Blade Sharpness Research Project

[lasta]

You're probably right, it's just technically possible. It was probably the coating as I originally thought, should have left the thought in my journal. I'll delete it even though it will stick around in the quote.

No need to delete!

It's the sum of our hypotheses not just our thesis that defines who we are!

 

[helicopter]

I took a look at the Israeli Personna Platinum Chrome Super Stainless blade produced on February 3, 2013 for American Safety Razor Company, which is Ever-Ready. As suspected, this is a completely different blade from the Edgewell German Red that replaced it. There really doesn't even seem to be an effort to reproduce this one, disappointing because this old one was sharper, and more durable.

It comes in a cardboard tuck of five blades that has a date code on it. The blades are single wrapped in printed wax paper with a single wax dot.

The new blade is double-beveled, with a fine scratch pattern on the primary bevel, an extra fine and even grind on the secondary bevel, and a fine polished honing right at the edge. The coating is heavy and even.

After testing, the edge is very smooth, and the coating is gone. The blade dulled a good amount during testing, but I only see a tiny amount of fine chipping at this magnification, around 400x depending on your screen size. The steel must be very tough and resilient, but not especially hard. I think that is a good compromise because most of us don't mind replacing our blades after a few shaves.

Information Summary:

This Ever-Ready Israeli red is sharper and more durable than the new Edgewell German red.

Date	7/27/24	7/27/24	7/27/24	7/27/24	7/27/24
Blade	Personna Red	Platinum Chrome SS	ASRC Ever-Ready	Israel	February 3, 2013
Shaves	0	P3	P6	P9	P12
Location	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top
Medium	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29
Dulling Substrate	New	Paper	Paper	Paper	Paper
Measurements	30	30	30	30	30
Std. Dev.	10	15	15	16	24
Median F (g)	75.5	81	81	88	84
Mean F (g) Btm	79	86	88	90	95
Mean F (g) Top	71	77	78	84	86
Mean F (g)	75	81	83	87	91
BESS Adj. Factor	0.83	0.83	0.83	0.83	0.83
Av. Adj. F (g) Bt	66	71	73	75	79
Av. Adj. F (g) Top	59	64	65	70	72
Median adj. F (g)	63	67	67	73	70
Mean adj. F (g)	62	67	69	72	75

Blade Sharpness Test Index

Complete Data:

Date	7/27/24	7/27/24	7/27/24	7/27/24	7/27/24
Blade	Personna Red	Platinum Chrome SS	ASRC Ever-Ready	Israel	February 3, 2013
Shaves	0	P3	P6	P9	P12
Location	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top
Medium	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29
Dulling Substrate	New	Paper	Paper	Paper	Paper
Measurements	30	30	30	30	30
Std. Dev.	10	15	15	16	24
Median F (g)	75.5	81	81	88	84
Mean F (g) Btm	79	86	88	90	95
Mean F (g) Top	71	77	78	84	86
Mean F (g)	75	81	83	87	91
F (g) 1	89	82	89	105	95
F (g) 2	81	81	87	109	83
F (g) 3	81	97	78	104	142
F (g) 4	98	70	75	87	102
F (g) 5	71	72	79	108	85
F (g) 6	81	81	102	82	138
F (g) 7	70	91	75	97	63
F (g) 8	88	86	85	74	65
F (g) 9	78	93	77	89	81
F (g) 10	68	99	86	56	99
F (g) 11	75	97	104	69	106
F (g) 12	65	84	104	103	78
F (g) 13	85	79	93	75	94
F (g) 14	74	86	80	92	118
F (g) 15	85	90	103	103	78
F (g) 16	67	73	69	103	101
F (g) 17	76	63	76	95	72
F (g) 18	77	47	82	69	99
F (g) 19	63	86	93	67	60
F (g) 20	72	73	89	108	128
F (g) 21	87	75	79	81	131
F (g) 22	57	65	74	79	77
F (g) 23	65	111	106	83	85
F (g) 24	79	75	103	71	122
F (g) 25	78	116	93	101	65
F (g) 26	68	69	70	97	77
F (g) 27	81	81	55	86	75
F (g) 28	69	78	57	53	67
F (g) 29	59	90	55	77	78
F (g) 30	61	48	67	89	59

 

[helicopter]

I shaved with a Rubie from the same tuck as the one I tested. Like other members, it "felt sharper" to me than it actually is. The coating is much more persistent that most blade coatings, and I suspect that is an important part of the difference. If the edge has low friction, it probably gets under hairs better and has less resistance shaving compared to other blades of similar sharpness.

 

[AndyPanda]

@lasta Re: wire edge

Way back when I first joined B&B, I borrowed a microscope to see why the BIC CP blades I bought felt like barbed wire. I didn't take nearly as good of photos as Helicopter is getting - but this is what I was finding on that batch of BIC blades, this is not a hair - it is a piece of the wire edge that should have been stropped off but was left hanging. You couldn't brush it off - but running the edge thru a cork would pull it off. I later bought another batch of BIC CP that were good. I don't think these bad ones were counterfeit, just a bad run that should have been caught by QC.

 

[WVShaver]

@lasta Re: wire edge

Way back when I first joined B&B, I borrowed a microscope to see why the BIC CP blades I bought felt like barbed wire. I didn't take nearly as good of photos as Helicopter is getting - but this is what I was finding on that batch of BIC blades, this is not a hair - it is a piece of the wire edge that should have been stropped off but was left hanging. You couldn't brush it off - but running the edge thru a cork would pull it off. I later bought another batch of BIC CP that were good. I don't think these bad ones were counterfeit, just a bad run that should have been caught by QC.
View attachment 1884870

My first tuck of Bics felt extremely sharp but weren’t smooth at all. I recently purchased another tuck to try from a different batch and that blade produced one of the best shaves I’ve ever had. I plan on ordering a couple hundred and hope the ones I receive are as good as the last tuck I tried.

 

[Flanders]

@AndyPanda

I forgot all about this since you posted it last. Upon further thought, maybe I shouldn't have deleted my post, the guy that took the older SEM images mentioned how rigorous his cleaning process was and I wonder if it would have removed any wire edges and he just didn't mention it?

Edit to add that the grind profile looks correct for a Bic blade.

 

[helicopter]

So, the other Vikings Blade came from Amazon. This one says it is "Cayenne Hot" and Amazon has you select "Aggressive" to pick it over the green "mild and gentle" one. Basically the same packaging as the other one, except for this one is Red. Anyway, it is the same blade in a different package, which makes me disappointed in the Australian company Vuillon Group and this American LLC Archibald Cooper Trading LLC for their misleading advertising. The blade isn't terrible, but it is bad. If you want my full thoughts on it, just read my other report, since it's the same product.

Same production date as the green one. I don't doubt it.

Same coarse and uneven grind and same thick and uneven distal coating.

Same chipping.

Information Summary:

Date	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24
Blade	Vikings Blade	Cayenne Hot	Platinum Coated	Swedish Sandvik PRC	August 15, 2022
Shaves	0	P3	P6	P9	P12
Location	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top
Medium	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29
Dulling Substrate	New	Paper	Paper	Paper	Paper
Measurements	31	31	30	30	31
Std. Dev.	13	16	12	17	19
Median F (g)	90	79	84	89	91
Mean F (g) Btm	100	95	95	100	104
Mean F (g) Top	79	74	79	79	79
Mean F (g)	90	84	87	90	93
BESS Adj. Factor	0.83	0.83	0.83	0.83	0.83
Av. Adj. F (g) Bt	83	79	79	83	86
Av. Adj. F (g) Top	65	61	66	66	66
Median adj. F (g)	75	66	70	74	76
Mean adj. F (g)	74	70	72	75	78

Blade Sharpness Test Index

Complete Data:

Date	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24
Blade	Vikings Blade	Cayenne Hot	Platinum Coated	Swedish Sandvik PRC	August 15, 2022
Shaves	0	P3	P6	P9	P12
Location	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top
Medium	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29
Dulling Substrate	New	Paper	Paper	Paper	Paper
Measurements	31	31	30	30	31
Std. Dev.	13	16	12	17	19
Median F (g)	90	79	84	89	91
Mean F (g) Btm	100	95	95	100	104
Mean F (g) Top	79	74	79	79	79
Mean F (g)	90	84	87	90	93
F (g) 1	103	93	99	93	99
F (g) 2	114	87	77	93	103
F (g) 3	115	88	103	89	95
F (g) 4	111	97	96	84	130
F (g) 5	102	84	84	94	88
F (g) 6	106	75	102	139	101
F (g) 7	94	118	107	96	113
F (g) 8	91	85	93	100	100
F (g) 9	93	122	87	105	107
F (g) 10	90	79	125	99	97
F (g) 11	84	92	97	94	107
F (g) 12	100	82	95	117	91
F (g) 13	98	110	86	84	110
F (g) 14	110	105	90	115	91
F (g) 15	92	113	83	103	129
F (g) 16	80	81	75	81	75
F (g) 17	80	91	75	65	81
F (g) 18	77	63	82	78	74
F (g) 19	69	70	89	85	81
F (g) 20	72	77	70	58	77
F (g) 21	90	79	78	89	75
F (g) 22	87	72	84	83	85
F (g) 23	71	61	83	71	82
F (g) 24	76	69	79	98	72
F (g) 25	88	74	71	77	79
F (g) 26	80	65	82	83	76
F (g) 27	79	79	81	78	97
F (g) 28	81	76	80	70	72
F (g) 29	69	75	70	74	77
F (g) 30	82	71	86	101	81
F (g) 31	91	73			149

Don't buy these misleadingly presented, overpriced, low-quality blades.

 

[Flanders]

Dang, I may need to send you an older one. At least you saved me from resupplying!

 

[PALORAZOR]

With the subjective shave tests I’ve been doing the one variable that has a huge impact is pre shave beard prep. If I skip this step or skimp on it, I can make most any blade feel bad.

 

[helicopter]

Dang, I may need to send you an older one. At least you saved me from resupplying!

I could just send you the new ones to see what you think. I am not going to shave with them again. PM me if you want them. It won't bother me if you like the blade, but for $0.30, I think you can do much better.

It does seem like good steel; the grind just doesn't suit me.

 

[Flanders]

I could just send you the new ones to see what you think. I am not going to shave with them again. PM me if you want them. It won't bother me if you like the blade, but for $0.30, I think you can do much better.

It does seem like good steel; the grind just doesn't suit me.

This company has always been the centre of one controversy or another so none of this surprises me. Thanks for the offer, I am going to eventually PM you once I find all the rare blades I want to send you then you can just send those to me after.

 

[PALORAZOR]

BTW, in my subjective testing, this is the finest single shave blade I've tested so far on the Rockwell 6c #4 plate.

 

[helicopter]

Tonight I measured the current Gillette Platinum, which is produced in China. There were some differences between the two edges of this blade, but overall, it is fairly dull. It is reasonably consistent and durable. I can see how people who prefer a blade that isn't too sharp might like it.

It comes in a blister pack. It is labeled and packaged for European markets.

It has a cardboard tuck of five blades single wrapped in waxed paper with some small glue dots. There is a production date on the tuck, which is nice to see.

There is a date on the blister pack, which is nice to see.

It's got one grind number on there, so you can figure out the others.

This edge looks very good, with its fine and even scratch pattern on the bevel, honed edge, and thick even coating. This edge looks remarkably similar to the Russian Gillette Platinum blade I tested. The third picture, after the test, also looks similar to that blade after testing. They must have used similar abrasives and perhaps coatings. The durability is also very similar, so I suspect they also used a similar steel, both alloy and heat treatment. The big difference is that the Russian one was quite sharp, and this one is on the other end of the spectrum, duller than the vast majority of properly designed and produced stainless steel blades.

The sharper of the two edges has some scratches proximal to the bevel. Perhaps they had a chattering belt. It doesn't seem to change the edge as this was the better performing edge.

After testing, there is lots of small denting, but doesn't show any major chipping. It probably starts tugging too much continue using without ever getting rough and scratchy. These resilient steels tend to be a little less durable than the more brittle steels, but this one must be a little harder than some of the others, as this blade never actually hit a point of rapid deterioration during testing. It looks very smooth compared to other blades at this point.

Information Summary:

Date	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24	7/28/24
Blade	Gillette Platinum			China	November 1, 2023
Shaves	0	P3	P6	P9	P12
Location	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top
Medium	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29
Dulling Substrate	New	Paper	Paper	Paper	Paper
Measurements	30	30	30	30	30
Std. Dev.	15	19	22	26	22
Median F (g)	90	95	99.5	110.5	102.5
Mean F (g) Btm	88	86	95	90	97
Mean F (g) Top	101	116	118	126	122
Mean F (g)	95	101	107	108	110
BESS Adj. Factor	0.83	0.83	0.83	0.83	0.83
Av. Adj. F (g) Bt	73	72	79	75	81
Av. Adj. F (g) Top	84	96	98	105	101
Median adj. F (g)	75	79	83	92	85
Mean adj. F (g)	79	84	88	90	91

If you like a very mild blade, this might be a good one to try. It has some similarities to the old Russian blade, except that blade is quite sharp and this one, fairly dull.

Blade Sharpness Test Index

Complete Data

 

[Chandu]

I also managed to measure the new Chinese King C Gillette blade today. It looks excellent. It is very sharp and consistent, quite durable, and looks smooth under a microscope.

It comes in a big box.

View attachment 1876950

View attachment 1876951


View attachment 1876952

View attachment 1876953

The primary bevel of the blade is finely and evenly ground. The honing isn't super even, but that may be a result of it being at an angle only slightly shallower than the primary bevel. The coating is moderate, and slightly uneven, probably it stuck unevenly because of how the honing is. The uneven part is pretty far from the apex, so it probably doesn't matter, but maybe you can feel it. I can't say as I haven't tried it yet.

View attachment 1876954

After testing, the blade shows a typical level of chipping along its edge, the coating is gone, and the bevel is smoothed out somewhat.

View attachment 1876955

Information Summary:

Date	7/12/24	7/12/24	7/12/24	7/12/24	7/12/24
Blade	King C Gillette	China			November 14, 2023
Shaves	0	P3	P6	P9	P12
Location	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top
Medium	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29
Dulling Substrate	New	Stpl Ppr Rubr Push	Stpl Ppr Rubr Push	Stpl Ppr Rubr Push	Stpl Ppr Rubr Push
Measurements	30	30	30	30	30
Std. Dev.	10	10	12	11	12
Median F (g)	69.5	68	75.5	81	86.5
Mean F (g) Btm	69	66	77	79	80
Mean F (g) Top	70	69	77	89	94
Mean F (g)	69	68	77	84	87
BESS Adj. Factor	0.83	0.83	0.83	0.83	0.83
Av. Adj. F (g) Bt	57	55	64	66	67
Av. Adj. F (g) Top	58	57	64	74	78
Median adj. F (g)	58	56	63	67	72
Mean adj. F (g)	58	56	64	70	72

View attachment 1876949

This is what I like to see! It is very sharp, very consistent, and quite durable. I would compare it to the Bic CP and the better of the two Russian Nacets I tested in terms of sharpness and durability, but it probably feels different from them due to the finer grind on the primary bevel and the steep honing angle.

Complete Data:

Date	7/12/24	7/12/24	7/12/24	7/12/24	7/12/24
Blade	King C Gillette	China			November 14, 2023
Shaves	0	P3	P6	P9	P12
Location	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top	Bottom/Top
Medium	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29	Stren 8 .29
Dulling Substrate	New	Stpl Ppr Rubr Push	Stpl Ppr Rubr Push	Stpl Ppr Rubr Push	Stpl Ppr Rubr Push
Measurements	30	30	30	30	30
Std. Dev.	10	10	12	11	12
Median F (g)	69.5	68	75.5	81	86.5
Mean F (g) Btm	69	66	77	79	80
Mean F (g) Top	70	69	77	89	94
Mean F (g)	69	68	77	84	87
F (g) 1	90	65	77	75	72
F (g) 2	74	69	84	81	87
F (g) 3	74	67	65	66	90
F (g) 4	80	50	71	80	97
F (g) 5	73	74	86	96	85
F (g) 6	69	61	93	95	73
F (g) 7	83	69	84	81	79
F (g) 8	69	74	75	59	89
F (g) 9	54	43	56	84	80
F (g) 10	72	48	64	73	75
F (g) 11	64	84	70	79	71
F (g) 12	66	77	76	77	58
F (g) 13	57	77	83	67	82
F (g) 14	67	71	97	93	86
F (g) 15	43	66	72	79	79
F (g) 16	78	78	79	95	109
F (g) 17	67	77	64	104	96
F (g) 18	64	52	65	80	85
F (g) 19	70	73	106	79	92
F (g) 20	75	67	89	75	77
F (g) 21	58	64	68	78	88
F (g) 22	65	65	68	100	93
F (g) 23	73	76	87	99	84
F (g) 24	68	67	63	98	107
F (g) 25	73	59	74	84	104
F (g) 26	72	79	76	83	92
F (g) 27	68	74	70	105	103
F (g) 28	57	66	74	89	78
F (g) 29	84	67	81	87	100
F (g) 30	73	71	98	79	95

I am happy to recommend trying the new Chinese King C Gillette blade.

They need to quit making blades because these are NOT better than the ones they made in Russia.

 

[helicopter]

They need to quit making blades because these are NOT better than the ones they made in Russia.

The Chinese KCG blade is one of the best blades in current production with direct US distribution. I will wait to test the Russian one before making a comparison. There are examples of replacements of Russian war blades that are just as good, like the Indian Astra, and others that fall short, like the Chinese Platinum. So far, some of the Russian blades are better, but not all of them.

We can tell a lot about a blade by measuring it, artificially wearing it, and looking at it under a microscope. Outside of coating characteristics unrelated to durability, such as lubricity, there isn't much we can't see and measure with the tools I am using. Sure, an electron scanning microscope, alloy spectroscopy, and a robotic tester could improve the process tremendously, but my tools are the best I see anyone out there using currently to evaluate individual blades. I would love to see others jump on the bandwagon doing something similar.

I don't grow enough facial hair to use every blade I measure ten to fifty times to provide a thorough subjective analysis, but I do shave every day. I can see how my measurements align with my personal experience. I don't really think I have a ton to offer in terms of subjective blade reviews, though, other than as they help understanding of my measurements. There are already a plethora of subjective reviews out there written by highly competent and knowledgeable people.

If I didn't have a way to evaluate blades objectively, I might be out here espousing how all of the discontinued Russian blades in my hoard are the best steel ever to grace God's earth, but I would rather spend my time providing people with useful and objective information.

 

[cranewarrior]

It's all about perspective. If one is looking to continue to buy the exact same blade, like the formerly made in Russia KCG, I could understand disappointment if the new product has changed. On the other hand, if one is evaluating a product on its own merits, the final accounting could very well end it up differently.

I enjoy the Chinese KCG very much. It is easy to purchase and it works excellently for me rated against other good options like the Gillette Minora Stainless or the Gillette 7 o'clock Sharpedge. Is it exactly the same as the old PPI KCG? Apparently not, but for me that's OK. For others, not so much, and I guess the quest has to go on.

 

[T Bone]

I'm withholding comments on the Personnas until this one is tested:
View attachment 1884770

Maybe I’m remembering wrong (Personnas are so confusing), but aren’t those the same blades as the German Reds (or Israeli Reds, if they’re older) packaged for a different market? The German Reds at least have already been tested.

 

[Sweeney_]

Maybe I’m remembering wrong (Personnas are so confusing), but aren’t those the same blades as the German Reds (or Israeli Reds, if they’re older) packaged for a different market? The German Reds at least have already been tested.

I suspect they are... or not. Hence the reason to test them is to answer your question conclusively.

 

[T Bone]

I suspect they are... or not. Hence the reason to test them is to answer your question conclusively.

Gotcha, so not to see how they stack up against everything else, but to see if they’re the same blade as the Reds.

Actually, that would be good for other blades that are suspected of being the same but not known for sure… Dorco ST300 vs ST301 (cardboard vs plastic tucks), Personna lab blues vs med preps, many many Lord blades,…

 

[Sweeney_]

Gotcha, so not to see how they stack up against everything else, but to see if they’re the same blade as the Reds.

Actually, that would be good for other blades that are suspected of being the same but not known for sure… Dorco ST300 vs ST301 (cardboard vs plastic tucks), Personna lab blues vs med preps, many many Lord blades,…

I really enjoy these blade test because he answers a lot of questions that nag at me. Like a splinter in the back of my mind, to quote Morpheus.

The test between pre and post June, 2020 Wizamets was a good example.
Your previous post brings up another:

The blades on the right. I've seen multiple claims that they're made in Israel but no proof. Yes, they probably are but there is nothing, zilch, nada on the box or tuck to indicate where they were made, just
Superior Technology from American Safety Razor Co., USA.
My Israeli Reds say Blades made in Israel right on the tuck and hanger. Yes, they may very well be the same blade/steel/grind but a test could answer that definitively.

So for me, that is one of the great side benefits of the tests and tedious work Dan is doing here and I hope I'm speaking for all of us by saying...
Thank You!