Too much tugging?

[nuclearblast]

Interesting. I talk mostly from my own experience but you have quite a lot of experience in guiding people into wet shaving. OP: use Edgar's advise and steepen your angle!

No ... that's not what I said! [emoji38] I said a shallower angle would probably work better. Milder razors tend not to like steeper angles.

Anyway, this is just my opinion and it's worth as much as yours, not more that's for sure. What works for me may not work for you, or for the OP.

 

[lloydrm]

Ooops. Yeah, that what I ment

 

[alex2363]

No ... that's not what I said! [emoji38] I said a shallower angle would probably work better. Milder razors tend not to like steeper angles.

Anyway, this is just my opinion and it's worth as much as yours, not more that's for sure. What works for me may not work for you, or for the OP.

You Said it was too Steep.

 

[nuclearblast]

You Said it was too Steep.

Zactly, Alex.

A shallower angle will probably help. We don't know for sure, since the OP hasn't posted an update.

 

[lloydrm]

I edited my reply to avoid further confusion.
Sorry about that.
Gotta memorize these images (BTW, I believe these are original from Edgar but I better take that back and go confirm before I blow it again)
View attachment 568803View attachment 568804

 

[dionesius3]

That is a great illustration! I like the shallow angle and my skin likes the shallow angle, but yours may not, we each have our own preferred style. But to go back to the original point, the steep angle is in most cases more likely to cause tugging and in my case is more likely to cause razor burn, bumps, and irritation. It may not be true in every case, and that is why the terms need to be defined, and discussed, and brought up so often. The DE razor is one of those razors that angle makes a big difference in both the quality of the shave and the comfort of the shave.

I think what Edgar, myself, and others were trying to convey to the OP is that a majority will find that the shallower angle works better, some will find that the steep angle works better, and some use both angles on different parts of their face. Try it and see if it makes a difference, if it does then use it, if not then don't use it.

 

[Daiku]

No ... that's not what I said! [emoji38] I said a shallower angle would probably work better. Milder razors tend not to like steeper angles.

Anyway, this is just my opinion and it's worth as much as yours, not more that's for sure. What works for me may not work for you, or for the OP.

i certainly agree that milder razors, like my blue tips and Techs, work much better with a shallower angle. It's not only more comfortable for your face, but the shallow angle is actually more effective at mowing down the beard--at least for me.

 

[Blizzard]

Zactly, Alex.

A shallower angle will probably help. We don't know for sure, since the OP hasn't posted an update.

I was a bit confused at first because everyone was confusing steep and shallow angles
I think it's too early to post an update. I did have a couple of shaves since then, however I didn't find the ideal angle as of yet and the problem with the tugging still arises, however I do seem to get near BBS in the areas of lighter hair growth (like on my cheeks) which my SO liked a lot
Also, I just noticed that in a video someone mentioned that the speed of the movement of the razor should be not too fast but also not too slow - I noticed that I tend to go quite a bit slower in those regions (particularly on the jaw bone, since it's difficult to adjust to the change in angle), so I think I may try on my next shave to go a bit faster. I think it also makes sense, if I move too slowly, the razor barely has the energy to cut through the hair. I will post an update as to how it went once I figured it out!

 

[nuclearblast]

I was a bit confused at first because everyone was confusing steep and shallow angles
I think it's too early to post an update. I did have a couple of shaves since then, however I didn't find the ideal angle as of yet and the problem with the tugging still arises, however I do seem to get near BBS in the areas of lighter hair growth (like on my cheeks) which my SO liked a lot
Also, I just noticed that in a video someone mentioned that the speed of the movement of the razor should be not too fast but also not too slow - I noticed that I tend to go quite a bit slower in those regions (particularly on the jaw bone, since it's difficult to adjust to the change in angle), so I think I may try on my next shave to go a bit faster. I think it also makes sense, if I move too slowly, the razor barely has the energy to cut through the hair. I will post an update as to how it went once I figured it out!

IMO, short, quick strokes work better. Tentative strokes are definitely something you should avoid, it's much harder to control pressure and angle.

Find your own rhythm, doesn't have to be too fast, the most important is keeping a firm grip on the razor and your wrist locked. This will help you controlling the pressure and angle of the razor.

One other thing - you're still learning (I am too, I keep learning every day), don't obsess over BBS shaves. They'll happen eventually.

 

[nuclearblast]

I edited my reply to avoid further confusion.
Sorry about that.

Don't worry about that.

 

[sandstone]

Some folks can't go ATG, and that's fine. I never go ATG on mt sensitive areas (moustache, chin, some parts of my neck). I do multiple XTG passes (different directions) and get a very good shave.

+1 - there are areas i.e. my chin and neck just under the chin where ATG just ain't happenin' - no way, no how....

 

[alex2363]

I edited my reply to avoid further confusion.
Sorry about that.
Gotta memorize these images (BTW, I believe these are original from Edgar but I better take that back and go confirm before I blow it again)
View attachment 568803View attachment 568804

I blow more than Hootie does

 

[Blizzard]

Now I can do an update
Now I'm sure most people here will call me crazy, but alongside with my R89 head I ordered a R41 (2013 version) head from Muehle. I planned on using it once I got more experienced, but since I was so frustrated with the R89 I decided to give it a go, and it was the best decision ever.
I used the R41 with a Personna Med Prep blade, did a cold water shave since I heard a lot of good things about it and the first shave with it was fantastic. It was a lot better than what I ever got with the R89 and I got the feeling that the shave is much more comfortable now, I think the blade may have flexed too much with the R89, I got the feeling that the R41 holds the blade more tightly. What also helped me was pulling my skin up on the cheeks, just as many do for straight razor shaving, but I thought, if it works for straights why not for DE razors? That way I can avoid the jawbone and have less issues there. What really made the most of a difference was the switch to the R41, but also the cold water shave and the improvement in technique. I now have a setup which works for me and I will keep it like that for a month at least to improve my technique. I think what also made a big change was in technique that I noticed that my grip was not firm enough, I was trying to not apply pressure so I held the razor very loosely, leading to the angle switching around all the time. A firmer grip did wonders.
Today's shave was exceptional, it was my second shave with the R41 and I got BBS. I never had such a great shave ever in my life! Thanks to all of you guys for the tips! I very much like that with the R41 I don't really have to go ATG, on some spots it is even enough to go diagonal (as someone suggested in this thread) and that works very well.

 

[nuclearblast]

Congrats!

Yeah, skin stretching works nicely, I do it too. I also think ATG passes are unnecessary with the R41. It's a fantastic razor for sure.

Enjoy!

 

[matt267]

Awesome job!

 

[alex2363]

Now I can do an update
Now I'm sure most people here will call me crazy, but alongside with my R89 head I ordered a R41 (2013 version) head from Muehle. I planned on using it once I got more experienced, but since I was so frustrated with the R89 I decided to give it a go, and it was the best decision ever.
I used the R41 with a Personna Med Prep blade, did a cold water shave since I heard a lot of good things about it and the first shave with it was fantastic. It was a lot better than what I ever got with the R89 and I got the feeling that the shave is much more comfortable now, I think the blade may have flexed too much with the R89, I got the feeling that the R41 holds the blade more tightly. What also helped me was pulling my skin up on the cheeks, just as many do for straight razor shaving, but I thought, if it works for straights why not for DE razors? That way I can avoid the jawbone and have less issues there. What really made the most of a difference was the switch to the R41, but also the cold water shave and the improvement in technique. I now have a setup which works for me and I will keep it like that for a month at least to improve my technique. I think what also made a big change was in technique that I noticed that my grip was not firm enough, I was trying to not apply pressure so I held the razor very loosely, leading to the angle switching around all the time. A firmer grip did wonders.
Today's shave was exceptional, it was my second shave with the R41 and I got BBS. I never had such a great shave ever in my life! Thanks to all of you guys for the tips! I very much like that with the R41 I don't really have to go ATG, on some spots it is even enough to go diagonal (as someone suggested in this thread) and that works very well.

My 2 pet peeves are skin stretching and cold water applications.

 

[Blizzard]

My 2 pet peeves are skin stretching and cold water applications.

I agree, I do have a love-hate relationship with cold water shaves... The cold water is very uncomfortable at first but it really pays off in my opinion!

 

[Shawnboy]

Shave after shower is the best advice I can give you, that and time.

 

[alex2363]

I agree, I do have a love-hate relationship with cold water shaves... The cold water is very uncomfortable at first but it really pays off in my opinion!

It prevents irritation and swelling, also promotes healing.

 

[Blizzard]

Shave after shower is the best advice I can give you, that and time.

I tried that already, but as I've written earlier for me this lead to worse results compared to cold water shaving prior to showering. I got the feeling as if my skin was too loose after showering... But I guess as always, YMMV...