Semogue 830 problem!

[eezee]

Dear friends. Today, after long time, I decided again to use shaving cream. My choice was russian Everest, which is not super quality cream, but suitable for shaving.
After soaking in a very hot water and wet brush lathering in metallic cup I start first pass. In that time, brush was in cup. After 4-5 minutes, I started to lather my face for second pass, but result was as usual. As u check in photos, center of brush was dry with no lather. This situtation usual for second and following passes. So, u can see what I wanted to explain in my previous posts in this thread.
By the way, for better breaking-in I did palm lathering with Arko and put my brush hairs up with good amount lather to wait till tomorrow evening. Hope, that will help a little bit

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From the looks of the lather you have too much water, not enough product, or a combination of the two. Try using the 830 as a bowl lather tool until you get it dialed in better.

 

[kansaskyle]

Hope this helps someone.

Thanks Cerbul13!

I've been using the Marco Method™ with all my soaps and brushes, and I was curious about how much pressure I was supposed to apply. I wasn't sure if I was supposed to try and keep as much water in the brush as possible, or apply more pressure to load more product. I tried your approach this afternoon, and whipped up some great lather!

 

[JohnG10]

Personally, I think the Marco method prone to getting too much water / not enough soap --- and very airy lather that disappears fast if you whip it until it looks right.

I think the key to getting the Marco method to work right is holding the soap sideways so the too wet proto lather fall into the sink - and loading much longer than normal so that you get enough soap. The longer loading is needed to let the excess water flow out of the brush and to get the watery lather out too so that you can start loading actual soap

I prefer to use the classic method: wet the top of the puck with a teaspoon of hot water, let it sit for a minute or two to soften, and then load with a damp brush. This guarantees the brush loads with soap rather than lather.

 

[Cerbul13]

Thanks Cerbul13!

Really happy to be of help

I learned the hard way that is not only about the method you use, is also about how exactly you do it. Unfortunately is easier to show then to describe the exact details. There are many ways to achieve something, but depending on the situation soap/brush/face-bowl-palm/etc there are solutions that work easier then others, but only if the methodology is correct.
Many users started to give methodology details about what exactly they are doing to achieve something, and the desire to help that drive them to make detailed posts should definitely be appreciated. Every detail helps.

 

[JeffJ]

Will you believe me if I tell you that I have the exact same issue with a badger silvertip brush?
From the pictures, I notice you get the exact same consistency in your lather as me. Why?
The answer sounds simple but believe me is more complicated then I wanted to believe.
The "simple answer" is "not enough soap".
The complicated part is this: what you pick up from the puck should be soap, not lather, and I will explain you why.
Regardless of the method used, you need to soak the puck in hot water for at least 1 minute.
When you start loading, you need to do something really hard to explain. You need to not gently touch the top of the puck with your brush, instead, you need to "enter into it" with a bit of pressure, and when you feel like your brush is showing some resistance to your swirls, that is the moment when you need to keep that pressure on the brush and keep swirling until you have loaded a pasty stuff, not bubbly on your brush. If you simply gently brush it, or if you use too much speed, you will start getting bubbly lather, that will prevent you from taking actual soap into your brush. You will end up with tons of "lather" instead of "soap" loaded into your brush, that will not hold at all until next pass. Even more critical, you will be tempted to add more water since you think "I added enough soap", and the lather will almost instantly break. One additional trick is to help you pick up actual soap instead of "made on the puck lather" is to remove all the bubbly stuff when loading or simply letting it drop into the sink. Once you got enough actual soap loaded into the brush, then you can add a very small amount of water into the knot, so that it helps releasing the lather easier. One other trick that I simply had to do with my badger brush to help the tips pick up soap instead of lather, was to not use the shake method, instead I gently squeeze the brush, so that some water remains inside the knot, instead of having the tips wet and the inside knot dry.
The "find the correct brush pressure to pick up soap and keep at it" is also important to Marco Method.
There is a bad habit about this method, and that is that people think that they have to use the water from the brush to make lather. Wrong. The huge amount of water is used simply to help dig into the soap while swirling, and once you got the correct pressure on the brush that lets you load soap, you load soap into the brush, and not the bubbly stuff that forms on the puck while loading.

The initial concept that drove me to not press at all into the puck and not try to find the correct pressure that allows to really load soap, came to me from the concern of not ruining my brush.. Took me 1 month to fix the issue. With very hard pucks, I also have to use a "3 fingers grip" so that the hair tips get an easier time to dig into the brush, without pushing hard on it. But you DO have to push a bit, even if is a boar brush, especially one that is not broken it, and is not having enough space in middle for soap(will do have once broken in, as it tends to stay more aerated due to the space split tips occupy).

Hope this helps someone.

Looking at the pictures of problem lathers in prior posts, I think you might be on to something here. It looks like way too much water too soon and not enough soap. I have been getting great lather with my 830 for years. If the brush oversoaks it is much harder to properly load the brush. Also, after soaking gently wring out and then give a vigorous shake to get more excess moisture out of the brush before loading. A easy way to load is to load a stick or a loose puck onto your face. Make sure there is a significant visible covering of cheeks, chin and neck with soap *not lather*, start face lathering with a relatively dry brush, adding water gradually by dipping the end of the tips of the brush into water or adding a few drops of water to the brush at a time.

 

[shavier]

Thanx to all. To many suggestions, Im really confused )))))))))
2 days ago I had bubbly lather with arko. Same, not enough

 

[shavier]

Yesterday I got lather for 2 passes. But I dont know, next time result will be same or not?

 

[Rambo]

I have this problem with the Semogue 620 I bought. I can barely get one pass out of the bastard. And I know its not boars because I have an Omega 31064 that produces much better. I'm probably going to end up throwing it at the racoon that is terrorizing my garbage. Either that or the B&S.

 

[Eeyore]

PIF or sell it; there are enough Semogue fans on B&B.

 

[Rambo]

PIF or sell it; there are enough Semogue fans on B&B.

The raccoon is a real jerk though.

 

[Larsson_Power]

The raccoon is a real jerk though.

[emoji23]

 

[Steve_in_CT]

I do not see the big deal about "getting enough lather for x number of passes." I do not think I have ever had enough lather for 3 passes with one loading. Sometimes I have to load for each pass. I think it depends on the brush/soap or cream/water hardness and each persons technique in loading the brush and adding the water.

I agree. I face lather and re-visit the puck as needed without giving it any thought. I do this with badger, boar and mixed brushes. In fact, I don't really give much thought to how wet the brush is, how long I load it, etc. I soak the brush, apply it to the soap/cream, shake it a bit and start lathering. Add soap/cream or water as needed.

 

[numerounoo]

I tried two Semogues, and sold them both. In my 30+ years of wetshaving, I have not yet encountered a brush that was so ill fitting with my lathering technique (I guess) as my two Semogues. It seems like they are not for everyone.

I won't say that they are bad brushes, or that something is wrong with them, because there are also huge fans of the brand. YMMV!

Care to share your lathering technique ?

 

[Eeyore]

Care to share your lathering technique ?

I just face lather. But somehow the Semogues and me don't agree on that. Looks like the lather keeps sitting in the brush instead of spreading on my face.

 

[Limekiln]

I've been using 830 most of the time for the past 8 months and I've never experienced an absence of lather in the center.
The only comment I'd make from the photos earlier is that the lather that is there, on the outside, sure looks mighty thin.
I've no idea why that is, so I can't be of any help, other than to say that 830 lathers fine for me with everything I throw at it (from MdC to Arko stick).

 

[shavier]

Still no change. Good lather for first pass and few amount for second

 

[deruitem]

I had the same issue with my 610. Sold it!

 

[Eeyore]

I had the same issue with my 610. Sold it!

Maybe someone from Semogue should read this thread?

 

[shavier]

I wrote email to semogue with photos. Reply was "everything is ok with brush"
))))))

 

[JeffJ]

YMMV. I have close to a thousand shaves total on three Semogues (1305, 830, 620). Without trying I can face lather three passes with enough left over on the brush for another couple of passes. I've used these brushes all over the country with local water and with dozens of different soaps.

It's painful to watch the struggle on what should be really straightforward.