"Fierce"

Yes, me again!

Yesterday as I reported elsewhere I received these two razors, a 6/8 George Butler and a 5/8 Thomas Ellin Prize:



I declared that they were shave-ready despite not being advertised as such.

And indeed they certainly shave. However, searching for a suitable word, I would describe the experience with them as "fierce" or perhaps "aggressive". As usual when I shave, I used a selection of razors (I am learning!).

Included in yesterday's operation, I had this small Bismarck that I "honed" myself:



And for the final refinements used this Alfred Bentley that I sent away to be honed:



And ended up with a pretty good shave!

My question is how to remove the "fierceness" from the first two without destroying the edge - which I am perfectly capable of doing. Would CrOx paste do the job, or must it be a finishing stone?

Please don't suggest the coticule I have; this is not a success. The Bismarck I treated yesterday according to one of Dr Matt's procedures: kill the edge, restore it on a 8k stone (more tomatoes) and then X-strokes on the coticule under running water. No "stickiness" as promised of course.
Under my 40x loupe, the edge looked like a ploughed field, so I cleaned it up on my 15k Welsh slate using camelia oil and then a pasted strop, canvas, leather. The edge looked much better. This razor is smooth to use now, but of course like all my edges doesn't really cut!!

So I am seeking the smoothness of the Bismarck with the cutting of The Prize or the very fierce George Butler.

As always, thanks in advance

C.

Stropping makes a 'fierce' edge softer but still sharp.

Myself, I prefer "Feather-like' edges. It may take your skin a little while to get used to it but for me, it's the best shave. One-pass that lasts most all day. Give me 'Fierce' edges!

Thanks for the reply.

I have to say I have other razors that ar kinder and shave as well. And the after-shave lotion experience is not quite so "testing" either!!

C.

Cambouis said:

My question is how to remove the "fierceness" from the first two without destroying the edge - which I am perfectly capable of doing. Would CrOx paste do the job, or must it be a finishing stone?

C.

Click to expand...

Try a half dozen very light pressure laps on a clean leather strop with a slight amount of slack, followed by ~50 or so regular stopping laps.

kelbro said:

Stropping makes a 'fierce' edge softer but still sharp.

Myself, I prefer "Feather-like' edges. It may take your skin a little while to get used to it but for me, it's the best shave. One-pass that lasts most all day. Give me 'Fierce' edges!

Click to expand...

Yep! This ^^^

bluesman 7 said:

Try a half dozen very light pressure laps on a clean leather strop with a slight amount of slack, followed by ~50 or so regular stopping laps.

Click to expand...

Thanks, I'll give that a try. I fear I am not as tough as some of you out there!!

C.

OK I shall attempt the stropping techinque on one of the fierce razors and just do normal stropping on the other and see (or rather feel) what happens.

C.

You could try not stropping for a thew shaves see if that takes the bite out the edge.

OK, well I tried the light stropping followed by the normal 50 on George (Butler) and for The Prize I left it alone as Gary has suggested. The results were pretty good I must say. That procedure has certainly blunted George's sting!

A "professionally honed" Puma arrived today; unhoned George and The Prize compared favourably.

Thanks to all.

C.

Hi Cambouis,

I don´t use loupes, I just inspect my edges by naked eye, hanging hair test and test shave.
Don´t know how good your eyes are, but if it´s possible for you can go to dark room with a single light source, a pulp is perfect.
When inspecting the razor there should be no scratch left on the very edge. They start from behind the bevel and most of the time they go through the edge and are hard to see, but still there. With little angle adjusting the are reflecting the light.
By daylight you wouldn´t see them. Also by day light a fine bevel shouldn´t reflect much light, it appears dark when fewing from the side. The cromuim strop will do the job after the finisher, if the blade is refined enough. A sharp razor should feel like it meets no or very little resistance, no pulling.
After washing the face with cold water you shouldn´t feel any beard when touching against the grain. Than the shave is close and the razor is realy sharp.

Greetings

I'm at the point where a razor can never be too sharp. Smooth is another story. Maybe that's what you mean by "fierce," it's not smooth. Very sharp yet causes irritation. As long as the shave is mojo smooth, the edge will begin to calm down after a couple of shaves and stropping. If it's sharp though not smooth you need to figure out what works best for you for smoothing out an edge. I like natural stones for that though it's a Pandora's box for sure.

Hi Royce,

I totally agree, a razor can be sharp and giving a close shave but at the same time causing irritation. I have one of these, and as I figured it out didn´t touch it any more. Also there are the opposite, razors that didn´t take a "lightsaber" edge but are solid shavers that cause no trouble and are very forgiving.

Cambouis said:

A "professionally honed" Puma arrived today; unhoned George and The Prize compared favourably.

Click to expand...

There's no institution handing out credentials to "professionals" in this game. That's probably why you'll see the same (very small number) of names recommended whenever someone is looking for a honer. I browse eBay constantly for hones to add to my collection, and I see a new "professional" honer's listings popping up almost daily. I wish I had room in my saved search to filter them, to be honest. They're that omnipresent (right up there with the "Hone ycomb cell phone cover").

Rubinio said:

Hi Cambouis,

I don´t use loupes, I just inspect my edges by naked eye, hanging hair test and test shave.
Don´t know how good your eyes are, but if it´s possible for you can go to dark room with a single light source, a pulp is perfect.
When inspecting the razor there should be no scratch left on the very edge. They start from behind the bevel and most of the time they go through the edge and are hard to see, but still there. With little angle adjusting the are reflecting the light.
By daylight you wouldn´t see them. Also by day light a fine bevel shouldn´t reflect much light, it appears dark when fewing from the side. The cromuim strop will do the job after the finisher, if the blade is refined enough. A sharp razor should feel like it meets no or very little resistance, no pulling.
After washing the face with cold water you shouldn´t feel any beard when touching against the grain. Than the shave is close and the razor is realy sharp.

Greetings

Click to expand...

I'm afraid I don't have your keen eyesight, though I have a special pair of reading glasses for fine. close up work (repairing pens and also electronics) Yes. I have read about people talking of a "good one-pass shave" Well all I can say is either they don't have my beard or (more likely of course) I don't have their razors!

DudeAbides said:

I'm at the point where a razor can never be too sharp. Smooth is another story. Maybe that's what you mean by "fierce," it's not smooth. Very sharp yet causes irritation. As long as the shave is mojo smooth, the edge will begin to calm down after a couple of shaves and stropping. If it's sharp though not smooth you need to figure out what works best for you for smoothing out an edge. I like natural stones for that though it's a Pandora's box for sure.

Click to expand...

Yes it felt "spikey", but as I have reported some of the suggested techniques appear to have worked. Probably now I shall find that the razors are not sharp enough!!

SliceOfLife said:

There's no institution handing out credentials to "professionals" in this game. That's probably why you'll see the same (very small number) of names recommended whenever someone is looking for a honer. I browse eBay constantly for hones to add to my collection, and I see a new "professional" honer's listings popping up almost daily. I wish I had room in my saved search to filter them, to be honest. They're that omnipresent (right up there with the "Hone ycomb cell phone cover").

Click to expand...

That is why I used the inverted commas!

Cambouis

I said:

have read about people talking of a "good one-pass shave" Well all I can say is either they don't have my beard or (more likely of course) I don't have their razors!

Click to expand...

Yes, beards can be very different from each other. When I began to straight razor shave, some times I testet my razors on my brothers face . His beard is very dense and wiry and I had a hard time to give a close shave. he wasn´t realy convinced shaving with straights at this time.

Greetings

I would think they mean it was good for one pass. As in, you look shaved, but not clean shaved. I know guys who shave daily, dry, with an electric. They never look clean shaved, but so long as they look like they "shaved" at least somewhat, they're happy. I doubt anyone has a beard that you can't see after a WTG pass, unless their hair is the same color as their skin.