The difference in jeans?

[thebikingengineer]

I've got a couple of pairs of Levi's 501 STF that are holding up very well. I think they were $30 a pair. If you don't mind a little DIY try a pair or raw (or dry, or rigid, all the same) denim. They're a little stiff at first, but conform to your body/use better. As a bonus, because they're not already broken in when you get them they take a very long time to wear out.

From what I hear, some of the best quality/price/style jeans are the APC jeans. They're ~$150 and made from japanese selvedge denim and stitched together very sturdily. I'll probably spring for a pair of these in the next year or so.

 

[sir_towel_rack]

Almost all of my clothes have come from Wal-Mart and almost all of my clothing is several years old and still looks good and is comfortable. Jeans costing more than 40 bucks are for suckers. (Granted this is from a guy never having bought them). Shirts costing more than a typical wal-mart shirt, same deal, unless it's something formal. (In which case I'd still never, ever go over a few hundred for a whole suit) In my admittedly non-researched opinion, cheap clothes are of nearly the same quality as expensive clothes and last many years. My entire wardrobe is from department stores. Unlikely I'll be seen in a fancy shopping-mall clothing place unless I've been dragged there by a member of the fairer sex

/ cheapskate

 

[Biffo]

I've worn Levi's 501's for over 40 years (not the same pair I hasten to add) I am finding it more difficult to obtain the original style 501's, when it becomes impossible then I shall stop wearing jeans and wear something else instead (chinos anyone? )

 

[RazorDingo]

Finding the right jeans can be tough.

First off - stay away from the Levis Signature they sell at Wal-Mart. Levis had to cut so many corners to meet Wallyworld's price point, they simply aren't worth it. I bought a pair that went through at the knees in less than six months of wear. Never again.

Also, I may be the only one to notice this, but does anyone else see the somewhat sad irony in Wal-Mart selling a brand of jeans called "Faded Glory." What they think is some sort of appeal to Patriotism, really ends up sounding like a bitter commentary on the collapse of the US middle class consumer.

A good place for gentlemen to find superior value on well-made jeans here in the USA is Kohls Department Stores. I'm not generally a huge fan of this store (I find the huge displays of oversized female underwear to be a little offputting..) But Kohls a) has very good sales, where you can buy a good brand pair of jeans for ~ $40 or so; and b) they carry sufficient variety in terms of brand, cut, and size, that most every man will be able to find a perfect pair.

When it comes to fit and cut - you start moving into dangerous territory. A lot of gentlemen, once they get on the north side of ~ 35 or so, are tempted to start wearing stretch-fit prefade jeans. And its not generally a very good look.

 

[cthip]

there are two factors at work (well three actually) in the wear and tear of your jeans. first, the quality of the original denim itself. second, the amount of pre-distressing done by the manufacturer to simulate a worn/vintage look. third, the actual wear and tear that happens as you wear the jeans depending on what you do while you are wearing them.

before i get into a discussion of those factors, let me offer up my opinion on spending $$$ on clothes. in my opinion, there is little if any difference in terms of actual quality/durability of jeans whether they are bought at walmart, target, or from a designer label at a department store. i would argue that the bulk of the extra money is spent on marketing and special branding like logos and labels. some extra money is spent on designers who might cut their jeans to look a little better, and some is spent on extra steps to wash or distress their jeans. i doubt that much money is spent on higher quality denim and materials that would increase the longevity of the item. i know that this does not hold true 100% of the time, but in general i would not expect a $250-$300 pair of designer jeans to last longer than a $30 pair of target jeans. i would just expect them to look "cooler" (subjective of course).


issue #1--denim quality. there are a ton of variables that go into this--higher quality exotic cottons, classic/artisinal methods of winding threads, yarns, and weaving into cloth, sophisticated dyeing strategies--way more than can be discussed here. suffice it to say that most fashion-oriented, mass-market brands are not built for quality/longevity. they are a disposable item that is meant to look good for a year, or maybe just a season, and be discarded. there are small/niche-market manufacturers (mainly from japan, but an increasing number in the us) that craft denim using older construction methods that result in a more durable jean that more closely approximates the classic levis/lee/wrangler jeans (which were originally designed as workwear) in terms of quality and durability. features of these jeans usually include higher quality denim (sometimes but not always identified by a red/white "selvage" line on the outseam of the jeans that can be found by turning the cuff/hem inside-out), heavy-duty stitching, button-fly (generally more durable than zippers), and functional rivets on front and back pockets (and sometimes the crotch seam!). however, these can be prohibitively expensive at $150-$350 per pair. for a good selection of some of these you can check out www.selfedge.com. recently, gap has re-introduced their 1969 line of jeans using "authentic japanese denim." i hate the marketing scheme, but these are widely available at prices ranging from $60-$90. i have a pair and love them. the denim is a little on the thinner/lighter side, but it's proven to be extremely durable in my experience and a significant step up from any other jeans i've seen in a mall regardless of price.

issue #2--predistressing. any softening of the fabric or fading of the indigo dye done by the manufacturer is done through some combination of rinsing, stonewash, bleach, resin, sanding, heat, and who knows what else and accelerates the wear and tear on your jeans. it's not just expensive designers who are doing this--most of the jeans at walmart have received some of this treatment too! if you want them to last longer, buy the unwashed ("raw") rigid deep-blue indigo denim. the original 13MWZ rigid wranglers (although not other wrangler jeans, which have been distressed) referenced by mr. clean are a good deal, as are levi's original 501 shrink-to-fit (pre-washed and pre-shrunk levis have received some distressing at the factory) at around $30-$60 and the gap 1969 japanese denim that i just mentioned. "workwear" brands like carhartt and dickies may also make some tough, rigid jeans at a lower price-point but i don't have personal experience with them. truly raw denim will be stiff/rigid the first time that you wear it due to the starch used in the cut and sewing process. you can rinse out the starch if you want when you get home. be advised that the shrink-to-fit levis are unsanforized and will shrink significantly the first time that you expose them to water so buy a size larger than you normally would. as they shrink they should mold to your body for a "custom" fit.

issue #3--wear-and-tear caused by you. if your jeans are wearing out rapidly, you're probably a pretty active guy. most manufacturers can get away with selling lower quality jeans because the average sedentary american will get bored with their jeans and buy new ones long before the jeans themselves actually wear out. if your jeans wear quickly, it's probably more important for you to buy a higher quality denim with less distressing done at the factory. i hope that i've given examples of how you can accomplish this at a variety of price points. also note that washing (water/soap) and drying (heat) your jeans also accelerates their wear slightly. there are denim fanatics that will go months, if not years without washing their jeans in attempts to have them last longer and accomplish those high-contrast fades that the designers simulate with their factory distressing. i am not an advocate of this, but i would say that if you are trying to maximize the life of your jeans line-dry them instead of using the dryer, and wash them just before they start to get dirty/smelly/itchy instead of every single time you wear them.

 

[Mr. Clean]

...(I find the huge displays of oversized female underwear to be a little offputting..) ...

A custom title in waiting if I ever saw one.

But I'll offer a suggestion, spend a little less time in the women's lingerie department.

 

[Beast]

I buy the same cheapo Wranglers at my local Wal-Mart. They definitely DO wear quickly. Fraying.... Small nicks turning into big holes... Still, I am pretty rough on my jeans, as I wear them to work AND often wear the same jeans while washing my car, going to the shooting range/cleaning guns, general farting-around-ness, etc.

I wish they'd last longer, but for the money I don't have too much of a problem.

Plus, I don't like wearing jeans toooo long because most of them fade. I prefer mostly-blue or the new somewhat-stylin' off-blues.

 

[airplanedoc]

Levi Strauss originally designed his jeans for miners. I am sure they lasted much longer than most clothes at the time, but still wore out pretty quickly. Today few people in America participate in work that is close to the torture that those jeans were designed for, so they last much much longer. Leading to declining sales. To compensate and continue to maintain or grow sales of blue jeans, materials have been degraded over time, to keep up with the movement from mines and fields to offices.

Cotton material is graded by weight - oz/yard


broadcloth for shirts is generallly around 3 oz/yd
denim 9-10oz/yd
Canvas/Duck 11-26oz/yd

the heavier the weight, the stiffer and more durable the material. the lower the weight, the more flexible and less durable the material.

Today as margins and sales decline, manufacturers are moving to lighter weight materials to prop sales and margins, Hence jeans that do not last as long.

 

[mgarbell]

I'm a big fan of Lucky Brand Jeans. Their prices have gotten up there a bit, at or around $100, but they are some of the most comfortable, long wearing jeans I've ever had. They usually have a decent selection of last years jeans in the back on sale for 50% off, so at that price, they are a really good deal.

Of course, they have some styles that are a little thinner denim, but the classic jeans are still nice and heavy denim.

I also check out Marshall's or TJ Max for jeans. You can get really good jeans for reasonable prices, but you have to be willing to look through the racks.

Another brand that I've had some good luck with are Mossimo from Target. I find they are more durable than the Levi signature and Wrangler, although they might be a little more expensive.

I hate spending a lot of money on jeans too, but sometimes you do get what you pay for. A $100 pair of jeans that lasts more than 2 years of frequent wear that are comfortable seems well worth it to me. Anything longer than that is a very welcome bonus.

 

[cthip]

Levi Strauss originally designed his jeans for miners. I am sure they lasted much longer than most clothes at the time, but still wore out pretty quickly. Today few people in America participate in work that is close to the torture that those jeans were designed for, so they last much much longer. Leading to declining sales. To compensate and continue to maintain or grow sales of blue jeans, materials have been degraded over time, to keep up with the movement from mines and fields to offices.

Cotton material is graded by weight - oz/yard


broadcloth for shirts is generallly around 3 oz/yd
denim 9-10oz/yd
Canvas/Duck 11-26oz/yd

the heavier the weight, the stiffer and more durable the material. the lower the weight, the more flexible and less durable the material.

Today as margins and sales decline, manufacturers are moving to lighter weight materials to prop sales and margins, Hence jeans that do not last as long.

i'm glad you brought this up. the 1969 gap jeans that i referred to earlier as "a little thin" are estimated to be an 11-12oz denim. easily heavier and more durable that the common 9-10oz stuff you'd find in a mall or walmart. there are manufacturers making denim today that would have been good enough for the old miners, and maybe even better--they just don't always come cheaply. as an extreme example see this (the 21/23oz jeans) http://www.selfedge.com/shop/index....id=468&zenid=434929bec26c95fcf3234a6066bc50c9

 

[Deltaboy]

Dickies Jeans are tough and will work well. I have noticed Jeans getting holes a lot faster and easier than in the past. And I am not doing Construction work any more!

 

[Ceezer]

Thanks for all the help, folks!

I'm an old hillbilly from the hills of Appalachia. Try as hard as I might, I doubt I could ever look 'fashionable'. Though I am recently separated and will eventually need/want to get back out there, the club isn't exactly my scene. I don't want to look like a slob, but I'm not relying on my clothes/jeans to impress anyone.

Dickies don't fit me right. Like I said, I grew up running the mountains so I've got some pretty thick legs Dickies are pretty unforgiving in my experience.

We have TJ Maxx & Kohl's locally, so I'll take the time one of these days to go check out what they have in stock. I've looked for slacks there before but have a hard time finding anything in my size.

I've also seen the Mossimos at Target but they seem pretty skinny/straight-legged. See the above comment regarding Dickies.

I might be interested in trying out a pair of rigid/raw jeans. The '13MWZ rigid Wranglers', are those available at Walmart? If I got a pair of these, how big do I want to go to ensure they don't shrink too much?

I really do appreciate all the input. Thank you, again!

 

[mmack66]

i'm glad you brought this up. the 1969 gap jeans that i referred to earlier as "a little thin" are estimated to be an 11-12oz denim. easily heavier and more durable that the common 9-10oz stuff you'd find in a mall or walmart. there are manufacturers making denim today that would have been good enough for the old miners, and maybe even better--they just don't always come cheaply. as an extreme example see this (the 21/23oz jeans) http://www.selfedge.com/shop/index....id=468&zenid=434929bec26c95fcf3234a6066bc50c9

I don't think 1 pair of $450 jeans would outlast 15 pairs of $30 jeans. Of course, no one that is buying $450 jeans is out digging ditches or working construction in them. Most of the jeans I buy are 13.5oz-15oz denim.

 

[airplanedoc]

Dickies don't fit me right. Like I said, I grew up running the mountains so I've got some pretty thick legs Dickies are pretty unforgiving in my experience.

You might want to try a pair of "Keys" They are a favorite of elextricians around here, A buddy of mine has a similiar build to you and (it sounds) he is a electrician, and that is all he wears (bibs at work, pants outside) because they fit him well for the same reasons.

I also have to wear relaxed fit jeans, as I have a 28" diameter thigh, I have had good luck with Wrangler carpenter pants, and Levi Relaxed fit jeans

 

[cthip]

I don't think 1 pair of $450 jeans would outlast 15 pairs of $30 jeans. Of course, no one that is buying $450 jeans is out digging ditches or working construction in them. Most of the jeans I buy are 13.5oz-15oz denim.

agreed. i didn't mean to imply that it's really a cost-savings thing to buy better jeans. as with most goods, the law of diminishing returns applies.

however, it seems that the OP is willing to spend a little money on some quality items should he see a corresponding increase in quality (he mentioned some columbia shirts/shorts in his first post), he just hasn't seen an increase in quality when looking at more expensive jeans previously. i think there have been a lot of suggestions throughout this thread of higher quality items at a variety of price points. my posting of the 21/23oz jeans was more just for fun to demonstrate what's available if someone were to really get obsessive/fanatical about their denim the way that we get crazy about razors or brushes (why do i need a silvertip when a boar brush gets the job done?). i won't be spending $450 on my jeans anytime soon either.

 

[mmack66]

agreed. i didn't mean to imply that it's really a cost-savings thing to buy better jeans. as with most goods, the law of diminishing returns applies.

however, it seems that the OP is willing to spend a little money on some quality items should he see a corresponding increase in quality (he mentioned some columbia shirts/shorts in his first post), he just hasn't seen an increase in quality when looking at more expensive jeans previously. i think there have been a lot of suggestions throughout this thread of higher quality items at a variety of price points. my posting of the 21/23oz jeans was more just for fun to demonstrate what's available if someone were to really get obsessive/fanatical about their denim the way that we get crazy about razors or brushes (why do i need a silvertip when a boar brush gets the job done?). i won't be spending $450 on my jeans anytime soon either.

I equate $450 jeans with the $1200 shaving brush at AOS. YMMV

 

[philamac]

I shall stop wearing jeans and wear something else instead (chinos anyone? )

Corduroy in the winter,man

Khakis/Chinos in the summer months

 

[letterk]

Fasion aside, I believe higher priced jeans are made better. I just bought my first pair of Nudie Jeans and they're deffinetely better made than Levi, Lucky, etc... Got a great deal on gilt.com. Not as fasionable, but almost as expensive, my Agave and AG jeans are holding up very well. I go through knees quickly having little kids.

 

[letterk]

I'm a big fan of Lucky Brand Jeans. Their prices have gotten up there a bit, at or around $100, but they are some of the most comfortable, long wearing jeans I've ever had. They usually have a decent selection of last years jeans in the back on sale for 50% off, so at that price, they are a really good deal.

Of course, they have some styles that are a little thinner denim, but the classic jeans are still nice and heavy denim.

I also check out Marshall's or TJ Max for jeans. You can get really good jeans for reasonable prices, but you have to be willing to look through the racks.

Another brand that I've had some good luck with are Mossimo from Target. I find they are more durable than the Levi signature and Wrangler, although they might be a little more expensive.

I hate spending a lot of money on jeans too, but sometimes you do get what you pay for. A $100 pair of jeans that lasts more than 2 years of frequent wear that are comfortable seems well worth it to me. Anything longer than that is a very welcome bonus.

Lucky used to be my go-to jeans, but the quality has gone down hill over the last year. I get half the life out of them than I did a few years ago.

 

[letterk]

I might be interested in trying out a pair of rigid/raw jeans. The '13MWZ rigid Wranglers', are those available at Walmart? If I got a pair of these, how big do I want to go to ensure they don't shrink too much?

You should be thinking the opposite. Jeans stretch when you wear them. They may tighten up a bit after a wash, but they'll stretch back out quickly. I buy on the tight side and they stretch to be comfortable.