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Professor Flanders's Journal of Nerdy Observations and silly camaraderie

Thanks Jim!


Fine. The quality wasn't 💩, the 💩 wasn't wiped off before shipping! 😳
While the build may not have been 💩, the pre-shipping QA was...


jurassic park deal with it GIF
 

Flanders

Stupid sexy Wing Nut
Theory: handle weight is only really relevant to the desired overall razor weight so long as the handle length is correct for where the user intends to grip it.

Discussion: I have actually been thinking a lot lately, the last couple months, about Kim's monogamous relationship with his Ti Crown handles and his preference for a head heavy razor balance. I have also been thinking about how my own preferences are evolving, not just changing, after being exposed to heavier handles. I believe there are three areas that are worth investigating further:

- Where does the user grip the razor? Or rather, where does the overall combination cause them to grip?

- Does their shaving style predict and/or benefit from a certain balance? Are our preferences actually correct or should they vary based on the specific razor?

- Can we actually tailor the right handle weight and length combination to achieve the desired balance and overall weight? Specifically, can we actually accommodate a heavier or lighter razor without throwing off the balance by choosing a different length?

Back to the Ti Crown handles for a minute, or ten. What I keep thinking about is that the shape of the handle causes the user to grip the razor within a relatively limited area, or so it appears. Further, the handle has quite a protuberance below the grip section that no doubt adds weight to the bottom and hence shifts the balance away from the head. The Ti Crown handle is at least 10g lighter than a comparable handle with uniform diameter throughout its length. It's likely more because the handle is longer than other titanium handles that I have or have found measurements of. All of the weight is obviously removed from the grip section around the top half of the handle.

What I find an interesting thought experiment is whether Kim is placing his hand in the same spot that the razor seems to want you to with all of his different razor heads and is to some extent choosing them based on whether they will produce his desired balance instead of moving his hand in order to achieve this balance. This goes back to his Timeless experiments which were when I started thinking about this. This is not another jab at his beloved handles nor a value judgement towards him for sticking with what he enjoys, I only make those jokes in jest because it is so predictable that he will fit another Ti Crown handle to any new razor he acquires! This is a legitimate rethinking of what the effect of his choice has on the handling of any given razor fitted with one.

For me, I need to grip the handle between 50-60mm from the bottom of the handle for it to fit in my hand based on how I hold the razor. This has always seemed like an intractable problem, that I am stuck with short handles. What I had failed to realise, until I stumbled upon it, was as a handle gets longer, it gets heavier and the balance shifts downward. As the balance shifts downward, the hand has to move downward if the user wishes to maintain the same balance as previously. Therefore, I am still gripping the longer handle approximately the same distance from the bottom, but it is closer to the middle of the handle than the upper third. On the lower end of my range, the razor wants to fall out of my hand if I don't use enough fingers to stabilise it and on the upper end, the razor is inherently more stable. Is this in itself a problem or rather when does this go too far and become a problem? Does it matter if you have a larger amount of the handle above your grip, extending the distance to your face? I am going to say no, it does not(within reason). A good example is the long, thin Henson handles, there is a long distance from my fingers to my face with where I grip the handle. These handles have always been a mystery to me because I have tried other handles and returned to the stock handle(which doesn't appear to be to my preference). What matters is where you are gripping in relationship to the centre of mass, that is what will affect the handling of the razor. That and, at both extremes, the overall weight of the razor.

In a second post, I want to talk more about point #2 and discuss stability and manoeuvrability and how I think that may work for or against the user. This will get into using the handle at the two extremes, relatively speaking(not literally).
 
- Can we actually tailor the right handle weight and length combination to achieve the desired balance and overall weight? Specifically, can we actually accommodate a heavier or lighter razor without throwing off the balance by choosing a different length?

My short answer is "Yes". My long answer is...longer.

It is quite funny, as I nearly went off on a tangent about this yesterday when you mentioned my new Karve handle, but I thought nobody would be interested!

I think the factors are (perhaps obviously):

- Razor head weight
- Razor handle length
- Razor handle weight

These determine...

- Balance point

And that has to be right for...

- Hand size / Grip style

It's those last two points that really matter in terms of comfort and ergonmics. Total razor weight is easier to adapt to, albeit we all have our preferences in that regard too.

I could say more, but I will wait to see what else you have to say on the subject.
 
Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this, Aaron. A few thoughts of mine to add. I think these mostly align with your thinking. Any razor has a range of grip areas, depending on how one likes the balance. That range is much smaller than the length of the handle. While the Ti Crown handle has an obvious grip area, it is effectively more than the entire range most would want to use, it doesn't force you. I grip mine in different places, depending on which head I use. Unless I put a preposterously heavy head on it (like a Green Cult) I can easily get the balance where the head is weight is offset.

Another example is the Osprey. It has a heavy head and a much longer handle than I prefer. But that long length gives the leverage to counterbalance the head and I can get a good grip where the head is weightless. A counter example is the Athena. With the original handle, so much of the weight is up near the head that the balance is too picky for me and a Ti Crown handle works much better for me. I'm with you on the Henson as well, I don't really like how the handle looks, but it all comes together nicely as a full razor.
 
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Phoenixkh

I shaved a fortune
I'll throw a fly into the ointment.... I recently got a hybrid Rocnel Elite... The handle is the barrel kind... just straight, no curves machined in... and it's 85mm in length... I used it with the OEM handle several times... Then switched it out for the Ti Crown. I prefer the Ti Crown... I have wondered why. It could be because I used wood handle hammers for my decades as a working carpenter..... Their handles are octagon sort of oval design but have a relief in the middle and are wider at the base. They fit comfortably in my hand and I used to use one a lot as I started doing carpentry work before we had easy access to power nailers.

The Ti Crown fits my hand in the same way..... I did weight out all my razor heads.... They do vary quite a bit... I don't seem to notice the weight differences when I shave. It's possible my grip changes based on the razor head, but I've never noticed it.

The thing I notice when using SS handles is the balance doesn't feel right.... the weight feels like the handle is bearing down on me, if that makes sense. When I change to a titanium or hollow bronze handle, the razor feels more like my hammers.... The weight is tilted toward the head, as I've mentioned many times... Imagine a hammer where most of the weight is in the handle.... The hammer head is what does the work.. not the handle. I view razors the same way, I guess. I realize this is totally subjective.

It does seem to me that I am taking out a variable in the shaving process... If I don't have to adjust to differing handle weights, I'm only adjusting my shaving technique for the razor head itself.... This could be an error on my part, but it seems to be working.

You also know, all my razors fit into a narrow efficiency range. I have noticed, some people like a full range for their razors... the very mild to the very aggressive. That isn't me. There's nothing wrong with that, of course... They get pleasure from choosing the efficiency they need for a particular day and beard growth, at least, that is my take.

That's what I love about this hobby.... I shouldn't speak for all of us, but those of us who like variety in our razors are a bit eccentric....Maybe even a little peculiar. This isn't intended as an insult... I think things like this make humans an interesting species. If we were all the same, how boring would that be? Those of us who have pets know.... each of them has its own unique personality... their own quirks... The same can be said for all species in the animal kingdom. We fit in well.... Humans are all odd creatures, don't you think?
 

Flanders

Stupid sexy Wing Nut
Apologies for skipping any comments, but these are where I was headed...
(I didn't get enough sleep last night and wasn't going to type any messages today, but...)

While the Ti Crown handle has an obvious grip area, it is effectively more than the entire range most would want to use, it doesn't force you. I grip mine in different places, depending on which head I use.
The Ti Crown fits my hand in the same way..... I did weight out all my razor heads.... They do vary quite a bit... I don't seem to notice the weight differences when I shave. It's possible my grip changes based on the razor head, but I've never noticed it.
This is the kind of information that I was looking for and don't have access to, but it also confirms what I had suspected about Kim's Preferences. I still do wonder where the balance point is on the handle by itself, is it centred on the grip area?

So, while the effective grip area is generous, Kim believes that he is only using part of it as I suspected. Why else would he need to fine tune the weight of a Timeless head if he could simply move his hand down a tiny bit? The answer appears to be that he could, but as suspected he doesn't. I am not sure how much value this observation has, but at least it satisfies my curiosity.

The thing I notice when using SS handles is the balance doesn't feel right.... the weight feels like the handle is bearing down on me, if that makes sense.
This right here is what I was going to get to. You value manoeuvrability over stability to the point that stability feels wrong. By adding more weight to the handle, the balance is obviously moved down and therefore the razor wants to tilt that direction. I could see how it would feel like you are fighting it going from a deliberate head heavy balance, not just neutral that I believe most of us aim for.

Imagine a hammer where most of the weight is in the handle.... The hammer head is what does the work.. not the handle.
Shaving with the head trying to tilt down is potentially more interesting to me; it would feel more agile because it is more manoeuvrable, but could easily become too much to control(no stability). To further drag Kim into this, he shaves by placing the safety bar and lifting the handle up, I think part of the reason this works well for him is his relatively mild razors. The head is naturally trying to tilt down and engage the blade so the amount of lifting feels like less effort not necessarily because his handles are lighter. He could achieve the same effect with heavier handles, but only if he could find a comfortable grip lower on the handle. I suspect that he would need a 100mm(+ or -) handle for it to feel comfortable being gripped lower. But then the weight is even higher, I assume this is why long skinny handles exist. The Blutt handle has always been a weird one for me, along with the Athena, where the area to be gripped is rigidly defined and it's not in a place where I would be able to grip comfortably nor would Kim be able to get the balance moved by moving his grip down. Then again, the maker is probably trying to build in stability to the design by defining where he wants you to grip it. This might explain a lot about modern CNC razor designs that have puzzled me for a long time with their heavy, solid handles.

The flip side of this where I think this isn't a good approach, and have mentioned it offhand before, is with aggressive razors. I think the problem is two fold: one is the blade always returning to resting against your skin if the handle isn't managed carefully and two, the extra manoeuvrability could be a liability with positive blade exposure. I suppose a third would be for ultra steep shavers who really should have a handle heavy balance, not just neutral, to keep the handle parallel to their face and increase stability as they attempt to keep the blade just barely skimming the surface. I would like to know more about why they think they like ultra light handles, do they grip them up near the head to keep the balance normal?

For myself and a few others I know, our style isn't quite as interesting. We tend to hold the razor at its centre of mass and bring it to our face at the desired angle and engagement without placing it on the safety bar or the top cap first. Moving the balance up or down would be counter productive, I think that's obvious. So for me, it's just a matter of whether I can get the razor balanced at a spot that I can grip comfortably.

One last thing I want to say for now, more later, is about the Henson handle again and skinny handles in general. If we simply consider the distance from the bottom to where we grip, as mentioned previously, it should be obvious that the narrower the diameter the longer the section has to be for the same weight. This is why I have always avoided handles less than 12mm in diameter, it forces me to move my grip up further to balance the razor. In the case of the Henson, it is right at my limit, but still comfortable. Maybe that is partly because of the narrower diameter? Another area of interest is hollow tubular handles which can have the balance set at just about anything the maker desires my adjusting the weight of the end piece(and the top too).
 
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Phoenixkh

I shaved a fortune
Aaron, I did quite a few experiments with the Timeless Ti 0.68OC to get the balance "right" for me.... I would say, the full Ti 0.68OC is has a perfect neutral balance.... but switching up the stainless steel parts gave me two razors with just slightly different balance points... the lighter one with the SS cap and the titanium base plate was my first choice. I was going to sell the one with the titanium cap and SS base plate as the balance is even more tilted toward the head....but really, only by a few grams. I ended up liking that one enough so I'm keeping it... On days when I haven't shaved for a while, it mows down my whiskers a bit more efficiently...

Why? I'm not really sure. To use the hammer analogy... I have different weight hammers for different jobs. I have several framing hammers....20 or 22 ounce heads...The handles are longer so you get more power in the hammer stroke. For every day work, I use a particular 16 ounce Kentucky Bluegrass hammer...and I have a 13 ounce for finish work, though I have finish nail guns now... so the 13 ounce doesn't get much use. My wife likes it when she's hanging pictures if I'm not around.

I sort of think as the slightly heavier 0.68OC as a framing hammer... for heavier growth.

The Ti Cap/SS base plate: 34g
The SS Cap/Ti base plate: 28.4g

The Ti Crown handle, on my scale, weighs 43.6g
 

Flanders

Stupid sexy Wing Nut
I just had my fourth shave this evening with the Shield AC razor(Vector copy)! I wish there was more to say other than this razor works phenomenally for my face and how I want to shave. And this is with the included guarded blade, which I have now binned. I can't wait to try it with a regular blade, but that will have to wait because I want to get back to the R41GS more. The shaves have all been 1 point short of my other razors that consistently produce FIS 3 shaves, but I am confident that the regular blade will bring it up. The razor is even able to shave my tough spots in spite of the guarded blade somehow. The thing that I can't quite get over is how tame and easy to use this razor is considering that it's barely more than a blade holder in a literal sense! I have been able to push the cap straight into my skin all I like with no consequences. The safety bar does tend to float and the blade feel occasionally disappears, but there is something to this razor that just works. I do wish they had gone with a lower gap and the same exposure, but that is only so I can use the safety bar not because it's threatening.
 

Phoenixkh

I shaved a fortune
I decided I needed to take a look at the way I grip the Ti Crown handle..... I hadn't ever looked at any thread, sticky, YouTube video etc. about how to grip the handle and where to grip it... Do I seek out the right balance point? The Ti Crown has that concave grip area in the middle... my first three fingers fit into that area perfectly... They can move up and down the handle as needed... probably half an inch or so in either direction from center.... My thumb opposes them.... and I can easily rotate the handle with my thumb and those three fingers.My little finger moves around as needed for support. I don't grip the handle tightly, rather, I hold onto to it loosely.... but I do keep my wrist locked during the shaving strokes. I do notice I use my wrist when going ATG on my neck... At least, I think I do.... Just on that little J hook at the end of the stroke as I shave under my chin and jawline. I'll have to pay attention to that as I just did a dry shave, no blade earlier, to observe what I do. I'll try to be an outside observer during my next real shave, as much as is possible.
 

Flanders

Stupid sexy Wing Nut
The shaves have all been 1 point short of my other razors that consistently produce FIS 3 shaves, but I am confident that the regular blade will bring it up.
I forgot to mention, and wanted to add, that all of the shaves with the Shield AC razor have been 14 hour shaves! Completely smooth face, with no detectable stubble protruding, at 12 hours and I am only just barely able to feel some at 14 hours. I still look presentable for a further 4 hours and by then it's lunch so I don't care if I have a shadow after that.

This is precisely the kind of shave that convinced me to abandon an experiment with twice-a-day 1 pass shaves. Those always left me itchy and uncomfortable with the amount of stubble left, but the AC razor does get closer than most others. It does work though, I never got accumulative irritation.
 

Flanders

Stupid sexy Wing Nut
Excited for your thoughts. Mine did not smell
I probably need a few more shaves to say anything definitive, but I can get a conversation started.

The fibres are soft, easily as soft as whatever mystery fibre Wald is using. The colour is whiter and banding is more convincingly badger like, I find this look appealing(for whatever worth that holds). It's hard to make a direct comparison with Wald as those are denser and are set differently. The bulb shape probably gives it slightly more backbone than otherwise, but I like it the way it is. There is one thing I notice that is different with Wald: the behaviour of the individual fibres. Namely that the fibres don't return to shape on their own. The Wald fibres spring back, without being springy in use. This 23mm knot is very similar in some ways to my Wald Delphi, which I had hoped, but different in how it gets there.

Once wet, I can see why some people don't like this knot. It's hard to describe what it feels like, most of the descriptions aren't very flattering. It's that very character that made me want to try it and am glad they went ahead with it. I am also glad that they didn't set it overly low as I was afraid they might since they seem to cater to the high backbone crowd. It might be even better a couple mm higher, but I don't want to deal with setting another myself.

It certainly has an outsized appetite for soap! And it doesn't dribble water all over the place, another characteristic it shares with Wald. Even with the knots that I like otherwise, the water down the handle problem with synthetics is something I could do without. Yes I know how to reduce it, sometimes it happens anyway. I easily loaded more soap than I do with the Delphi without trying to, I don't know how yet. That makes its water retention all the more impressive, it should be oozing out when loaded this heavily. Everything else went normally from there, no strange behaviours while building the lather on my face.

If I have one critique, it doesn't paint all that well. I think holds the lather in below the tips or the shape is the culprit, not sure yet. It certainly is prone to clumping together as others have mentioned, like a paint brush. Maybe that makes it less effective? I know I certainly had plenty of lather, I squeezed out as much as I do with a full size Wald! Part of that, though, is due to not getting it applied as well as desired when reapplying.

I think the above was probably a waste of time to type and read, but there it is anyway. I want another one, a fan this time and maybe I will just throw another bulb in for use later. None of that is happening any time soon as these prices are not exactly cheap compared to the usual stuff on AliExpress. I know that this is one of the criticisms, that they are asking Western manufacturer prices when their cost is obviously lower to produce. I don't share this opinion as I know of other products that are made in "workshops" in China. Those have been in business much longer than Oumo and their prices are increasing over the years, if only modestly. Clearly they have some margin, but the cost to run a small shop in China is increasing as well.
 
If I have one critique, it doesn't paint all that well. I think holds the lather in below the tips or the shape is the culprit, not sure yet.
I wonder if the Italian barber trick of pinching the knot to splay it would help it give up lather and paint better? I'm not a huge fan of it since one of the reasons I use a brush is to keep the soap off my hands, but it is undeniably effective with some knots.
 
I probably need a few more shaves to say anything definitive, but I can get a conversation started.

The fibres are soft, easily as soft as whatever mystery fibre Wald is using. The colour is whiter and banding is more convincingly badger like, I find this look appealing(for whatever worth that holds). It's hard to make a direct comparison with Wald as those are denser and are set differently. The bulb shape probably gives it slightly more backbone than otherwise, but I like it the way it is. There is one thing I notice that is different with Wald: the behaviour of the individual fibres. Namely that the fibres don't return to shape on their own. The Wald fibres spring back, without being springy in use. This 23mm knot is very similar in some ways to my Wald Delphi, which I had hoped, but different in how it gets there.

Once wet, I can see why some people don't like this knot. It's hard to describe what it feels like, most of the descriptions aren't very flattering. It's that very character that made me want to try it and am glad they went ahead with it. I am also glad that they didn't set it overly low as I was afraid they might since they seem to cater to the high backbone crowd. It might be even better a couple mm higher, but I don't want to deal with setting another myself.

It certainly has an outsized appetite for soap! And it doesn't dribble water all over the place, another characteristic it shares with Wald. Even with the knots that I like otherwise, the water down the handle problem with synthetics is something I could do without. Yes I know how to reduce it, sometimes it happens anyway. I easily loaded more soap than I do with the Delphi without trying to, I don't know how yet. That makes its water retention all the more impressive, it should be oozing out when loaded this heavily. Everything else went normally from there, no strange behaviours while building the lather on my face.

If I have one critique, it doesn't paint all that well. I think holds the lather in below the tips or the shape is the culprit, not sure yet. It certainly is prone to clumping together as others have mentioned, like a paint brush. Maybe that makes it less effective? I know I certainly had plenty of lather, I squeezed out as much as I do with a full size Wald! Part of that, though, is due to not getting it applied as well as desired when reapplying.

I think the above was probably a waste of time to type and read, but there it is anyway. I want another one, a fan this time and maybe I will just throw another bulb in for use later. None of that is happening any time soon as these prices are not exactly cheap compared to the usual stuff on AliExpress. I know that this is one of the criticisms, that they are asking Western manufacturer prices when their cost is obviously lower to produce. I don't share this opinion as I know of other products that are made in "workshops" in China. Those have been in business much longer than Oumo and their prices are increasing over the years, if only modestly. Clearly they have some margin, but the cost to run a small shop in China is increasing as well.
Good review Aaron. I have a 29mm ST2 in Fan and and it paints well, provided I give it a full serving of soap (like 1 to 2 grams). When stuffed with creamy, rich soapy goodness, it is a fabulous face mop - at least in that size and shape. I imagine that if it were smaller and had a bulb top, the experience would be different.
 

Flanders

Stupid sexy Wing Nut
I haven't shaved yet so I went ahead and grabbed a photo

IMG_4554.jpeg

This shows the knot soaking wet, but pinched. Its verticality is very reminiscent of boar knots I have seen. That's a 23mm Muhle next to it for scale, the width at the tip, for painting, is less than two fingers wide. I think Matt is right, at least a little coaxing would be a good idea after the first pass. Thanks for the idea.
 
I haven't shaved yet so I went ahead and grabbed a photo

View attachment 1974125

This shows the knot soaking wet, but pinched. Its verticality is very reminiscent of boar knots I have seen. That's a 23mm Muhle next to it for scale, the width at the tip, for painting, is less than two fingers wide. I think Matt is right, at least a little coaxing would be a good idea after the first pass. Thanks for the idea.
Mine does the same. When I dry it after the shave, I gently brush it back and forth across a dry towel. After 30 seconds or so, the brush is dry and the hairs are fanned. I once skipped the towel drying and the brush dried clumped up.
 

Flanders

Stupid sexy Wing Nut
A bit of a spicier shave than normal with the Lite 'Bird tonight, first FIS 4 of the year.

I opened up on one my packs of Ladas that I just got from IB, I believe these have tested as being pretty sharp. It seemed like a good strategy with the Lite plate's somewhat underwhelming performance previously. There were no long term injuries involved, but I did warm up my face in a few spots! Nothing worse than an average Blackbird shave when everything is going right so I got no real benefit out of the Lite plate this time, with this blade. But that might just be it, I might not be able to handle this blade in the regular Blackbird.

Even though tonight's performance was largely a result of the blade choice, it might be surprising to hear that I don't think the Lite 'Bird is actually less aggressive than the R41. I think the blade simply showed what its full capability is. In fact, I am not certain that the blade exposure isn't more than the R41! The low gap design, like the regular 'Bird, really hides the aggression.

I made some unintentional observations about my grip as well; the Blackbird seems to have been the razor that I had in mind when I am talking about this, but it isn't the same with all razors. I was able to use all of the grips, including the tip grip, and I was actually changing them dynamically more than I had realised. I think this is largely a function of the smaller handle working better for me whereas the longer ones limit my movement more. I am pretty much at the top of the grip most of the time, unlike with heavier razors, so I have plenty of grip to work with in spite of the shorter length.

The new brush worked really well again tonight and painted better than last night without having to pinch the knot. I did actually find the limit of how much water the knot can hold. This means that I need to be careful not to load too much soap because I won't be able to add enough water to get it the right consistency. I started off with just a thin layer of bloom water on the soap and a thoroughly wrung brush and loaded until the soap was dry on the surface. This isn't much water at all, probably less than a teaspoon. Another interesting discovery was when I started pushing water out a bit, I was able to shake the brush to remove the excess without flinging my lather out. This was pretty neat to see as I have lost my lather in the past with other brushes!
 
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