Wanted - Cursive Italic < $100

[Thirston]

The first fountain pens I purchased (only a week or so ago) were fine nibs. They are great pens (Pilot CH92, Lamy Safari, Pelikan 215) and the fine nibs are perfect for my typical smallish handwriting.

I received a Noodlers Ahab today. Purchased because I love the look of the variation in the line. Perhaps a vintage "flex" will wind up in my stash at some point but I think I'll get more day to day use from an Italic of some sort. I'd like to work on my Spencerian and play with some Italic styles. The Ahab will drive me to drink if I need to rely on it as a proper pen. It's really a toy in my opinion.

I'd like to find a pen with a decent Italic or Cursive Italic (whichever might be best suited) nib that will work right out of the box. Let's say around the $100 mark. Less expensive is fine.

• I would be fine with another Lamy if their Italics are worth a hoot. My Safari writes very well and feels fine in my hand. Perhaps I should grab another Safari with a 1.1 or 1.5?
• Inexpensive choices might be ok if they're built to last. Osmiroid, Pelikan Script, Pilot Plumix etc... I don't know squat about them.
• TWSBI 540s/580s come in italic don't they? I know there are varying opinions on their quality but perhaps they're worth researching?
• Vintage is fine but I don't know enough about them to make an educated decision on my own. Parker, Esterbrook, Sheaffer... I wouldn't know where to start.
• I don't want to Eyedropper, but I would like to use a converter or be able to syringe cartridges.
• No. I don't want a dip pen. I'd like a FP.
• I'm not going for fancy Calligraphy, just a nice crisp Italic look or some variance in line thickness for cursive styles or my typical ALL CAPS print.

I know there's no right or wrong here and it will likely take some trial and error. Bring on the opinions And thank you all in advance for your time helping me with this.

 

[Kevan]

Italix Parsons Essential from Mr. Pen. Real cursive Italic nib options, an incredible value. VERRRRRY smooth nib, heavy pen, but pretty pen.

http://mrpen.co.uk/contents/en-uk/d184.html

Cursive italics are different than stubs (which are often called "italics" interchangeably), which you're talking about in your post. Similar, but different. Franklin-Christoph sells cursive italic nibs ground by Mike Masuyama, but with an F-C Pen you're looking at $160-$200. I have one, they're awesome, but Mr. Pen is a good alternative. I got my dad an Italix a few years ago and got him the medium CI nib. If I was to get one myself, I'd get a fine. .85mm is a good width for a CI nib. Most stubs are 1.1 or above. Those with small handwriting (like myself, and you, it sounds like) are better sticking with a 1.1 because a 1.5 will look huge in comparison.

Yes, Mr. Pen is in England, but you're getting one hell of a pen for the price.

If you just want a stub to start out, yes you can try the Lamy Safari nib units (Safaris have interchangeable nibs I thought...so it should only cost you $13 or so for the nib, not a whole new pen), or find a Pilot 78G in Broad, which is actually a .9mm stub (and $10-$12).

Stubs have more rounded edges on the nib tip than cursive italics. "Crisp" -- or "Formal" -- italics have sharper edges still. A cursive italic will have a crisper effect on the letters than a stub, a formal italic will be crisper than a cursive, but more likely to tear into the paper, thus more demanding to use.

Cursive Italics are relatively easy to write with. They just have a smaller sweet spot than stubs, but they're still really smooth when you hit that sweet spot.

And yes, the Ahab is a *** (well, 50% of them are, anyway). At the risk of incurring Mr. Tardiff's wrath, and having the horde of Noodlers fans come out of the woodwork and explain to me that you're not SUPPOSED to expect it to be perfect out of the box, it's meant to be meddled with and customized, and you're SUPPOSED to set the inkflow to your liking, etc. etc. Translation: It's a ***, but we're supposed to like it because it's a $20 flex pen! Yay!

Addressing the rest of your points: My dad has a TWSBI (but it's one of the old 540's) and the 1.1 stub on it is great. The Pelikan Script pen is good...when you can get it to write. The nib dries out very easily, or at least mine did, anyway. I've never tried a Plumix but I've meant to for quite awhile now. Yeah, best not to mess with eyedropper pens. I know they have their fans, but it's like writing with a ticking timebomb. You never know when it will just burp a blob of ink out.

Check out the Italix Parsons Essential. I think you'll be pleased. And "italic" on their nib options means cursive italic. The Fine Italic would be my recommendation.

 

[Jawaburger]

Maybe not what you're looking for, but I have several Rotring Art Pens in various nibs. They cost about $25. I have two that I have had for over 20 years, and I have added a few more since. I have them in F, M, 1.1 and two 1.5 (different inks in each). They sell converters for them for under $10. I bring this up because you could get several sized nibs for what you are looking to spend. The sell them on Amazon and Jet Pens. Might be worth a shot just to play around with the wider nibs and not break the bank if you don't like the italics.

 

[Thirston]

Kevan,
Thank you for an awesome reply to my inquiry. I think my first step should be to track down some writing samples that represent a style I would like to learn. I need to make sure I get the appropriate nib be it Italic, Stub, Cursive Italic, etc...

 

[mikeschu]

It's rare, but you might be able to find a Pelikan M200 series with their Italic (I) nib for around $100. I think Fountain Pen Hospital in NYC had them on their site for a long time.

TWSBI doesn't make Italic nibs; they are all stub nibs. Nemosine makes 0.6 and 0.8mm nibs, but I thought they had the tactile feel of the edge of a spoon.

The Pilot 78G (broad only) or the Plumix are good and inexpensive options. I like the Plumix nib placed in the body of a Metropolitan.

You may want to go vintage. You can try to pick up an Esterbrook with a stub nib, or a Sheaffer school pen with one of the italic nibs.

 

[musicman1951]

Kevan,
Thank you for an awesome reply to my inquiry. I think my first step should be to track down some writing samples that represent a style I would like to learn. I need to make sure I get the appropriate nib be it Italic, Stub, Cursive Italic, etc...

You may find the nib pages here helpful: http://richardspens.com/

 

[Thirston]

If you just want a stub to start out, yes you can try the Lamy Safari nib units (Safaris have interchangeable nibs I thought...so it should only cost you $13 or so for the nib, not a whole new pen), or find a Pilot 78G in Broad, which is actually a .9mm stub (and $10-$12).

Hmmmm.... Or I could just buy a whole new pen for about $10 more . It looks like the new nibs are roughly $13-$15 after shipping. A new Safari isn't much more. Can I even buy a New Safari with an Italic Nib or do they only come with the standard F-M-B?

 

[nemo]

Buy a new broad nib for the M215 and send it out for customization.

 

[Ronnie Aloha]

Pen Boutique has an M200 with italic nib for $89 with free shipping.

 

[danek]

There are quite a few fans of www.GouletPens.com on here and I am one of them. Brian Goulet has a TON of helpful videos on his site and you'd be very hard pressed to not learn something from them.

He sells replacement nibs for Lamy along with their pens. Swapping nibs is easy and quite a bit cheaper than buying a whole pen just to try a 1.5 versus 1.1, 1.9 and so on.

Personally, I'm not a Lamy fan, I find their triangular grip section difficult and distracting.

However, I'm a huge fan of his replacement #6 nibs. They fit in any pens that use that size and there are many. From A $10 Jinhao, $60 Monteverde, $140 Edison, and even your Ahab.

For $15 you could try out a 1.1 or 1.5 stub in your Ahab, or buy any number of pens for $50 or less that do come with their own stub and still switch between stubs, fine to broad for different effects.

For tinkerers: While I am not a fan of the Ahab, I AM a fan of Noodler's Acrylic Konrad; the colors are brilliant. I can't seem to master the flex nib, so before I even start with the new Konrad, I disassemble, flush, replace the nib, heat set it and have been remarkably impressed every time.

-- I am in no way affiliated with the Goulets' or their site. --

 

[Thirston]

The Goulet's have already mailed me two care packages in the last few weeks. I will use them when I can. Unfortunately there are some items that just don't make sense to buy even within our country. I have sourced a few things from overseas but have used Goulet Pen when it made sense financially.

 

[Kevan]

More resources...this page shows you writing samples of the different nibs. Note the difference between stubs and cursive italics: http://www.nibs.com/Fountain-Pen-Nib-Customizations.htm

I've bought from the Goulets pretty much since they started as a business...before he sold pens and only offered paper and like 2 brands of ink. I even have a wax seal handle that he made back in the day when he still had time to do woodworking, and it's still the only handle I use for wax seals. So It's fair to say that I love that place, even if I have to pay sales tax as a Virginia resident (one of the reasons I wish they had a free shipping offer). It's awesome how far they've come.

The only times I don't use them are when I want an ink they don't sell, or if there's a pen I want that's cheaper on Ebay (like many Pilots, for example, which I get from Japan). And since I've become more of a Japanese paper fan, Jetpens is getting more of my business these days too.

At any rate, you have a lot of options, Thirston. I don't necessarily think you have to start with a stub to enjoy italics, but it's certainly the cheaper way to go. I forgot about Goulet's nibs that Dane noted above...they fit your Ahab and you could try it out that way. Or you could send a broad nib out to a Nibmeister, like Nemo suggested. Pendemonium is the cheapest option if you go that route. Or there's always the Pelikan for $89 Ronnie noted, too.

I love my Franklin Christoph .8mm "Medium" CI nib. The only thing that makes it more difficult to write with than a stub is the smaller sweet spot. But if I got another, it would definitely be an Italix Parsons Essential, especially now since they've got more colors. When I bought the one for my dad, the only color option was black.

You can always get more stubs, as they are freely available. You probably only need one CI nib to be happy.

Here's a Video on the Italix by Stephen Brown: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7skrabcAlw

 

[jzuzphreek]

Why hasn't anyone mentioned the Franklin-Cristoph Model 27? This is the model they use for the B&B Essential which is currently sold out. The basic pen without the B&B customizations though, runs $69.50 with 1.1 or 1.5 stub nibs available at no additional cost. However, you could upgrade to a Masuyama customized 1.1 or 1.5 italic for $15 more. For the B&B Essential, the Masuyama customized nibs are available at no additional cost.

The Model 27 (or Collegia as it's also called), is a pretty good pen. It's a bit heavy, and is much better when writing unposted than posted, but I use this pen in my daily writing (note taking, doodling, etc) with no issues.

Stock Pen - http://www.franklin-christoph.com/model-27-collegia.html
B&B Essential - http://www.franklin-christoph.com/badger-and-blade.html

 

[strop]

Buy a new broad nib for the M215 and send it out for customization.

I don't think you can do any better than this!

 

[Kevan]

I don't think you can do any better than this!

Uh, he can. The aforementioned Italix Parson's Essential from Mr. Pen (which is a custom nib since Mr. Ford, the shop owner, grinds the italic nibs himself). $66 including shipping for a complete pen.

The aforementioned Franklin-Christoph 27 is $84.50 with a Masuyama nib.

A Pelikan M215 nib is around $65, plus the $20 or $30 for custom grind depending on where you send it, plus postage. That makes it the most expensive option.

 

[nemo]

I seem to find new M200 nibs for $30 and got one off the BST for half that. Just sayin'

Again, things have gone up recently. One thing to keep in mind is that when you order an italic nib Essential from MrPen, the tipping has been ground off. Or so I've been told, that's why I haven't bought one. That's a deal breaker for me and probably why I'm not in love with my double broad 78G or Lamy italic. Straight steel on the paper.

I think the cheapest route would be to buy the italic nib for your Lamy and see if you like that. If your handwriting is small you may not even enjoy using it.

 

[Kevan]

I seem to find new M200 nibs for $30 and got one off the BST for half that. Just sayin'

Again, things have gone up recently. One thing to keep in mind is that when you order an italic nib Essential from MrPen, the tipping has been ground off. Or so I've been told, that's why I haven't bought one. That's a deal breaker for me and probably why I'm not in love with my double broad 78G or Lamy italic. Straight steel on the paper.

I think the cheapest route would be to buy the italic nib for your Lamy and see if you like that. If your handwriting is small you may not even enjoy using it.

Fair to say if that's a dealbreaker for you, but the Italix I gifted to my dad is the smoothest pen I've ever written with, almost TOO smooth on really slick paper like Apica premium. And that includes my infamous mutant Hero 616, which is the smoothest pen in my known universe.

I trust Doc Brown. I watched his video on it years back, it impressed him (still impresses him) and he's used everything in Pendom. So I got one for my dad, and I'm still impressed with it when I use it. Their "Medium Italic" is far too wide for me, though. I have small handwriting generally.

 

[Thirston]

Thank you all again for your time.
I haven't decided yet how to proceed but I think it's likely I will start with an inexpensive italic or two just to test the waters. Perhaps a Platinum Preppy, Pilot Plumix or Rotring art pen. This will give me a better feel for what my likes and dislikes in nib size and shape will be.

It's hard to pass up on one of those Black Friday Pelikan M205 with the Italic nib for $83 though. I could always purchase that and get the nib ground if it's too broad.

 

[Ronnie Aloha]

The Pelikan is very smooth. It's more like a stub to me rather than an italic. You won't find it any different than writing with a round tip as far as trying to find the right angle. With my Masuyama italic there is little room for error in the angle.

 

[Thirston]

I've just saw that the Pelikan Italic is closer to to Double Broad without much variation in the line width. How much does it typically cost to get a nib ground?