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Figure 8 stroke, anyone?

A

aephilli

After reading about parallel to edge strokes and spine leading strokes and seeing the old manuscript mentioning figure "8" strokes, I started thinking... (watch out, it may get dangerous)

I've tried what I'm calling a "squared" figure 8 stroke and want input from everyone.

I start with hone in left hand and place the razor at the far end, edge to me (spine away) toe just on the right side of hone. Then draw the razor to me and to the right, making the \ of the X. Then instead of flipping and completeing a standard X on the away stroke, I leave razor on hone and slide it straight to the left making a _ stroke followed by away and to the right completing the first 3/4 of the figure 8. At this point I've moved the razor across the hone in this pattern X. Then still on the hone, move razor to the left completing the pattern. So without lifting the razor I have an edge leading, two parallel to edge, and one spine leading strokes. Ten or twenty of these and then flip and do the other side of the razor, repeat as needed, then reducing to 5 each side then 3, etc
On a coti, it seems to leave a "hazy" finish on the bevel kinda like a jnat finish instead of the "fine scratch pattern" of the coti using standard X strokes.
Hoping this will preclude any "wire edge" or "fin" problems like the sideways and spine leading strokes are said to help with.

Any input, ideas, critique, or cautions y'all wanna add?
 
eKretz

eKretz

Hmm, I think maybe you should go for a Monaco or Spa de Francorchamps stroke, lol.

Or in other words, maybe you're overcomplicating things a little, haha!
 
A

aephilli

eKretz said:
Hmm, I think maybe you should go for a Monaco or Spa de Francorchamps stroke, lol.

Or in other words, maybe you're overcomplicating things a little, haha!
Click to expand...

:lol: (some of my "circles" do resemble those courses)

So far, my honing has been more Fosbury FLOP, so trying anything I can think of.....
 
A

aephilli

P.S. it's not near as complicated as it sounds, basically you are just doing an X stroke on one side of the blade both ways, not flipping to the other side of the blade for the other stroke of the X
(you gotta slide the blade across the stone to get back to the top of the X for the next stroke anyway)
 
Last edited:
Seraphim

Seraphim

Be sure to employ the FrancoBelgian grip. The use of the Russian grip will be far to strong to attain smooth detache' strokes.
 
A

aephilli

Seraphim said:
Be sure to employ the FrancoBelgian grip. The use of the Russian grip will be far to strong to attain smooth detache' strokes.
Click to expand...

If I'da been smart enuff to figure out how to use yer films, I wouldn't have this problem.... :lol:

(so, what yer sayin' is, if yer light in the loafers and limp wristed "frenchie" style, yer good, but if yer more solid russkie "is strong, like bull" style, ya may be overpowerin' it?)
 
SliceOfLife

SliceOfLife

aephilli said:
After reading about parallel to edge strokes and spine leading strokes and seeing the old manuscript mentioning figure "8" strokes, I started thinking... (watch out, it may get dangerous)

I've tried what I'm calling a "squared" figure 8 stroke and want input from everyone.

I start with hone in left hand and place the razor at the far end, edge to me (spine away) toe just on the right side of hone. Then draw the razor to me and to the right, making the \ of the X. Then instead of flipping and completeing a standard X on the away stroke, I leave razor on hone and slide it straight to the left making a _ stroke followed by away and to the right completing the first 3/4 of the figure 8. At this point I've moved the razor across the hone in this pattern X. Then still on the hone, move razor to the left completing the pattern. So without lifting the razor I have an edge leading, two parallel to edge, and one spine leading strokes. Ten or twenty of these and then flip and do the other side of the razor, repeat as needed, then reducing to 5 each side then 3, etc
On a coti, it seems to leave a "hazy" finish on the bevel kinda like a jnat finish instead of the "fine scratch pattern" of the coti using standard X strokes.
Hoping this will preclude any "wire edge" or "fin" problems like the sideways and spine leading strokes are said to help with.

Any input, ideas, critique, or cautions y'all wanna add?
Click to expand...


I find that strokes parallel to the direction of the spine/length of blade are about the only way you can damage a razor edge on a hone held flat. It has the potential to create an edge geometry of greater than 180* arc, which can cause weakness in the edge.
 
Seraphim

Seraphim

aephilli said:
If I'da been smart enuff to figure out how to use yer films, I wouldn't have this problem.... :lol:

(so, what yer sayin' is, if yer light in the loafers and limp wristed "frenchie" style, yer good, but if yer more solid russkie "is strong, like bull" style, ya may be overpowerin' it?)
Click to expand...

No, I was just busting your chops for making things seem too complicated.

Up and back, back and forth, straight up and down the hone doesn't seem to matter too much in my experience.

However, having the pinky finger extended whilst honing will make you feel like Lord Fonteleroy if that's your thing....:tongue_sm
 
Gamma

Gamma

SliceOfLife said:
I find that strokes parallel to the direction of the spine/length of blade are about the only way you can damage a razor edge on a hone held flat. It has the potential to create an edge geometry of greater than 180* arc, which can cause weakness in the edge.
Click to expand...

Interesting - continue pls.
 
A

aephilli

SliceOfLife said:
I find that strokes parallel to the direction of the spine/length of blade are about the only way you can damage a razor edge on a hone held flat. It has the potential to create an edge geometry of greater than 180* arc, which can cause weakness in the edge.
Click to expand...

OK, so maybe actual rounded figure 8s... back to the drawing board (again)
 
B

buca3152

I never found a reason to do a figure 8. I just use whatever stroke will match the blade. As far as sideways strokes go, I used to wipe scratches at the 5k to verify there are no rogue scratches left from coarser grit I never had an issue with a weak edge or chipping when I used that at all.
 
Seraphim

Seraphim

aephilli said:
I want to say that is where I got the figure 8 idea too. Not positive but pretty sure.
Click to expand...

Doesn't really matter. He was as opinionated as the rest of us.

Find out whatever works for you, and go with it.

Figure 8s

Lightning bolt zig zags

Back and forth flipper flops


It really doesn't matter that much.
 
B

buca3152

Well there are 2 kinds of strokes, edge refinement and polishing, Although this loop de loop figure 8 may have them all wrapped up in one! A microwaveable edge if you will.
 
A

aephilli

buca3152 said:
Well there are 2 kinds of strokes, edge refinement and polishing, Although this loop de loop figure 8 may have them all wrapped up in one! A microwaveable edge if you will.
Click to expand...

At first I thought "no way", but since buca said it, I figured I'd try.




















I gotta go shop for a new microwave now.........
 
Doorsch

Doorsch

Here is a Video from a german guys mentioning that his grandfather did the strokes in the way moving like an 8. also he shows edge leading strokes.....

He is not really experienced how to really do it but its the tecnique he has seen from his grandfather....

I talked to several people also in germany and i was also on the search where the strokes in 8ths might have come from. I heard that it was a well used method from german barbers...

Go to 1:28min.:
http://youtu.be/tGaqok516Js

The method was mentioned on some Barber books f.ex. here:

"Essays on Barbers Razors, Razor Hones, Razor Strops and Razor Honing" by Napoleon LeBlanc, page 18

It says: "Then finish your honing on the usual way, taking a few short, light strokes in shape of the figure eight or letter x....

If anybody is interested:
https://archive.org/details/essayonbarbersra00lebl
 
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