lynn abrams

[Kyle89]

It's interesting to me to read a few members here making light of a "method" that has helped many people learn how to hone. And yet, a few of you seem to have your own "method" that you are all too willing to share at any given chance as if what you do is the "be all, end all."

Is Lynn Abrams' "method" his own? Probably not because he more than likely learned from someone else older than he. Just like a few of you have passed on your "methods" of lapping films, balsa and other techniques that have helped others to include me. I have actually tried those methods that some here have suggested years ago. They weren't for me but I didn't post any snarky commentary on these threads back then, it would have been ungentlemanly. Likewise, I have some balsa arriving today so that I can try to see how pasted balsa would be any different in maintaining my edges as opposed to my current method of JNAT finishes to do that. I have tried 0.1u diamond paste on linen and that does improve edges significantly faster than pulling out the stones. My assumption is that balsa will be even smoother. However, if there is not a patent on a "method", it's just that. I think we've degraded the conversation into semantics. Lynn Abrams has my respect because he showed my how to get started and I've now been honing for over a decade.

In short, I have an open mind and a willingness to learn from some of you who were here before and after me. Let's not be too quick to make light of the contributions of other past and present. It really isn't very fitting of the caliber (or if you prefer calibre) of these discussion forums.

I mean, it seems like it's in jest/all in fun. It's the internet. People tend to act a little differently. There's certainly a perceived dominant way of doing things here and it's cool that there's a level of passion/wanting to get more people to try something new and different. Everyone has their ways though. As long as people are tinkering/playing/trying new things it adds quite a bit to the hobby. This also seems to raise egos and cause infighting but as my grandmother used to say, "boys will be boys".

At the end of the day, it's shaving. And a bit silly. Which is why I love it as a hobby.

 

[Darth Scandalous]

I found Lynn's videos to be really helpful. The thing about any successful "method" is it needs to be teachable and repeatable. That can make it seem kind of paint-by-numbers but it really gives a guy the chance to develop muscle memory while gaining a better understanding of the why behind it. And a chance to learn to read feedback from whatever medium he ends up using.

 

[Kyle89]

I found Lynn's videos to be really helpful. The thing about any successful "method" is it needs to be teachable and repeatable. That can make it seem kind of paint-by-numbers but it really gives a guy the chance to develop muscle memory while gaining a better understanding of the why behind it. And a chance to learn to read feedback from whatever medium he ends up using.

Yeah I found that those videos helpful in a sense to where it felt a lot more accessible to me. It was a lot more motivating to get started honing with a "here, get this stone and try this" versus reading a giant thread and obtaining materials to start a bit of a project going. That's just me though.

 

[JPO]

It's interesting to me to read a few members here making light of a "method" that has helped many people learn how to hone. And yet, a few of you seem to have your own "method" that you are all too willing to share at any given chance as if what you do is the "be all, end all."

Is Lynn Abrams' "method" his own? Probably not because he more than likely learned from someone else older than he. Just like a few of you have passed on your "methods" of lapping films, balsa and other techniques that have helped others to include me. I have actually tried those methods that some here have suggested years ago. They weren't for me but I didn't post any snarky commentary on these threads back then, it would have been ungentlemanly. Likewise, I have some balsa arriving today so that I can try to see how pasted balsa would be any different in maintaining my edges as opposed to my current method of JNAT finishes to do that. I have tried 0.1u diamond paste on linen and that does improve edges significantly faster than pulling out the stones. My assumption is that balsa will be even smoother. However, if there is not a patent on a "method", it's just that. I think we've degraded the conversation into semantics. Lynn Abrams has my respect because he showed my how to get started and I've now been honing for over a decade.

In short, I have an open mind and a willingness to learn from some of you who were here before and after me. Let's not be too quick to make light of the contributions of other past and present. It really isn't very fitting of the caliber (or if you prefer calibre) of these discussion forums.

Different edges from different systems/methods are just that, different. If someone tells me sushi is better then a hamburger, that dos not matter if i crave a hamburger. On a different day i might want sushi. Yesterday is shaved with a 0.1 micron CNB on balsa edge. Tomorrow i might wake up and like to use a coticule edge or a JNAT edge. I still have not found the JPO method edge
Sometimes i hone just to hone, but that is just me. Someone else might just wat to get things sharp and shave without caring about the process, and that is fine to.
I just don't want to get stuck with one solution for every problem.

I do still think this forum is more open minded then some other shaving related forums. Let's just hope it stays that way.

 

[Slash McCoy]

Different edges from different systems/methods are just that, different. If someone tells me sushi is better then a hamburger, that dos not matter if i crave a hamburger. On a different day i might want sushi. Yesterday is shaved with a 0.1 micron CNB on balsa edge. Tomorrow i might wake up and like to use a coticule edge or a JNAT edge. I still have not found the JPO method edge
Sometimes i hone just to hone, but that is just me. Someone else might just wat to get things sharp and shave without caring about the process, and that is fine to.
I just don't want to get stuck with one solution for every problem.

I do still think this forum is more open minded then some other shaving related forums. Let's just hope it stays that way.

If sushi is better than a hamburger, you are making your hamburger all wrong.

 

[Frank Shaves]

If sushi is better than a hamburger, you are making your hamburger all wrong.

I just saved this quote to my file of quotes.

 

[lightfoot]

I think one thing that often gets lost in terms of Mr. Abrams approach is that at the end of each segment on each stone is an opportunity to do some kind of a test. For example if at the end of 40 circles with pressure you find the edge to be lacking you go back and do that again. (If you weren’t at a good place after doing this 3X then you would need to drop back to a courser grit hone). If you’re good with the 40 circles with heavy pressure but not where you want to be with 40 circles with light pressure then you do the light pressure set again. And of course if you hit that 40 circles with heavy pressure and 40 circles with light pressure on the money the first time but found you were lacking after your 20 weight of the blade X-strokes then you can just do those 20 X-strokes again.
I would call it a kind of modular approach that allows for repeatability within the sub section of each phase and the ability to test at the same points.

 

[ebonysw45]

It worked for me and I still use my Norton 4000/8000 stone. I don't however use the pyramid method anymore. I also have a larger pool of stones, JNAT, Escher, Water of Ayr and Coticle and have watched many other honing videos. Taking from them those things I can use and discarding what doesn't work for me. Its hard when you start out and I'm still learning every time I put a blade to a hone. @GsSixgun is probably the best I've found and he has a number of youtube videos.

I will finish on the most important piece of advice I can give. Get the bevel set right and everything else will be easy. Fail at this first step and the results will be hit and miss.

 

[Gamma]

I talked with Lynn about something or another late last year. I have had several 'convos' in the not too distant past. I have enjoyed our discussions.
Lynn He is on the Straight Razor Place FB page, and the Straight Razor Place website. His original site, that he no longer runs, has morphed into something else under different leaders; it also has the initials SRP but those letters call out another moniker.

What people sometimes fail to realize is that there is only one 'method' - set the bevel and refine it.
How you set the bevel is nearly irrelevant so long as you actually get it set.
How that bevel gets refined is also irrelevant so long as the user likes the end result.
That's honing, that is the only honing 'method'. The rest of the hoopla exists for the sake of discussion and internet argument fodder. Tons of "My way or the highway" and "stop liking what I don't like" lead to people starting new forums and creating new 'methods'. I've never been a fan of any of it because I am more of a principals before personalities type. I am also very much a Keep it Super Simple kind of person. Convoluted ego riddled 'systems' don't interest me. Start at the bevel, learn to nail it, then move on in numerical order. Done. I understand that approach eludes some people, so the need to jump around and doing head stands to achieve the same thing seems attractive to them. To each their own. Many roads lead to Rome.

Lynn's internet news group got attention early on with the introduction of Pyramid honing. Then there was using circles to hone, but the 'method' that most discussion revolved around with the pyramid progression. He did not invent the pyramid thing btw, I forget who brought it to him but Llyn has always been transparent about where it came from. Not sure if using circles was his own thing or not. But both Pyramid honing and circle honing are often attributed to him because he was the most highly visible personality in the game.

Personally, I have not found circles to be a 'better way', although I will use them on low grit stones, usually when I am bored with honing out chips on a beat up blade. I don't like circles on higher grit stones, I have found that the inevitable erratic striations are problematic.

Pyramid honing, as prescribed, never did much for me, although I have spent time toggling back/forth from one stone to another in an effort to 'feel' what's going on side-by-side. I will go back to a 5k if my initial read on the 8k isn't satisfactory but I wouldn't call that pyramid honing. I am critical of the pyramid approach because I see it as training wheels that don't really help anyone feel or understand the process. I personally think a large part of the 'methodology' was designed to promote the use of the Norton combo stone which was being sold in huge numbers by the promoters of the system. The old SRP was once referred to as a 'State Run Press" and that may be part of the story. Factually though, many people got into pyramid honing and they got shaving edges when they were unable to do so any other way. Arguing about that is for someone else with more free time than I have to invest in it.

Back when that original newsgroup was ending and the internet forums were germinating, the Norton combo was just about the only thing known and/or accessible. Back then, using a 1k to bevel-set was nearly unheard of and frowned upon the know-it-alls.
Things have progressed, better stones are available. No one needs to rely on a narrow window of information being presented by a very small number of people anymore. Progress has been made on all fronts but since this is all hyper-personal there's nothing wrong with following any path.

Sure, I can hone on the N4/8k but I have no need to want to do that and every reason in the world to use other stones. Sure, I can rely on circle honing but I have been there and not found it to be useful for me. Yep, pyramid honing is do-able but I don't have troubles with honing straight through a progression of coarse to finer stones. But that's for me and what I do here in my home. What others do is up to them and their choices don't affect my edges in any way. And vice versa.

At the end of the day though, all of that stuff (circles, pyramids, etc) did a ton of good for the world of honing. It got people involved, it got them talking to each other, it promoted growth and understanding within this very small community. I am really glad those ideas and events paved the way for everyone that showed up afterwards, even if I don't subscribe to any of it.

 

[EspressoAndAftershave]

I still have his dvd from years ago. I like a lot of the info. on that dvd, still find it entertaining and informative, and it was/is a really cool dvd to have in the collection, but his pyramid progression, imo, made honing seem a lot harder and more confusing than it really needs to be. Once I discovered lapping film and pasted strops, I never looked back. Of course, YMMV, and all that...

He seemed like a really cool dude. His collection of straights was inspiring. Last I read, he retired. I wish him the best.

 

[Frank Shaves]

People forget that there was a world before YouTube was launched in Feb 2005. People had to do things like read, wait for film/video to be broadcast, buy/rent videos/cds, or go and watch things in person.