EJ89 to 34C to ??

Good luck with the R41. That should feed your need for aggressiveness since its pretty much the most aggressive razor on the market. Since you asked about my razors, I would say that my Fatip is pretty much in a league of its own for aggressiveness in my collection. But once tamed, it can deliver a smooth shave. I assume the R41 is similar. For daily use, I prefer milder razors like the Merkurs and the Red Tip. The Red Tip is very smooth and easy to use, yet quite efficient.

tankerjohn said:

Good luck with the R41. That should feed your need for aggressiveness since its pretty much the most aggressive razor on the market. Since you asked about my razors, I would say that my Fatip is pretty much in a league of its own for aggressiveness in my collection. But once tamed, it can deliver a smooth shave. I assume the R41 is similar. For daily use, I prefer milder razors like the Merkurs and the Red Tip. The Red Tip is very smooth and easy to use, yet quite efficient.

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The red tips look really cool, I would love to own one some day. How would you compare it with a 34c or other more mild modern Mercury's, EJs, etc?

Driver said:

The red tips look really cool, I would love to own one some day. How would you compare it with a 34c or other more mild modern Mercury's, EJs, etc?

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This what I said in a different thread:

"Imagine a razor with the efficiency of the HD, but exponentially smoother. Like, it doesn't even feel like a blade is touching your face-smooth. But then you notice the water in the sink is full of stubble and your mug is smooth as glass and its like daaaaaam! Anyway, Red Tip - great razor."

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/463124-Next-step-from-a-Merkur-34C?p=8454352#post8454352

Interesting. I actually like to be able to really feel where the blade is, hence my interest in trying the R41

The Mühle R41 is technically closed-comb but it is not a bar design and it is often categorized as open comb. It sets a standard for aggressiveness that can be beat by no-comb, such as a shavette, devette, or straight.
I don't really think it makes much difference but if I went around again with my own money, I may have first dabbled into slants instead of the R41. The long and heavy handled 39C is a good slant choice.

The idea of a slant doesn't suit my fancy for some reason. I like things to be "square" in life when I can control them!

I am aware of the ongoing debate on how open the comb really is on the R41. Regardless I understand it is aggressive such that one doesnt lose track of the feel of the blade. We shall see! May give the first go tomorrow night.

I'm still trying to master my Edwin Jagger.

I'm days go well, some days don't go so well.

Locked and loaded, pictured below.

Interesting how long the stock R41 handle feels. Very nice look and we'll made, but seems longer than I would prefer. The grande must be massive. The Bulldog is much shorter but not as short as my 34c. I Already love the look and feel loaded onto the Weber Bulldog. Hope the shave will match!

The R41 has finally been unleashed. What follows is my positive review of my first shave with this venerable beast.

To begin, a few comments on fit and finish. The Weber Bulldog handle is a work of art, combining a clean industrial appeal with the tactile performance of deep knurling in heavy cold steel. Added to the beautiful, large R41 head, the unit becomes a substantial instrument that immediately commands respect. The polished chrome head slightly mismatches the matted steel color of the handle, but not so much as to meaningfully degrade the overall appearance of a high quality tool.

Now on to the performance. This is the closest shave I have ever received, but it was not without (minor) blood! I was working with a 1.5 day beard after a solid bbs shave the preceding morning with my 34c. The first wtg pass was amazing. I have never removed so much hair with one pass. Immediately I felt and respected the blade. Never will you lose track of where the blade is in the R41! I did my best to minimize pressure though I could probably do better. The second xtg pass was extremely efficient on my cheeks. This razor sings with Audible feedback and cuts so efficiently it is incredible. One particular area at the bottom handle of my goatee is extremely rough and notoriously difficult to cut close. The R41 was so beautifully efficient and powerful there I was amazed. My problems began on the jawline and the xtg pass on the neck. I did not find the perfect angle or pressure here. Thus while I shaved clean in most places I was not efficient in a few spots. This brings me to the atg pass in which I also did not find the perfect angle on those same spots which probably were not as smooth as they should have been prior to attempting atg. This led to several nicks on the final pass in these areas of the neck, but not deep as they self healed under final cold water and after shave lotion (John Masters Organics).

12 hours later and the result is a shave that remains bbs on the cheeks with just a hint of roughage underneath - closer even than my best efforts with the 34c, which have been some very nice shaves. I notice no additional burn or discomfort despite the closeness of the shave. Quite the opposite, I feel extremely smooth and very comfortable. I hope to achieve a smoother and more efficient shave below the chin but overall I am extremely pleased with my first R41 shave. The level of aggressiveness is in a different world for the 89 and the 34c. This makes for a very different experience which is very enjoyable. I look forward to continuing to use both going forward and hope to find the optimal rotation. I now love both and continue to revel in a daily shave closer and more comfortable than I ever would have dreamed possible when I began this journey last December.

A further note on the R41 after another day of practice (Astra SP) blade. A steeper angle of attack is particularly vital as others have noted. Also, I believe my ultimate pass progression will be different vs the 34c. 3 passes with an atg is perhaps closer and more aggressive than required- though I may still not have technique down with this beast. For now I am sticking to wtg and 1-2 xtgs, which is still extremely close.

I went from a 34C to a 37C and haven't looked back. Slant razors are where it is at.

I have found it quite difficult to switch back and forth between the 34c and the R41 now that I am more used to the R41. They are just so drastically different in efficiency and feel. Now when going back to the 34c I find it annoying how many passes I need to take to get close to the same result. It's sort of a shame became I really liked the 34c before. The better I get with the R41 the more unsatisfactory my results when I come back the the 34c.

I am still not perfect with the R41 but getting better by the week and getting ridiculously close shaves. I still draw small self healers with every shave but they don't seem to show up after in irritation. I am addicted to the efficiency and hope with better technique I can achieve a bit more smoothness and comfort.

WallMatt said:

I went from a 34C to a 37C and haven't looked back. Slant razors are where it is at.

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Will a 37c head fit on my webber handle? I've pretty much decided anything else I add to the quiver must fit my Bulldog.

I read your original post and your story sounds somewhat like mine. I too started with DE razors recently. April of this year. I started with a pif of a Razorock razor. Not sure what model but it was the first one I used. Unfortunately I could never get the blade to align properly so the exposure was different on each side. I quickly bought a Merkur 34C HD and then bought an EJ DE89 with a Knurled Handle. Where you and I differ is I then started taking an interest in vintage razors and bought a few Techs. Mild razors but they suited my technique at the time. I then bought a couple NEWs. A short and long comb. At the time my technique still wasn't there and I found I got too much irritation. I then bought a couple Old Types. I loved those. And just like you, I bought a Muhle R41. I've used it twice with success and had similar results as you. For me I think the R41 is a razor that I like when I haven't shaved in 2 or 3 days. But I don't think it is a daily driver for me. I recently went back to my NEW short comb and love it. Clearly, as you can see, I have (or had) RAD. My only suggestion to you is why not try some vintage razors? Since you like the more aggressive razors, try a NEW or an Old Type. Or better yet, both. They can be found on the bay for reasonable prices with some patience. I'm cheap and have never paid more than $35 for a razor and often pay between $15 and $25. You just may find those older open comb razors will satisfy your desire for some aggressiveness but in a razor that can be used on a daily basis and that are smooth and comfortable. And if you want to feed your RAD and replace your EJ, you might like the EJ DE89 Kelvin which is only available on amazon. It has a textured handle so your grip will be good but the handle is shorter than your dented EJ, similar to the Merkur 34C. I also have the longer DE89 handle and have thought about buying the Kelvin to see if I like it better. It sure sounds like you are enjoying your DE journey and have jumped in with both feet. Welcome to the club and may the blade be with you.

MntnMan62 said:

I read your original post and your story sounds somewhat like mine. I too started with DE razors recently. April of this year. I started with a pif of a Razorock razor. Not sure what model but it was the first one I used. Unfortunately I could never get the blade to align properly so the exposure was different on each side. I quickly bought a Merkur 34C HD and then bought an EJ DE89 with a Knurled Handle. Where you and I differ is I then started taking an interest in vintage razors and bought a few Techs. Mild razors but they suited my technique at the time. I then bought a couple NEWs. A short and long comb. At the time my technique still wasn't there and I found I got too much irritation. I then bought a couple Old Types. I loved those. And just like you, I bought a Muhle R41. I've used it twice with success and had similar results as you. For me I think the R41 is a razor that I like when I haven't shaved in 2 or 3 days. But I don't think it is a daily driver for me. I recently went back to my NEW short comb and love it. Clearly, as you can see, I have (or had) RAD. My only suggestion to you is why not try some vintage razors? Since you like the more aggressive razors, try a NEW or an Old Type. Or better yet, both. They can be found on the bay for reasonable prices with some patience. I'm cheap and have never paid more than $35 for a razor and often pay between $15 and $25. You just may find those older open comb razors will satisfy your desire for some aggressiveness but in a razor that can be used on a daily basis and that are smooth and comfortable. And if you want to feed your RAD and replace your EJ, you might like the EJ DE89 Kelvin which is only available on amazon. It has a textured handle so your grip will be good but the handle is shorter than your dented EJ, similar to the Merkur 34C. I also have the longer DE89 handle and have thought about buying the Kelvin to see if I like it better. It sure sounds like you are enjoying your DE journey and have jumped in with both feet. Welcome to the club and may the blade be with you.

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Thanks for your reply. I would like to get into purchasing vintage, especially if the heads fit my webber handle. My hesitancy has been due to the buying process of used razors. I guess if it can be done via eBay maybe it isn't so difficult after all.

I am still figuring out whether the R41 will be my long term daily driver. I love it though Some days I feel it may be too much for family use. but each week I find new ways to use it that make me think I am getting there with my technique. I understand where you and others come from who only use it with more days growth. I think I may get there yet as a daily driver.

Earlier issues I had with the R41 stemmed from techniques brought over from my 34c- stretching skin and going against the grain without abandon. From reading about straight razors on these forums, and applying tips therefrom, I have learned to treat it more like a straight in terms of care taken and issues that can arise. I now take only two passes wtg and diagonal xtg, and one clean up without any stretching and have had very promising results with less irritation. I also have developed new very delicate technique for the neck that is helping. I am definitely pleased with the progress and will continue on.

I still do not know whether steeper or more shallow angles are better for me. I have read a higher angle (blade to face) is ideal for the R41.

Driver said:

Thanks for your reply. I would like to get into purchasing vintage, especially if the heads fit my webber handle. My hesitancy has been due to the buying process of used razors. I guess if it can be done via eBay maybe it isn't so difficult after all.

I am still figuring out whether the R41 will be my long term daily driver. I love it though Some days I feel it may be too much for family use. but each week I find new ways to use it that make me think I am getting there with my technique. I understand where you and others come from who only use it with more days growth. I think I may get there yet as a daily driver.

Earlier issues I had with the R41 stemmed from techniques brought over from my 34c- stretching skin and going against the grain without abandon. From reading about straight razors on these forums, and applying tips therefrom, I have learned to treat it more like a straight in terms of care taken and issues that can arise. I now take only two passes wtg and diagonal atg, and one clean up without any stretching and have had very promising results with less irritation. I also have developed new very delicate technique for the neck that is helping. I am definitely pleased with the progress and will continue on.

I still do not know whether steeper or more shallow angles are better for me. I have read a higher angle (blade to face) is ideal for the R41.

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I've found that with the R41 and the open comb vintage gillettes, I need to maintain a steep angle. Which means the handle is farther away from my face. I have heard others describe it as a steep angle provides a blade angle that slices the hair off your face while a more shallow angle, with the razor handle closer to the face, results in more of a scraping of the hair off the face. When I heard it put that way, and from my own conscious effort to keep an eye on my technique, I make sure my angle is steep and I listen to the sound feedback I get from the razor and my results have been much better. Closer shaves, less weepers, less irritation. And I found that using that same approach with every razor I get better shaves. I just like the vintage razors better because the heads tend to be smaller making them more maneuverable around my upper lip and nose area. I think you would like the open comb razors. And yes, the bay isn't bad for finding razors. I have bought a total of 7 vintage razors with 5 of them on the bay and the other two on etsy. I don't find myself at antique stores or yard sales but I imagine the prices at those venues would be better. Just be sure to check the pictures really carefully and ask questions before buying. It can save a lot of heartache.

MntnMan62 said:

I've found that with the R41 and the open comb vintage gillettes, I need to maintain a steep angle. Which means the handle is farther away from my face. I have heard others describe it as a steep angle provides a blade angle that slices the hair off your face while a more shallow angle, with the razor handle closer to the face, results in more of a scraping of the hair off the face. When I heard it put that way, and from my own conscious effort to keep an eye on my technique, I make sure my angle is steep and I listen to the sound feedback I get from the razor and my results have been much better. Closer shaves, less weepers, less irritation. And I found that using that same approach with every razor I get better shaves. I just like the vintage razors better because the heads tend to be smaller making them more maneuverable around my upper lip and nose area. I think you would like the open comb razors. And yes, the bay isn't bad for finding razors. I have bought a total of 7 vintage razors with 5 of them on the bay and the other two on etsy. I don't find myself at antique stores or yard sales but I imagine the prices at those venues would be better. Just be sure to check the pictures really carefully and ask questions before buying. It can save a lot of heartache.

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It's confusing but it's actually the opposite: steep angle is handle closer to the face. I had to searcher around on here a while back myself to figure that out but point taken.

People talk about a steep angle with the R41 but a shallow angle with an ATT H2. A bit counterintuitive given the R41 is the most aggressive razor and a steeper angle would also cut closer in theory.

Driver said:

Will a 37c head fit on my webber handle? I've pretty much decided anything else I add to the quiver must fit my Bulldog.

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I'm not sure. But I'm convinced the Weber bulldog handle makes any razor better for me. It's the perfect size and weight and knurling. I recently put mine on my Razorock 6S and I feel its significantly easier to maneuver now!

Javelin said:

I'm not sure. But I'm convinced the Weber bulldog handle makes any razor better for me. It's the perfect size and weight and knurling. I recently put mine on my Razorock 6S and I feel its significantly easier to maneuver now!

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It's such an awesome handle! I think I fits most heads and I intend to pretty much look for stuff that just fits it, since I have already made the investment in such a great handle

Talking about stirling soap they have two that have virtually no scent. I have the one without bees wax and it is now almost the only thing I use. I mention unscented because they have many scents and if you just want to try their soap I would try that one.

Edit: I got a sample puck and pressed it into a 4 Oz spice jar from Walmart. You don't need more than that to sample and it will last you a while.