I've used Williams and VDH with Proraso and had excellent results. However my best superlather has been with Nivea liquid body wash/shave lotion and Proraso Red. I put a small squirt in my bowl, a generous squeeze of Proraso Red and lather away. The liquid body soap makes the lather super slippery and adds an extra something that's hard to describe. I don't to it all the time, and I honestly don't know why. It doesn't really take any longer. I guess I feel like I'm cheating somehow....