increases vertical recoil, decreases spread, and maintains same velocity.[/FONT]

 

[OkieStubble]

I also personally know at least two people who build their own form 1 suppressors because of this very reason, but they build them to exceed most retail manufactures specifications.

 

[dreadpirate]

I shot the AR pistol today. OBTW the rear sight was on backwards as pictured, whoops! Anyways, the KAK flash can gives it more kick as it directs the blast forward. I did not notice any flash but I sure it was there. I was surprised at how well the weapon fired from the cheek; it was actually very comfortable. Even so, I agree with others this would be better as a real SBR. I am still waiting on ATF to approve my Form 4 for a silencer and an SBR request for a Ruger 22 Charger (applied for these last July). I will have to get photo ID and finger printed (everyone on the NFA Trust) though to SBR this one.