Lambda Athena Titanium (Ti)

[Phoenixkh]

The TiThena has arrived.... earlier today than I thought... I didn't expect it until late in the evening, but it showed up at 4:45 or so..... As the other photos show, it's a beautiful razor... I haven't used it but I did use both the titanium and bronze caps for a dry shave... As I thought, the little extra weight of the bronze tilts the balance slightly toward the razor head.... Let me say, as I've mentioned before, this is a very personal thing. The TiThena is perfectly balanced, as is the marine bronze Athena.... but the TiThena with a bronze cap might just be perfect for me.... Lots of people who have the TiThena also have a bronze Athena, if they didn't sell theirs due to the arrival of the TiThena.... I'd be interested if anyone else wanted to try the TiThena with a bronze cap and see if they enjoy it, if they still have both... <eg>

I promise to get a photo up with both caps soon....

 

[gdawg55]

The TiThena has arrived.... earlier today than I thought... I didn't expect it until late in the evening, but it showed up at 4:45 or so..... As the other photos show, it's a beautiful razor... I haven't used it but I did use both the titanium and bronze caps for a dry shave... As I thought, the little extra weight of the bronze tilts the balance slightly toward the razor head.... Let me say, as I've mentioned before, this is a very personal thing. The TiThena is perfectly balanced, as is the marine bronze Athena.... but the TiThena with a bronze cap might just be perfect for me.... Lots of people who have the TiThena also have a bronze Athena, if they didn't sell theirs due to the arrival of the TiThena.... I'd be interested if anyone else wanted to try the TiThena with a bronze cap and see if they enjoy it, if they still have both... <eg>

I promise to get a photo up with both caps soon....

Awesome. Hope you have a delightful first shave. I kinda dig the look of mixed metal razors.

 

[Phoenixkh]

I'm about to embark on my TiThena hybrid trials.... Today, I'll set up the TiThena with the extra bronze cap Theo made for me, titanium base plate and the TiThena handle....

I ended up with two of the new, corner relieved Athena base plates when there was a bit of a mix up with my Ares.... Theo generously offered to include them with my Ares when he shipped it. It wasn't a big deal... His engraver misunderstood the custom serial number I'd requested for the Ares. Theo offered to make me a new one with the right serial number.... I told him it wasn't that important and not to bother, as I didn't want him to incur the shipping costs for a single base plate... In any event, both my bronze Athenas have the current base plates.

Long story to say this... I'll use one of the original Athena base plates to experiment with the TiThena hybrids.

Stats:
Ti Cap: 7.2 grams
Bronze Cap: 12.4 grams
Ti Base Plate: 10.9 grams
Original Bronze Base Plate: 18.7 grams
Ti Handle: 52.1 grams

Total Razor Weights:
Ti Complete: 70 grams
Bronze Cap, Ti Base Plate: 75.2 grams
Ti Cap, Bronze Base Plate: 77.9 grams

This should be great fun.... I'll post the results later today as I'll shave before a doctor appointment at 1PM...

 

[Phoenixkh]

I just got home from my doctor appointment.... Uneventful, as expected.

My shave this morning with the TiThena hybrid was stellar.... As planned, I used the bronze cap and titanium base plate. It was as good as any shave I've ever had, but I've had mostly stellar shaves for a while now. I'm fortunate to have a small family of excellent razors, all of which give me those 12 smooth, comfortable, yet close shaves.

As I said in my journal, the TiThena is definitely a luxury product. As we all know, Theo crafts some excellent razors, with polished surfaces as good as anyone in the business... Flawless.

I gave a more detailed report in my journal, but I want to repeat... if you have a TiThena and still have your marine bronze Athena, you might try mixed metal razor heads by combining the two.... My next shave I'm going to try the titanium cap and marine bronze base plate. I did dry shave with them both this morning while I was weighing them and both combinations felt good in my hand.. We'll see how the second experiment feels during an actual shave.

I would add for those who read this thread but don't read my journal. Would you be missing out if you already have or are planning to buy the marine bronze Athena, but are wondering if the TiThena is a better razor than the bronze? Not in my mind, at least... I love the marine bronze Athena.... I have more shaves with it than any of my other DE razors at this point. It's a wonderful razor and at its current price is one of the absolute bargains among the higher end razors, if those are in your budget. If the Athena is a good match for someone's face and whiskers, there might be equals out there, but I would be shocked to find a better razor.... again, if it's a good match. YMMV is always in play. I'm just one guy who along with many others here on B&B find the Athena to be an extraordinary DE razor...

That said, I don't regret purchasing the TiThena.. In fact, I'm quite pleased with it. It's intuitive, just like its sibling, as one would expect. The auditory feedback is different... more muted for me on the first 3 passes.... but I have to say... it was Loud on the ATG pass as it reduced the final cut of my whiskers down to that whisper I love to hear. Its voice is different than the marine bronze Athena.... more neutral than warm.... not as bright as the Rocnel Elite 2022 or 2023... very pleasant.

Because the TiThena was scheduled to arrive on Friday... and didn't show up until yesterday afternoon, I had 7 days growth to plow through...It sure wasn't any trouble for the TiThena.... It mowed down all the whiskers to an acceptable level on the WTG pass... and continued to reduce them all the way through the 4th ATG pass..... I just felt my whiskers a second ago, to see if I missed any.. and I can report, nary a whisker can be felt. Of course, it's only been 5 and a half hours since I finished, but it's always nice to know I didn't miss a few somewhere... like on my neck or under my chin....

 

[anoop]

Is the titanium more prone to scratches? I know that was a commonly cited con for titanium watches.

 

[Phoenixkh]

Is the titanium more prone to scratches? I know that was a commonly cited con for titanium watches.

Someone else with actual technical data should post soon... All I can say is, I've had my Timeless Ti 0.69OC since this past summer and it has no scratches on the cap... I have quite a few excellent razors and I'm a semi-sporatiac shaver... so none of my razors have seen extended use, so factor that in.... Obviously, I've only used the TiThena once and I used the bronze cap....

I would think marine bronze is softer than titanium. I've used my marine bronze Athena more than any of my DE razors and the cap is still pristine. Again, this is anecdotal... someone with actual machining experience will show up and answer your question more definitely.... <eg> evil grin.

 

[idjekyll]

Is the titanium more prone to scratches? I know that was a commonly cited con for titanium watches.

Yes, titanium is more prone to scratches than stainless steel. While it's strong and lightweight, its surface hardness is lower, making it easier to get surface marks. This is the same reason titanium watches often develop scratches more easily. However, titanium also forms a natural oxide layer over time, which can help mask minor scratches. If scratch resistance is a priority, stainless steel would be the better choice.

 

[Lambda Razors]

I just got home from my doctor appointment.... Uneventful, as expected.

My shave this morning with the TiThena hybrid was stellar.... As planned, I used the bronze cap and titanium base plate. It was as good as any shave I've ever had, but I've had mostly stellar shaves for a while now. I'm fortunate to have a small family of excellent razors, all of which give me those 12 smooth, comfortable, yet close shaves.

As I said in my journal, the TiThena is definitely a luxury product. As we all know, Theo crafts some excellent razors, with polished surfaces as good as anyone in the business... Flawless.

I gave a more detailed report in my journal, but I want to repeat... if you have a TiThena and still have your marine bronze Athena, you might try mixed metal razor heads by combining the two.... My next shave I'm going to try the titanium cap and marine bronze base plate. I did dry shave with them both this morning while I was weighing them and both combinations felt good in my hand.. We'll see how the second experiment feels during an actual shave.

I would add for those who read this thread but don't read my journal. Would you be missing out if you already have or are planning to buy the marine bronze Athena, but are wondering if the TiThena is a better razor than the bronze? Not in my mind, at least... I love the marine bronze Athena.... I have more shaves with it than any of my other DE razors at this point. It's a wonderful razor and at its current price is one of the absolute bargains among the higher end razors, if those are in your budget. If the Athena is a good match for someone's face and whiskers, there might be equals out there, but I would be shocked to find a better razor.... again, if it's a good match. YMMV is always in play. I'm just one guy who along with many others here on B&B find the Athena to be an extraordinary DE razor...

That said, I don't regret purchasing the TiThena.. In fact, I'm quite pleased with it. It's intuitive, just like its sibling, as one would expect. The auditory feedback is different... more muted for me on the first 3 passes.... but I have to say... it was Loud on the ATG pass as it reduced the final cut of my whiskers down to that whisper I love to hear. Its voice is different than the marine bronze Athena.... more neutral than warm.... not as bright as the Rocnel Elite 2022 or 2023... very pleasant.

Because the TiThena was scheduled to arrive on Friday... and didn't show up until yesterday afternoon, I had 7 days growth to plow through...It sure wasn't any trouble for the TiThena.... It mowed down all the whiskers to an acceptable level on the WTG pass... and continued to reduce them all the way through the 4th ATG pass..... I just felt my whiskers a second ago, to see if I missed any.. and I can report, nary a whisker can be felt. Of course, it's only been 5 and a half hours since I finished, but it's always nice to know I didn't miss a few somewhere... like on my neck or under my chin....

Kim, thank you for your review! It's also helpful to me to get such great feedback regarding materials and weights!

 

[Lambda Razors]

Yes, titanium is more prone to scratches than stainless steel. While it's strong and lightweight, its surface hardness is lower, making it easier to get surface marks. This is the same reason titanium watches often develop scratches more easily. However, titanium also forms a natural oxide layer over time, which can help mask minor scratches. If scratch resistance is a priority, stainless steel would be the better choice.

I cannot comment on the several titanium alloys (or non-alloys) that are available, I can only comment on the alloys we are using.
In fact, Ti-6Al-4V is way harder than 316L. Again, my comparison is only valid for those 2 alloys. Certainly 316L might be harder than certain types of titanium material, unalloyed titanium for example. "Pure" unalloyed titanium is certainly "softer" than 316L stainless steel.

Hardness Brinell*
Ti-6Al-4V (annealed bar): 334
AISI 316L (annealed bar): 149

*source: matweb.com

 

[Phoenixkh]

Kim, thank you for your review! It's also helpful to me to get such great feedback regarding materials and weights!

Theo, I'm thoroughly enjoying playing around with the different razor head parts. The TiThena is a joy to use, though I will never part with my two marine bronze Athenas.

As you know, my next shave I'll use the titanium cap and the older design marine bronze Athena base plate. This will add 7.9 grams to the TiThena vs. the all titanium razor, but only 2.7 grams from the marine bronze cap/titanium base plate. I'm not sure I'll be able to feel the difference... At that point, it will be about which is more aesthetically pleasing.

This is a guess, but I think one of the many reasons the marine bronze Athena is so easy to use is the weight... With the TiThena, with a mixed metal razor head, that little tilt of the razor balance toward the razor head might accomplish the same thing, but from a different dynamic... What do you think?

This isn't to say the TiThena isn't a great razor in its own right.... I'll do a third shave with the TiThena as you designed it and see how it feels on my face... That will be a fun exercise as well.

 

[Lambda Razors]

Theo, I'm thoroughly enjoying playing around with the different razor head parts. The TiThena is a joy to use, though I will never part with my two marine bronze Athenas.

As you know, my next shave I'll use the titanium cap and the older design marine bronze Athena base plate. This will add 7.9 grams to the TiThena vs. the all titanium razor, but only 2.7 grams from the marine bronze cap/titanium base plate. I'm not sure I'll be able to feel the difference... At that point, it will be about which is more aesthetically pleasing.

This is a guess, but I think one of the many reasons the marine bronze Athena is so easy to use is the weight... With the TiThena, with a mixed metal razor head, that little tilt of the razor balance toward the razor head might accomplish the same thing, but from a different dynamic... What do you think?

This isn't to say the TiThena isn't a great razor in its own right.... I'll do a third shave with the TiThena as you designed it and see how it feels on my face... That will be a fun exercise as well.

Kim, I would say this is just a matter of personal preference. I personally prefer titanium because of its lower weight as it's more nimble and "flexible" in my hands. At the end of the day I found out that it's slightly more efficient and I think this is because my hand is more free to move the razor around my face. Maybe this would be a disadvantage if the razor was more aggressive but that's just my personal feeling.

I would love to see how the razor sounds with the bronze baseplate in comparison with the titanium one!
I have not noticed any great sound difference in shaving but I have also found out by "accident" that Grade 5 is a good-sounding material when i am doing a certain test, i will try to upload a video to explain what i mean!

 

[anoop]

However, titanium also forms a natural oxide layer over time, which can help mask minor scratches.

I thought titanium was non reactive. Does that mean the polished versions will dull over time?

 

[Lambda Razors]

I thought titanium was non reactive. Does that mean the polished versions will dull over time?

It's not as simple as it looks.
There is no non-reactive element in nature. But some are more reactive than others.
Titanium is very reactive! This makes it so highly resistant to corrosion as it quickly forms that oxide layer when it contacts with oxygen! That layer actually renders titanium one of the most corrosion resistant metals on earth! The layer is very dense and it regenerates itself if damaged.

Titanium loves oxygen so much that it will form that layer very quickly. The titanium razor you have in your hands has this layer already. That's why titanium alloys should always be welded inside chambers filled with pure argon gas. No oxygen is allowed while welding it so you make sure that no oxides are formed before welding is done.

And to confuse you even more, copper is less reactive than titanium! The further to the left and down you go on the periodic table, the more reactive the metal is!

 

[anoop]

It's not as simple as it looks.
There is no non-reactive element in nature. But some are more reactive than others.
Titanium is very reactive! This makes it so highly resistant to corrosion as it quickly forms that oxide layer when it contacts with oxygen! That layer actually renders titanium one of the most corrosion resistant metals on earth! The layer is very dense and it regenerates itself if damaged.

Titanium loves oxygen so much that it will form that layer very quickly. The titanium razor you have in your hands has this layer already. That's why titanium alloys should always be welded inside chambers filled with pure argon gas. No oxygen is allowed while welding it so you make sure that no oxides are formed before welding is done.

And to confuse you even more, copper is less reactive than titanium! The further to the left and down you go on the periodic table, the more reactive the metal is!

Is it correct to say that oxidation won't be able to hide any scratches should they form? I'm not anticipating scratches from regular use, but what about from dropping it? I think the hardness and lighter weight might mean less chance of denting when dropped?

 

[Phoenixkh]

Is it correct to say that oxidation won't be able to hide any scratches should they form? I'm not anticipating scratches from regular use, but what about from dropping it? I think the hardness and lighter weight might mean less chance of denting when dropped?

I don't trust myself not to drop things.... I have a thick bath mat on the floor under my sink when I'm shaving.... Of course, I could end up dropping a razor while shaving into the sink... but when I'm cleaning my razors, I put a washcloth in the sink as a precaution.... So far, so good.

I can say, I've never had a razor slip out of my hands while shaving, but there's always a first time. <eg>

 

[anoop]

I don't trust myself not to drop things.... I have a thick bath mat on the floor under my sink when I'm shaving.... Of course, I could end up dropping a razor while shaving into the sink... but when I'm cleaning my razors, I put a washcloth in the sink as a precaution.... So far, so good.

I can say, I've never had a razor slip out of my hands while shaving, but there's always a first time. <eg>

I have dropped and dented my AS-D2 (handle is what hit first). I also have a weird scratch on the coating which I cannot figure out how it happened, but I think it might have come back with it when I sent it to Feather to get the blade gap checked.

 

[Lambda Razors]

Is it correct to say that oxidation won't be able to hide any scratches should they form? I'm not anticipating scratches from regular use, but what about from dropping it? I think the hardness and lighter weight might mean less chance of denting when dropped?

Someone mentioned titanium watch cases that are very prone to scratching. I bet these watches are made of unalloyed titanium, not Grade 5. Maybe Grade 1, 2, I think Grade 2 is more likely.
Our titanium razors are made of Grade 5 and this is why they come so expensive.
If you compare Grade 2 with 316L, the latter is more scratch resistant than Grade 2.
If you compare Grade 5 with 316L, Grade 5 is more scratch resistant than 316L.

If you drop a metal object on a hard surface you will most probably get a dent, except if the object is a surface hardened metal or ... a diamond.

 

[idjekyll]

Someone mentioned titanium watch cases that are very prone to scratching. I bet these watches are made of unalloyed titanium, not Grade 5. Maybe Grade 1, 2, I think Grade 2 is more likely.
Our titanium razors are made of Grade 5 and this is why they come so expensive.
If you compare Grade 2 with 316L, the latter is more scratch resistant than Grade 2.
If you compare Grade 5 with 316L, Grade 5 is more scratch resistant than 316L.

If you drop a metal object on a hard surface you will most probably get a dent, except if the object is a surface hardened metal or ... a diamond.

I apologize for not considering different titanium grades when I mentioned scratching issues.
Not all titanium is the same, and that was my oversight.

Grade 5 (Ti-6Al-4V) packs more hardness than 316L.
Yes, you could still dent it if you drop it from a tall building, but it’s more resistant to surface marks.

Many watchmakers, even luxury brands, use Grade 2 for cost and manufacturing reasons.
You’d think Tudor, part of the Rolex family, would opt for the best available.
Yet their Pelagos is Grade 2, not Grade 5.
Citizen does too, though they harden it to slow the scratches.

The choice of Grade 5 is a serious upgrade.
Yes, it costs more, but fewer scratches mean fewer regrets.
Would you rather save a few bucks now or own something that stays sleek much longer?