Is the movement getting bigger?

[OldSaw]

If there are people who will buy the products, then someone will be willing to make them and sell them.

Would Gillette ever want to get back into the business of making DEs? I don't see this happening anytime soon - but it's not out of the question. Of course, they would not want to send the message to their customers that their Fusions and Mach3s are not the best way to shave. But they could still re-issue DEs as some sort of "classic" product line. The movement of men returning to classic shaving methods and products certainly continues to grow. So if they think they can sell them then maybe they (Gillette) would do it. There are at least a few companies in the world that make DEs, and as far as I know they have not failed yet. So maybe Gillette, being as mighty as they are, could just buy one of these companies and stamp their name on all their products.

However, I would imagine that when Gillette's top marketing, R&D, and executives meet, this idea is not even on the radar.

Or is it?

Someone should be thinking about it. Because what if another company swooped in and marketed DEs again to North American men? Even if DEs came back and only accounted for 5% of the market, that would still be millions and millions of dollars!

So to answer this question, I would say do not rule anything out. But don't hold your breath either.

That's what I would think. I could just see how a meeting like that might go.

"Here's a way to spend millions of dollars to capture a fraction of a percent of market share on people who despise our regular product line. We will of course have to sacrifice profits, but hopefully we will gain their respect and maybe some loyalty."

The board's response? "You're fired!"

I know other companies are currently in this business and presumably making a profit. However, I would imagine that they pretty much own that market and there is no room for another supplier.

There are probably a few people who would buy a Model T if they ever made them again, (of course we know this can't happen due to current EPA and safety standards on production vehicles). I would imagine that it would not be enough to make it worth while though.

 

[chickpea]

I think these points were mentioned sporadically in other posts, but it bears summarizing:

Gillette would never reintroduce DE razors for the following reasons:

1) No-manufactured obsolescence (DE razors last 50 years, plastic razors last maybe 5-10)
2) Blade design is "open", meaning blades are interchangable between razors, thus no "lock in" (as a corollary, blade systems (i.e., non-interchangability creates "upgrade" opportunities, driving customers to an "upgrade cycle").
3) Consumables are the cheapest part (directly opposite of the pricing structure gillette wants/has grown accustomed to)
4) Hard learning curve (I mean there is the chance that you ACTUALLY cut yourself with a DE razor) bleeding customers are not return customers
5) No pseudo-scientific/technologic selling point. Vast majority of population accepts the "common wisdom" that cartidge razors are a "technological advance" compared to granddad's fuddy-duddy razor. I mean those things were used before we went to the moon! So no opportunity to sell "technological advances" in razor design.
6) Gillette does not sell/market any of the other paraphernalia that is required for DE shaving, e.g., brushes, soaps, creams (not goop).

This is not to say that DE shaving will not grow, especially now that we have been hit and will continue to be hit by a grueling recession, more people will be looking to cut costs. One of the ways is using products with cheaper consumables like DE shaving. Sure SCAD and RAD aside, it is MUCH cheaper (even with SCAD and RAD it's cheaper) to shave with a DE than with a Fusion/mach/quattro, etc. But it will be a market dominated by smaller players like Merkur, Derby, Feather, and boutique soap makers.

Just my $0.02

 

[OldSaw]

I think these points were mentioned sporadically in other posts, but it bears summarizing:

Gillette would never reintroduce DE razors for the following reasons:

1) No-manufactured obsolescence (DE razors last 50 years, plastic razors last maybe 5-10)
2) Blade design is "open", meaning blades are interchangable between razors, thus no "lock in" (as a corollary, blade systems (i.e., non-interchangability creates "upgrade" opportunities, driving customers to an "upgrade cycle").
3) Consumables are the cheapest part (directly opposite of the pricing structure gillette wants/has grown accustomed to)
4) Hard learning curve (I mean there is the chance that you ACTUALLY cut yourself with a DE razor) bleeding customers are not return customers
5) No pseudo-scientific/technologic selling point. Vast majority of population accepts the "common wisdom" that cartidge razors are a "technological advance" compared to granddad's fuddy-duddy razor. I mean those things were used before we went to the moon! So no opportunity to sell "technological advances" in razor design.
6) Gillette does not sell/market any of the other paraphernalia that is required for DE shaving, e.g., brushes, soaps, creams (not goop).

This is not to say that DE shaving will not grow, especially now that we have been hit and will continue to be hit by a grueling recession, more people will be looking to cut costs. One of the ways is using products with cheaper consumables like DE shaving. Sure SCAD and RAD aside, it is MUCH cheaper (even with SCAD and RAD it's cheaper) to shave with a DE than with a Fusion/mach/quattro, etc. But it will be a market dominated by smaller players like Merkur, Derby, Feather, and boutique soap makers.

Just my $0.02

Actually, Gillette makes a pretty fair cream and some dandy blades, (I'm thinking Nacet). They just are not available in major markets, like the U.S. In other countries where I was able to buy these though, they are marketing the Fusion and Edge products heavily.

It seems like they are content to continue making the blades but not the razors. I suppose they can still make a profit without advertising by selling to those who will seek them out and they probably don't have to ship them very far either. Eventually as they convert emerging markets to cartridges I'm sure the DE will be history.

 

[chickpea]

Actually, Gillette makes a pretty fair cream and some dandy blades, (I'm thinking Nacet). They just are not available in major markets, like the U.S. In other countries where I was able to buy these though, they are marketing the Fusion and Edge products heavily.

It seems like they are content to continue making the blades but not the razors. I suppose they can still make a profit without advertising by selling to those who will seek them out and they probably don't have to ship them very far either. Eventually as they convert emerging markets to cartridges I'm sure the DE will be history.

fair enough. But the point still stands that you can't advertise mug/brush/soap shaving with jets/footballers/tanks/other "masculine" objects whizzing across the screen. It sets up a pretty heavy contrast. And the volume of brushes that gillette would want to sell just isn't there in the demand.

 

[OldSaw]

fair enough. But the point still stands that you can't advertise mug/brush/soap shaving with jets/footballers/tanks/other "masculine" objects whizzing across the screen. It sets up a pretty heavy contrast. And the volume of brushes that gillette would want to sell just isn't there in the demand.

Definitely. Besides, P&G takes enough slack from groups like PITA as it is. Can you imagine how bad they would get hammered if they tried to sell a badger brush. They would have to try to convince men that they should be applying lather with a synthetic brush.

I remember back in the late 70's or early 80's there was a synthetic brush with a crank up tube in the handle that dispensed the cream into the brush to be applied to the face and brushed in. I thought it was a major supplier like Gillette. I tried one and remember that it was only OK at best and it never caught on. They even had a huge TV campaign. I believe the refills were pricey as well. But of course this was what they were trying to do, get you hooked on the system and then sell you the refills.

 

[monkeyman]

There is such a small margin in DE blades that they can't afford to advertise. Those of us who want them must seek them out. Once the emerging markets are assimilated to cartridges the DE will be dead. There might be one or two manufacturers who hang on for the nostalgia buffs, but the cost will not be cheap, like it is now.

If I'm understanding you right, your view of the future will be that disposable cartridges will saturate the global market and push out the DE to the point that it will cost more money to get it. Not to argue but I have to stand my ground and say that's the definition of "corporate greed" if I ever saw it. It's not good enough for them to have a majority of the market, they have to have ALL of it. A company being profitable isn't greedy unless they're taking a bigger chunk of the market than they should.

I also don't think the world will make a complete switch to cartridges anytime soon. Although the world keeps moving faster and people are in a hurry, I think there will be a small portion of men who prefer quality over convenience. To their benefit, I think there are men in other countries who aren't as susceptible to slick advertising and don't head to their local stores like mindless lemmings to buy a product. I say other countries because I don't think a majority of American men could fight the temptation. When the commercial came on that compared the Mach 3 to an F15 fighter jet, they were at the store buying this piece of crap. Heck, I was one of them for a long time.

Because I think there will be large pockets of men who hold onto their DE razors, I think this old school shaving system will live a healthy life for a long time and be within any budget. Plus you have China doing what they do best.......building knock offs that are decent quality for cheap.

 

[rikrdo]

Is this a shaving forum or a screening for a proctologist appointment ??

 

[moose-o]

Gillette introducing a new DE razor?

They are too busy right now lining the pockets of Tiger Woods, Derek Jeter, and Roger Federer.

 

[-PO-]

I don't know if it is worth it or if they would get enough profit to do it. "With that being said" (LOL most know why I just said that) Anyways I had no idea how big DE, Straight or if you want to just call it Wet Shaving was as big as it is until just last week. To be quite honest I am glad that there are so many Wet Shavers out there to help newbies like me. I have not even received my DE set yet (tomorrow) and I already find myself addicted to this madness. I love it, can't explain it but wish I knew about this 20 years ago.

 

[-PO-]

I don't want to be snobbish but I kind of like it that I do something a bit different. I like it when friends use my bathroom and ask me "what is that funny little brush for?". One of my closest friends saw my gear for the first time and laughingly told me that of all the people he knows, I would be the most likely to use a badger brush and safety razor....then told me that seeing the stuff brought back a happy memory of his grandfather.

I like to buy clothes from Hackett, Tyrwhitt, Hawes & Curtis, Brooks Brothers etc because when I wear them in Norn Iron nobody else has them.

I like to wear a sports jacket with a silk pocket square when I pop out for a pint or two.

I like it that I have got my Dad into this as well and we talk loads about the different creams and brushes I have bought for him, when my brother thinks we are a bit odd.

Now I realise this may make me a bit of a snob, but I do not care. I am glad that Trumpers or Taylors will never establish lots of new stores to become the Starbucks of shaving. So I think it is great that more people are interested in "this thing of ours" and I look forward to someday bumping into a fellow B&B'er, but don't want it to get toooooo big

Not Snobbish at all, I see where you are coming from and have to agree a little with you.

 

[Bacchus]

To be quite honest I am glad that there are so many Wet Shavers out there to help newbies like me. I have not even received my DE set yet (tomorrow) and I already find myself addicted to this madness. I love it, can't explain it but wish I knew about this 20 years ago.

I agree to that... but not 20 years ago, maybe like 8 or 9 at the most, I dont think I would have grasped the whole 'shaving' thing being a newborn and all

 

[SlyGI]

The business model is that you don't make money on the razors, you make money off the blades. You can sell one razor to a person, but then sell him hundreds of blades.

Companies that make printers follow the same model. Buy the cheap printer, spend tons of ink. Notice no name brand ink cartrages are interchangeable?

Gillette would have to make a new razor that could only use Gillette specific razor blades. Just look at how many people here use a variety of razor blades? How many different versions of a razor blade would Gillette have to make to satisfy all of us? Again, the blades would be only specific to the new Gillette DE razor, with a 20 year patent so no third parties could make the blades. It would almost be a real target market of one-- or a few.

Now, with a gazillion bladed cartrage, you can mass market and work the economies of scale angle.

 

[mr00jimbo]

I sent Gillette an e-mail about it a while back. She said she was happy I was interested, but had no plans.
It's about convenience.

Not only do you have to learn how to shave differently, you need to learn how to shave OPPOSITE.
Don't press down on DE razors, press down on the plastic cartridge razors. How many people will press down hard and cut themselves?

The best thing Gillette can do now is to make nice-looking stainless steel and chrome handled razors that accept Mach 3 or Fusion blades.

 

[SlyGI]

It's my understanding, and other members may correct me if I'm wrong, that Europe, the US and basically the rest of the British Common Wealth are the main parts of the globe that shave with cartrage razors. Most other parts of the world shave with DEs and DE blades.

 

[chickpea]

It's my understanding, and other members may correct me if I'm wrong, that Europe, the US and basically the rest of the British Common Wealth are the main parts of the globe that shave with cartrage razors. Most other parts of the world shave with DEs and DE blades.

Brazil (so 80% of South America) most shave with cartidge razors. Brazil is a vast DE wasteland.