I am a marketing director at a small business and I recently (3 or so months) decided to start wearing a jacket and tie. At first people would ask me why I was dressed up, but now they give me compliments on a tie, or a jacket or even a pocket square. One recently asked why I was looking so good that day and a female coworker said "Jack always looks that good", which was pretty cool. Our place has everything from data geeks to developers to sales staff and we see everything from suits to jeans in a walk around the office, so i feel pretty comfortable with my level of dress.
Does your boss discourage dressing formally at the office?
- Thread starter JaggerDragger
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Key points in red.
Be "the guy" who always looks good. Not "too" good, but good.
Don't wear something that makes you feel uncomfortable (I mean that in the sense of avoiding feeling like you must look silly ... but of course physical discomfort is to be avoided too.)
First, it isn’t frowned upon in my office.
In the office we have a ‘casual dress code’, meaning no jeans and shirts with collars at a minimum. I generally wear a tie at least 3 days a week. Whenever I have to appear in court, then a suit is in order. The only exceptions to the jeans rule is inclement weather or if you will be in the field, due to the nature of our work/function showing up in anything nicer draws too much attention.
Some of my coworkers never stray beyond khakis and a polo – which is fine from managements view point. I, on the other hand, typically dress nicer than most and have been repeatedly complimented (my favorite came from a more mature woman – who said “you are such a snappy dresser”
. I say wear what you are comfortable wearing, so long as it does not garner too much negative attention. I was told many years ago, you dress for the job you want not the job you have.
In the office we have a ‘casual dress code’, meaning no jeans and shirts with collars at a minimum. I generally wear a tie at least 3 days a week. Whenever I have to appear in court, then a suit is in order. The only exceptions to the jeans rule is inclement weather or if you will be in the field, due to the nature of our work/function showing up in anything nicer draws too much attention.
Some of my coworkers never stray beyond khakis and a polo – which is fine from managements view point. I, on the other hand, typically dress nicer than most and have been repeatedly complimented (my favorite came from a more mature woman – who said “you are such a snappy dresser”
. I say wear what you are comfortable wearing, so long as it does not garner too much negative attention. I was told many years ago, you dress for the job you want not the job you have.This is what I aim for. I love the way I look when I'm wearing a jacket and tie, which is professional, but stylish. I haven't gone for suits, as that could be seen as another jump in formality (I mean, I was wearing jeans and polos a year ago), but I do think I might introduce some suits occasionally, just because they look good. I like the tailored look of a lot of suits these days and I'm aiming to pick up a navy and a light grey sometime in the next six months or so. The other thing is, you can split the suit up and it gives you more variety when you don't want to look quite so formal. Anyway, veering off topic, so yeah, wear what makes you feel good and look good, is what I say. At first it will seem weird, but ride out the early days and create a new image for yourself that you like. The older I've grown, the less I've really cared about pleasing others and the more I care about looking in that mirror in the morning and liking what I see. Hence the handlebar 'stache and occasional bow tie
I really think it comes down to dressing for your job. I work for an engineering services company. The "services" of our engineers are sold to other companies that have the engineering work to be done. This often leads to us being at the customers' site anywhere from occasionally to full time. We also have customers in our office from time to time. Dressing in a manner well below or well above the norm for the customer can be equally damaging to our company's reputation. Either they think our employees are slobs, or they think they view themselves as better than them.
There is a particular individual in our office who likes to dress "formally" more often than not. Not only does he do this at work, but out and about in his every day life. He's become known throughout the office for it, and not always in a good way. While I think it's great to stand out a little and make yourself memorable, wearing a full three piece suit when everyone else around you is wearing jeans or khakis with a polo or button front collard shirt can make a person seem like "that guy".
There is a particular individual in our office who likes to dress "formally" more often than not. Not only does he do this at work, but out and about in his every day life. He's become known throughout the office for it, and not always in a good way. While I think it's great to stand out a little and make yourself memorable, wearing a full three piece suit when everyone else around you is wearing jeans or khakis with a polo or button front collard shirt can make a person seem like "that guy".
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Last week I went on-site at a British financial services provider. Of all the contractors (and several of the internal IT staff) I was the only one wearing a suit and tie. I definitely felt overdressed.
Usually I inform myself of the dress code beforehand. But this being a British financial company, I automatically assumed that suit and tie would be the norm.
Choose what you wear so that you stand out a bit, but not too much. And in the case of IT, usually slacks and a button up shirt will do. With proper shoes, of course.
And in my case, a good pen, a quality watch, and a well shaved face
Usually I inform myself of the dress code beforehand. But this being a British financial company, I automatically assumed that suit and tie would be the norm.
Choose what you wear so that you stand out a bit, but not too much. And in the case of IT, usually slacks and a button up shirt will do. With proper shoes, of course.
And in my case, a good pen, a quality watch, and a well shaved face
big +1
I work night shift on a Help Desk. The only people who see me are one co-worker and the guard in the building, yet every night I wear dress trousers, dress shirt, bow tie, sports coat and a fedora. I am the guy who dresses well every day. The day shift crew is lucky if they can find a clean pair of sweat pants to toss on. I stand out, I am the odd ball, but then again, I am 25 years older than my boss and most likely have forgotten more than he ever knew about our industry. When people ask why I dress as I do, I just tell them that I was raised at a time when people dressed for going to work.
I enjoy dressing well at all times. The clothing I wear to work is my standard wardrobe. I had a doctor's appointment last week, and when the doctor saw me sitting in the office, she did a double take that would have done credit to any great comic actor. She then said that I was the very first person to dress up for an appointment. I told her that I was not dressed up, just dressed well. Anyway, as she was examining the incisions from a very recent surgery she said that I would have no visible scars. I said that scars would not matter since I was not some super model. She told me that dressed as I was, I could be a model. If she was not so young, I would have thought she was flirting.
I enjoy dressing well at all times. The clothing I wear to work is my standard wardrobe. I had a doctor's appointment last week, and when the doctor saw me sitting in the office, she did a double take that would have done credit to any great comic actor. She then said that I was the very first person to dress up for an appointment. I told her that I was not dressed up, just dressed well. Anyway, as she was examining the incisions from a very recent surgery she said that I would have no visible scars. I said that scars would not matter since I was not some super model. She told me that dressed as I was, I could be a model. If she was not so young, I would have thought she was flirting
.
John Bridges has an excellent book called A Gentleman Gets Dressed Up, which is invaluable. The lesson? You can dress up without being overdressed. Good pointers on how to get this done without violating a corporate culture.
Disclaimer: the Army forces me to wear a set of gray pajamas every day. My off time, however, finds me always dressed correctly for the situation.
Disclaimer: the Army forces me to wear a set of gray pajamas every day. My off time, however, finds me always dressed correctly for the situation.
Looks don't equal performance, they just hide idiots in many cases. We had a enlisted troop who was professionally 'perfect'. Shiny boots, starched uniforms (tailored). He looked good in formation. Problem was, he (repeatedly) proved over years he couldn't be trusted to guard an empty portapotty with a rubber rifle. Finally got discharged for smoking weed. Looked awesome..... so what?
I worked in the game business (for a major game company, not GameStop, etc). Casual dress being the norm. Casual meaning flip flops, shorts and t-shirts. Hoodies optional. I showed up for my interview in an Italian suit worth more than the interviewer's paycheck. The two interviewers were in the aforementioned shorts/t-shirt and polo shirt/jeans. The CEO of the corporation showed up on a tour in a hoody and shorts and his personal net worth is in the 8 figure range. Corporate (and gamer) culture.
We had guys who affected thousands if not hundreds of thousands of customers who were experts in their fields who dressed this way as did everyone. I wore polo shirt and jeans with hiking boots most days and was considered "dressy" by most. Because I tucked my shirt in.
An average videoconference between two of our division would encompass sixty people in three countries affecting about 8 million customers. Not a tie in sight.
Professionalism means doing your job right. Not 'looking the part'. Because for the gamer culture, people in suits are 'odd'.
One guy who at the beginning, taught me everything I knew and later on, became my coworker, showed up everyday for years with a mohawk, ripped jeans, boots and a heavy metal type t-shirt. This being fairly normal for the company, no big deal.
One day he showed up. Suit, pocket square, tie, everything. Six days straight, different suit and shirt every day. For two weeks, he wore nothing but suits. Day 1 "who died?" Day 2 "multiple interviews?" etc.
He had finally gotten himself out of debt and actually had more than the bare minimum to cover his bills after 3 years, and decided to get some new clothes. He went 'dressy' on average once a week after that. Nobody honestly cared, but apparently it made him feel better. He was already in the top five people in his career field (among 3,000) in the company, so it's not like a suit made him look any more professional.
I worked in the game business (for a major game company, not GameStop, etc). Casual dress being the norm. Casual meaning flip flops, shorts and t-shirts. Hoodies optional. I showed up for my interview in an Italian suit worth more than the interviewer's paycheck. The two interviewers were in the aforementioned shorts/t-shirt and polo shirt/jeans. The CEO of the corporation showed up on a tour in a hoody and shorts and his personal net worth is in the 8 figure range. Corporate (and gamer) culture.
We had guys who affected thousands if not hundreds of thousands of customers who were experts in their fields who dressed this way as did everyone. I wore polo shirt and jeans with hiking boots most days and was considered "dressy" by most. Because I tucked my shirt in.
An average videoconference between two of our division would encompass sixty people in three countries affecting about 8 million customers. Not a tie in sight.
Professionalism means doing your job right. Not 'looking the part'. Because for the gamer culture, people in suits are 'odd'.
One guy who at the beginning, taught me everything I knew and later on, became my coworker, showed up everyday for years with a mohawk, ripped jeans, boots and a heavy metal type t-shirt. This being fairly normal for the company, no big deal.
One day he showed up. Suit, pocket square, tie, everything. Six days straight, different suit and shirt every day. For two weeks, he wore nothing but suits. Day 1 "who died?" Day 2 "multiple interviews?" etc.
He had finally gotten himself out of debt and actually had more than the bare minimum to cover his bills after 3 years, and decided to get some new clothes. He went 'dressy' on average once a week after that. Nobody honestly cared, but apparently it made him feel better. He was already in the top five people in his career field (among 3,000) in the company, so it's not like a suit made him look any more professional.
It's quite fascinating since this topic comes up from time to time and my colleagues at my universities speak about this with me. I'm 32, of Asian descent (an American) with a hint of a British accent (I did my postgraduate degrees there). I was speaking to an older colleague who had just come back to uni teaching. We discussed our different clothing styles (I'm always in a jacket and 70% of the time I wear a tie or 30% no tie but crisp, pressed button down collar shirt or I'm in a two or three-piece tweed suit). He shows up in a nice shirt, clean trousers, and we were discussing how varied the professoriate can dress. A fine arts person can dress so differently from an engineer or historian/classicist. We were also discussing whether it mattered or not to students but the general consensus (especially in pedagogy research) is that it does a little; students tend to notice and respond better to more formally dressed professors. The idea is that those professors feel 'more professory'. I don't think they think less of professors who show up in jeans and t-shirt or, as I remember fondly remember a stellar geology professor from undergrad in Hawaiian shirt and shorts. I think if you can carry it off with the right authority it works.
It comes down to whether you can carry it off or not. I remarked that I could never wear just a shirt and trousers as I've become accustomed to jacket and shirt and nice trousers minimum. That's 'business casual' or 'dress down Friday' for me. I'm aware that other Seattle area professions don't do that. I'm not in those professions and, for my tastes, am glad that professors have a lot more leeway. My colleague said he tried jacket and tie one day but he didn't really 'feel' it. I think it came down to comfort level and if you're not comfortable then it shows. It's no good dressing informally (in my case, I don't own jeans and don't see the point since I find them hugely uncomfortable and never liked them even as a kid) if you are uncomfortable. People can tell. I remember reading a pedagogy book that actually remarked that students responded better to professors whom they felt dressed a bit more formally (though that's not why I do it, I just like wearing tweed suits) but also only if they look comfortable. Wear the suit rather than the suit wearing you, for example.
Does it mean that occasionally, by Seattle and modern standards that I am 'overdressed'? I suppose so, but I am often complimented by women and men (though generally more women than men) and it has become part of my image. A very charming colleague of mine responded at a small 30 person party when another colleague's father asked, 'Is Michael going somewhere special?' I was just wearing a bush jacket, suede derbies/bluchers, a tattersall shirt, and a green silk knit tie. She merely commented 'Oh no, this is as dressed-down as I've ever seen Michael. He just always looks smart.' If it helps, the father was a former US Army enlisted man and was there in jacket and tie with smartly polished shoes. I think he approved but he was curious if I always looked so polished even in casual mode.
It's never pejorative in my experience though I get the occasional 'You do know we're casual in Seattle, right?' Generally, my experience has been positive because I carry it off. I think if you can make it really part of your self-image then you should be fine but that can take time and you just have to be consistent and do it gradually.
As for being 'that guy', there is a danger. My colleagues do joke that I probably wear suit and tie to mow the lawn. I do not but my old smart shirts and trousers, as they wear out, do get relegated to DIY and lawn mowing. Why spend money on t-shirts when an old and fraying can get spattered with paint just as easily? As for what my bosses think? My deans have always been favourable and so have my chairs and, more importantly, I do an excellent job doing what I do with students who respond well to this 'old-fashioned professor' and that ensures I have that leeway to be tweedy.
It comes down to whether you can carry it off or not. I remarked that I could never wear just a shirt and trousers as I've become accustomed to jacket and shirt and nice trousers minimum. That's 'business casual' or 'dress down Friday' for me. I'm aware that other Seattle area professions don't do that. I'm not in those professions and, for my tastes, am glad that professors have a lot more leeway. My colleague said he tried jacket and tie one day but he didn't really 'feel' it. I think it came down to comfort level and if you're not comfortable then it shows. It's no good dressing informally (in my case, I don't own jeans and don't see the point since I find them hugely uncomfortable and never liked them even as a kid) if you are uncomfortable. People can tell. I remember reading a pedagogy book that actually remarked that students responded better to professors whom they felt dressed a bit more formally (though that's not why I do it, I just like wearing tweed suits) but also only if they look comfortable. Wear the suit rather than the suit wearing you, for example.
Does it mean that occasionally, by Seattle and modern standards that I am 'overdressed'? I suppose so, but I am often complimented by women and men (though generally more women than men) and it has become part of my image. A very charming colleague of mine responded at a small 30 person party when another colleague's father asked, 'Is Michael going somewhere special?' I was just wearing a bush jacket, suede derbies/bluchers, a tattersall shirt, and a green silk knit tie. She merely commented 'Oh no, this is as dressed-down as I've ever seen Michael. He just always looks smart.' If it helps, the father was a former US Army enlisted man and was there in jacket and tie with smartly polished shoes. I think he approved but he was curious if I always looked so polished even in casual mode.
It's never pejorative in my experience though I get the occasional 'You do know we're casual in Seattle, right?' Generally, my experience has been positive because I carry it off. I think if you can make it really part of your self-image then you should be fine but that can take time and you just have to be consistent and do it gradually.
As for being 'that guy', there is a danger. My colleagues do joke that I probably wear suit and tie to mow the lawn. I do not but my old smart shirts and trousers, as they wear out, do get relegated to DIY and lawn mowing. Why spend money on t-shirts when an old and fraying can get spattered with paint just as easily?
As for what my bosses think? My deans have always been favourable and so have my chairs and, more importantly, I do an excellent job doing what I do with students who respond well to this 'old-fashioned professor' and that ensures I have that leeway to be tweedy.
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Bottom line, it's performance that counts.
But I bet that soldier got a lot farther than he should have, based on his spotless appearance. Just imagine how well he'd have done if he had the substance to back it up. Yeah, we focus on appearance here ... it's the "Haberdashery", not "the University" (or whatever we'd call our forum for internal and intellectual development) ... so that's understandable.
(And yes, dressing "too well" for a job where casual dress is expected can be "standing out in a bad way".)
Good points.
In my experience, university campuses are much more accepting of "oddball" professors &c than most other employment situations.
Clothes oft proclaim the man (Shakespeare) I always dress a notch above what the occasion calls for; not to call attention to myself, but to show that I pay attention to my appearance. And how I dress affects my attitude positively. I don't wear expensive clothing, but make sure that it fits well, is clean, ironed and not threadbare. I polish my shoes, shave daily and keep my hair trimmed and combed and my fingernails cut.
I agree with several opinions already expressed here.
Dressing a bit better than the average is a good career move in pretty much any profession, however dressing too far above the average is often (but not always) damaging.
How I am dressed definitely has a psychological effect - I am far more likely to slack off when dressed down.
For the last six years I've been at a engineering company where ties are generally something your manager wears a couple of times a year for customer meetings. Jeans, khakis, tshirts, and polos are more standard fare although the spectrum is fairly broad.
As someone who for the first three years never wore less than black leather shoes, dress socks, dress pants, and a collared button-up shirt I was (and still am) often better dressed than my manager and the ex-military folks. One of the old hands once referred to me as "the best dressed tester I've ever known".
Dressing a bit better than the average is a good career move in pretty much any profession, however dressing too far above the average is often (but not always) damaging.
How I am dressed definitely has a psychological effect - I am far more likely to slack off when dressed down.
For the last six years I've been at a engineering company where ties are generally something your manager wears a couple of times a year for customer meetings. Jeans, khakis, tshirts, and polos are more standard fare although the spectrum is fairly broad.
As someone who for the first three years never wore less than black leather shoes, dress socks, dress pants, and a collared button-up shirt I was (and still am) often better dressed than my manager and the ex-military folks. One of the old hands once referred to me as "the best dressed tester I've ever known".
I work in an office where I regularly meet with a man wearing stars on his collar So suit is pretty much minimum for everyone.
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