Pete Rose discussion

[Toothpick]

If a player is gambling, that brings in the question of fixing games. If the public's perception is that your sports's games are fixed, you cease to be a sport and become WWE.

I think, at least in my opinion, most Pro Sports are more entertainment and less sport anyway.

This is from a google search "what sports does Draft Kings sponsor"

DraftKings is both an official daily fantasy and sports betting partner of the NFL, NHL, PGA TOUR, and UFC, as well as an official daily fantasy partner of NASCAR, an official sports betting partner of the NBA and an authorized gaming operator of MLB

How the hell you gonna take a sponsorship from a SPORTS BETTING COMPANY and then be so up in arms and offended when your players make bets??

I get it back in the 80's when Sports Betting was completely frowned upon and you had to use illegal bookies to make your bets. but 40 years later you're cashing checks from LEAGL BOOKIES and still calling Pete Rose a disgrace and not letting him in the HOF. Very hypocritical and asinine IMO.

 

[Fordfather]

I get it back in the 80's when Sports Betting was completely frowned upon and you had to use illegal bookies to make your bets. but 40 years later you're cashing checks from LEAGL BOOKIES and still calling Pete Rose a disgrace and not letting him in the HOF. Very hypocritical and asinine IMO.

NASCAR is sponsored by Busch, but I don't think they allow their drivers to imbibe and drive

 

[Whisky]

I think the biggest issue with reinstating Rose was that he never stopped gambling, even after the ban. If he had shown any remorse or tried to get help for what was obviously an addiction then I could see maybe, someday, letting him into the HOF.

 

[Toothpick]

NASCAR is sponsored by Busch, but I don't think they allow their drivers to imbibe and drive

Quikrete sponsors some MLB teams but I don’t think they want them mixing up a batch at 3rd base.

If you take Pete at his word he only bet on his team to win.

Technically he’s banned because he signed an agreement to be banned. There was never anything formal that said weather or not he bet on baseball. No official statement

 

[brucered]

Quikrete sponsors some MLB teams but I don’t think they want them mixing up a batch at 3rd base.

If you take Pete at his word he only bet on his team to win.

Technically he’s banned because he signed an agreement to be banned. There was never anything formal that said weather or not he bet on baseball. No official statement

Nothing was said because he did sign. It was a "plea deal" of sorts.

If you revoke his agreement, then you have to open up the investigation again. You can't ignore part of the agreement and not the other.

Take him at his word? He was a liar, a cheat and frauded the government out of tax money for years. Those are just the facts, not including any rape allegations that are past the statute of limitations to pursue.

Good person to have on the field, terrible person off the field.

 

[Toothpick]

Nothing was said because he did sign. It was a "plea deal" of sorts.

If you revoke his agreement, then you have to open up the investigation again. You can't ignore part of the agreement and not the other.

Take him at his word? He was a liar, a cheat and frauded the government out of tax money for years. Those are just the facts, not including any rape allegations that are past the statute of limitations to pursue.

Good person to have on the field, terrible person off the field.

All I'm saying is he should be in the HOF, which is based on who he was on the field. You can't put in all the other cheaters and terrible human beings and not him. Well, that's what they plan on doing of course. But it's BS.

 

[Whisky]

All I'm saying is he should be in the HOF, which is based on who he was on the field. You can't put in all the other cheaters and terrible human beings and not him. Well, that's what they plan on doing of course. But it's BS.

The difference is he got caught. A lot of the steroid era players will probably never be in the HOF including Bond's, McGuire, and Sosa because they got caught or admitted to it. The Mitchell report only reported on ONE company producing PED's and it listed 89 MLB players in it. There were dozens of companies making these drugs and multiple trainers distributing them. There were quite a few players that had dramatic declines in the late 1990's into the 2000's when MLB started testing for more and more substances, but they weren't caught because they stopped using the PEDs. Some of those players are now in the HOF.

 

[Messygoon]

I'm a firm believer that our past should not be what defines us. Rather, we should be defined by how we live our lives following our mistakes.

From what I know of Pete, he didn't finished life well. However, as a fan of history that inspires, I hope to find some inspiration in Pete's life. That's why this B&B thread prompted me to begin reading "The Machine" by Joe Posnanski. And I'm loving it.

About 15% in, and here's one of my favorite stories so far:

Pete hated walks, sometimes going so far as to swing at bad pitches to avoid a walk. In a 1973 game, down late by 7 runs against the Cardinals, Bob Gibson (batters hit a measly .228 against Gibson over his 17-year career) threw an inside pitch that ticked Pete's uniform. Umpire Bill Williams told Pete to "Take your base." Pete shouted back, "The ball didn't hit me, Bill." The two argued back and forth until Williams made Pete take first base. Pete wanted to get one more swing at Bob Gibson, the scariest, most intimidating pitcher of the time. For the rest of the inning, Pete yelled at Williams, "The ball didn't hit me!" That's how much Pete hated walks. He wanted to swing away. Always.

Incredible. The batter's sole purpose is to score by circling the bases. By any and all means. Yet for Pete, he valued the glory of the battle over the charity of surrender. Self-centered? Yes. Arrogant? Absolutely. But I must admire his competitive spirit.

 

[Phoenixkh]

I've been reading this thread with interest. I followed the Reds like many other kids my age, through HS and into adulthood. We moved to the Philadelphia in 1976 and started following the Phillies... Rose helped them win the World Series in 1980.

When this topic comes up, I'm always reminded of the Lance Armstrong story. I've been a huge fan of the Tour de France since the late 1980s... when Greg LeMond was winning. I became a huge Lance Armstrong fan......As that story unfolded, I felt betrayed.

I still hate the way the various organizations treated the guys who made them millions. They all knew about the drugs in pro sports.... name them... the corporate heads knew... raked in the money until things were exposed.... Then pretended to be surprised when the various performance enhancing drugs came to light, and even Pete's gambling.

 

[Dtownvino]

I saw him play once at Three Rivers. He slid head first into home when there was no play against him. He did everything in full speed and that appears how he lived his life in all aspects.

He broke the rules, that is clear.

They sought to make an example of him and did. Is baseball better for it?

 

[Messygoon]

Here is another story from "The Machine" involving the 1970 All Star Game 12th-inning collision with Detroit catcher, Ray Fosse.

Pete led off second, and his teammate Jim Hickman hit a single to center. Pete never hesitated - that was something he always told his teammates, never pause, never doubt, never hesitate, never slow down. Sportswriters in the morning editions around the country were split in their descriptions between "snorting bull" and "rolling train." Center fielder Amos Otis scooped up the ball and made a strong throw home. The ball and Pete reached home plate about the same time. But Pete was bigger. He smashed into catcher Ray Fosse, busted the poor kid's shoulder, sent the baseball flying, and defiantly scored the game-winning run. The crash would take on more meaning because Ray Fosse was only 23 and the most promising young catcher in the game; he was never quite the same after.

To add a bit of irony to it all, Pete had Fosse to his house the night before for dinner, though Pete never saw any irony in it at all. Pete was the kind of guy who would invite you to dinner at night and run right through you the next day to win a ball game. It was all part of the deal.

People often asked Pete if he regretted smashing into Fosse - hell, it was just an All-Star Game. It didn't count in the standings. Pete's response was telling. He did not even understand the question. They were playing baseball. His was the winning run. Fosse was blocking the plate. Pete had no choice.

I remember the play as if it were yesterday. In an instant the game was won and a promising catcher's career derailed. It was a crossroads moment for me. Heroes are supposed to be caring, kind, loving, full of compassion. On that night, Pete's luster became tarnished, and my infatuation began to fade.

b

 

[DesertIguana]

Pete is getting more attention after his passing than the last 3- 5 years of his life. Would think Pete is looking down from big Diamond is Sky enjoy the talk about him.