Not really. My favorite razor is a Gillette Tech that I bought brand new old stock, some 12 years ago for like $30. My second best head is also a Tech. Pretty simple stamped metal Indian edition Tech. Bought it for like $5 on a plastic handle. Currently using it on an Ikon SS handle that costs a lot more than the head. My third best is a Slim Adjustable, that I got (again NOS) a decade ago for like $40. These three see a lot more use than, say my Muhle Rocca that costed me close to $100.
Does Cost Matter?
- Thread starter Mike the Beginner
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I have been absolutely spoiled by some very nice stainless steel razors. The fit and finish are incredible. They are high quality. They shave as well as a 50s Gillette, but generally not better. I do have a couple exceptions where I simply can't help but get a near perfect shave, but there are likely vintage razors that are also that good. However, I really appreciate the stainless steel workmanship, even if it isn't a noticeably better shave. Kind of how I prefer certain soaps due to the strong scents even though a soap with a lesser scent can be just as good.
I did the very same thing when I first started.
Within a month of coming here, I had purchased three Game Changers: 68P, 68OC, and 84P. Not just one razor and two extra base plates - three complete razors.
I didn't use any of the for months, and continued to struggle with a Merkur 34c (which ain't that great, for me).
In the meantime I found a bunch of vintage Gillette razors in local antique shops for 5-10 bucks and bought every one I saw: Techs, Superspeeds, Old Types, New Imperoved, etc...and those were the true game changers for me because the Techs were the razors that allowed me to learn.
Of course I eventually tried the Game Changers, and over the past year and a half I've bought and sold a bunch of modern razors, including the RR 68OC and 84P but held onto, and still use, my vintage Gillette razors. All to say:
My path sounds very similar to yours, and you will figure out what is best for you, and find your own definition of "value" and what you are willing to spend...but my answer to your original question remains the same - no, cost doesn't matter and (with a bit of practice) you can get a great shave from a $10 vintage Gillette or a $700 Wolfman.
My take is cost as it goes up up up two things happen Big Name Super Razor cost big bucks, and hopefully they are aPretty Precision Made Tool that looks like Fine Auto or Pickup.
Don't forget Old Vintage Gillettes are bargain until someone restore, replate's, and make pretty.
You do need a Wolf, Ron, or some 400-500 buck razor to remove Beard but if you can afford, do if you want to, because you have the MooLaa.
Don't forget Old Vintage Gillettes are bargain until someone restore, replate's, and make pretty.
You do need a Wolf, Ron, or some 400-500 buck razor to remove Beard but if you can afford, do if you want to, because you have the MooLaa.
A person with access to high quality metals and machining can make clunkers. There seem to be limits on how much a DE razor design can be optimized for a given shaving style or preference, and those limits can be probed using zamak, unobtanium, or something in between. So I would say that cost matters but is not determinative. It is doubtful someone would go through the learning curve and cost of materials and equipment to make machined SS razors without a good idea for a design and a good understanding of how to achieve the desired performance. As a result a high cost razor is likely to be pretty darned good. A mass produced razor is unlikely to survive unless its design is pretty darned good. So to me, it is logical that a new design for a low cost razor may be the hardest to predict.
Or it may be that a much more expensive hammer would also only have lasted "eons". There is a difference between cheap things and inexpensive things. One is made cheaply, hence the lower price point, whereas the other is of good quality, but with an affordable price. Value is the key word. Just because something is expensive does not always equal the best quality/build etc. It may just mean expensive.
Well you would hope that as price increase the quality control, fit, finish, and performance would all justify the high price. Because of value, received for money spent.
I know from Cars some luxury models are fine to own, but you had better not be a one care person. As some brands n models have problems, part are not sitting at dealer for inventor, need part wait.
Cigars are cheap to very pricy, have a friend who is VERY wealthy, he some one Cigar, trader Jacks, 35 bucks for 20. He could buy anything he wishes, but like the Trader Jacks. We were at event couple weeks ago someone had given in a 20 buck plus stick, he smoked it to be polite, said it was awful.
I know from Cars some luxury models are fine to own, but you had better not be a one care person. As some brands n models have problems, part are not sitting at dealer for inventor, need part wait.
Cigars are cheap to very pricy, have a friend who is VERY wealthy, he some one Cigar, trader Jacks, 35 bucks for 20. He could buy anything he wishes, but like the Trader Jacks. We were at event couple weeks ago someone had given in a 20 buck plus stick, he smoked it to be polite, said it was awful.
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When my father worked for Jerry Ford he knew Nelson Rockefeller, and the VP would drive to work in a bog-standard mid-line American sedan of a blah gray-green color, only with tinted back windows in back and a chauffeur dressed in nondescript street clothes up front. If memory serves (which it might not) it was a Chevy Impala, but something similar anyway. There was a Tensor lamp (anyone remember those?) on the back deck behind VP Rockefeller's head, so he could work on his commute. He didn't want to attract any attention in traffic.
My observation of rich people I've known over the years is that some of them don't go for luxury items because they are just not interested in showing off. They don't need to. Bill Gates famously wears a $50 Casio watch ( Amazon.com - https://amzn.to/48XfBYW ). (Are links in posts allowed here?? I'm new.) One couple of my acquaintance that owned many shopping malls all over the world never bought new cars and were scandalized when their daughter bought a brand new car, the original Acura Integra that cost $15k. She bought it out of her own trust fund, too, so they didn't need to contribute. The parents always bought two-year-old Volvos, back when Volvos were made in Sweden and had a reputation for safety. Their net worth was many tens of millions, in the '80s.
I've always considered that the very best cars are mainstream best-sellers, for many reasons, including investment in research and development to repairability, ease of resale, and parts availability. Years ago I heard that Toyota spent many times as much as Ferrari on the development of a new car. That might not be true any more. In my opinion the very best car money can buy right right now might be the Toyota Prius Prime. Lamborghini doesn't have the resources to build that car. And haven't I read that the Gillette Tech had more patents than any other razor? Several engineers made key contributions to its design. One article said that the Tech might have had more patents than any other consumer product, period, once upon a time. So it's the Accord/Camry of razors, maybe. Just musing here, I'm no expert.
MtB
I would guess (no experience here) that people with earned wealth are generally "careful" with their money which is one of the primary reasons they have money.
In terms of modern razors, I'd say that the price does make a difference, but only at the bottom tier. There are plenty of crappy modern razors in that $20 and under territory. I've tried two of them (though I wouldn't say I was "fair" to the most recent), and they weren't worth what I paid for them.
If you step up to the $30-50 range in modern razors...think the Muhle and Edwin Jagger...you get some really good shavers. I don't think I could have gotten better shaves from a $300 DE as I did from my EJ DE89.
Then it got knocked out of my medicine cabinet, and the head broke off. That's probably (in my opinion) where a more expensive razor may...or may not have...paid off. Stainless or titanium wouldn't have broken the way the Zymak did. But, how many DE89s could I have bought at the price of a stainless or titanium razor?
If you step up to the $30-50 range in modern razors...think the Muhle and Edwin Jagger...you get some really good shavers. I don't think I could have gotten better shaves from a $300 DE as I did from my EJ DE89.
Then it got knocked out of my medicine cabinet, and the head broke off. That's probably (in my opinion) where a more expensive razor may...or may not have...paid off. Stainless or titanium wouldn't have broken the way the Zymak did. But, how many DE89s could I have bought at the price of a stainless or titanium razor?
I’ve never shaved with a modern razor that gave me a better shave than any vintage I own at 1/5 the cost.
Yep. This is why I suggest the Edwin Jagger-levels as a first razor. Buying new gives you confidence in the tool, so you can learn the technique...and you won't wonder if the problem is the razor if you make a mistake.
Once you get that down, you will probably pick up at least a little bit of an idea what to look for in a functional vintage razor. Take it home and get a "wow" shave right off the bat.
Plus, regularly getting decent shaves with something like an EJ removes the "sense of urgency" while you're looking for The One Razor to Rule Them All.
Merkur 34C was the very first DE I bought and used. All of the Merkur are very good razors IMO. With different skill levels required no doubt.
My first DE was a $9 Chinese Super Speed knock-off from Sally Beauty. My second DE shave was with the EJ DE89...that I ordered with the toilet paper still stuck on my face from the first DE shave.
I found my ONE RAZOR TO RULE THEM ALL (birth year Super Adjustable ) pretty early, so it's doubtful that I'll set out to buy another modern DE for myself. I'll pick up vintage razors as a collector/picker when I come across them.
I can't say lf anybody else feels this way, but the for me there have been two ways to feel joy about an object. One is to pay a ton and get a really nice thing that one can take pride in and even show off. The other is to get something really cheap or free and get it to do the same job.
I remember, for example, smiling from ear to ear when driving home from work in my strlpped-down Nissan Versa and seeing people with Mercedes or Range Rovers or whatever. I remember thinking that for the price of their car, I could have bought X number of mine, and taking satisfaction from that.
I think some people can get the same type of satisfaction by having a smooth, comfortable shave with a Baili or a vintage Tech they got for five bucks at an antique store or flea market.
Having said all that, I would enjoy having a nice Beemer, just as i enjoy shaving with a my rhodium-plated Toggle. Human psychology can be pretty complicated.
To an extent costs matter. The Gillette tech is an excellent razor. The reason I say costs matter is because it costs a certain amount for companies to make a product. If both Gillette and I were making techs today it would cost Gillette less to manufacture them than it would for me. Why? Because of economy of scale. Their material, labor and other associated costs are a lot lower per unit than mine. Why? Because they would be producing 10’s of thousands per week versus my 50-100 a week (if even that many)
This brought back memories of selling the huge MB V8 and getting the used Civic (the Green Rocket) with crank windows, basic AM/FM radio, and A/C. I loved the Green Rocket, hated the MB, and really did not miss the snobby MB mechanics. I am with you on nice Beemers. I am on my third. First was best, a 1970 2002. Recently we have had two superb X3s, the current one, a demo car, also having the (highly recommended) M package, basically the M suspension and M interior rather than the additional power (and cost) of an actual M. It is the most sure footed car I have ever owned. So returning to the original question, for me it is about finding the sweet spot where you find exactly what you seek and have no urge to spend more. The X3 and my ATT Windsor mixed metal are two happy outcomes for me. Other examples include a low level Pelikan Souveran pen (cheaper than a Montblanc nib) I like better than the Meisterstuck, my ancient Mizuno MP 29 blades picked up in 1980-something for a couple hundred (what you can pay for a single club today!), and my $29.95 Eagle Claw three weight fly rod. All that said, I may have zero interest in getting an upgrade to my ATT, but that does not mean that slant intrigue may not snare me someday.
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A fine example of a genuine pathology, as is the other extreme, the penny-pincher/spendthrift. For these individuals, the quality of the item is meaningless, the personal investment is EVERYTHING.
I would suggest there are possibly 2-3 tiers in genuine "investment/value" ratio.
Roughly the ~$100 USD mark, about the $300 mark, anything beyond that being very niche. The >$100 line brings a substantive increase in quality of materials and somewhat in finish. The $300 and up is very much about more refined machining, mixed or atypical metals, etc..
We can't legitimately evaluate vintage razors in the discussion, as they no longer have market-share to protect, they are what they are and in most cases, there are a bunch of them still available.
The materials and workmanship in a '50s SuperSpeed would easily put it in the $150 range today, as evidenced by some of the efforts to revive some vintage razors in modern production. E.g., Janus, the Gibbs repro, the all-stainless adjustable by Rockwell, etc..
This is a multi-faceted question. Certainly part of the answer has to do with the users needs and perception. Is the $25 bottle of wine of higher quality than the $8 bottle? For many people the answer depends on which one they like - which is a different question. Which is of higher quality: a painting of Elvis on velvet or Leonardo da Vinci's Mona Lisa? Some would prefer to have the painting of Elvis in the family room, but that represents personal choice and not quality.
I can think of no examples when quality didn't cost me more money. I often purchase items for considerably less than top shelf. I've never spent $1,000 for a suit, and it's pretty east to spend many times that amount - but I don't travel in circles where that kind of quality is necessary. Mine get the job done. I don't pretend mine are as nice, or that the people who buy top shelf goods are being duped and only paying for the label. I can't afford all top shelf goods, and frankly I don't have the desire, so it's no problem (aside from a nice Lamborghini - I'd still take one in any color).
Razors: I strongly suspect that a marriage of razor and face/beard (maybe technique?) is waaaaaaaay more important than quality. You could find a $5 razor that escaped the weak quality control and turned out fine - but better: perfect for your face/beard. That would be so much better for you than a $750 razor with absolutely the wrong level of aggression. Sure, it's nice to have both: high quality and a perfect match between razor and face/beard (assuming you're able and want to spend the money), but the match is way more important than the quality.
Like the Elvis painting, there is nothing wrong with loving a cheap razor that's a perfect match for you and gives you great shaves. Choice is a good thing, and it wouldn't be a real choice if you only shopped for high quality.
I can think of no examples when quality didn't cost me more money. I often purchase items for considerably less than top shelf. I've never spent $1,000 for a suit, and it's pretty east to spend many times that amount - but I don't travel in circles where that kind of quality is necessary. Mine get the job done. I don't pretend mine are as nice, or that the people who buy top shelf goods are being duped and only paying for the label. I can't afford all top shelf goods, and frankly I don't have the desire, so it's no problem (aside from a nice Lamborghini - I'd still take one in any color).
Razors: I strongly suspect that a marriage of razor and face/beard (maybe technique?) is waaaaaaaay more important than quality. You could find a $5 razor that escaped the weak quality control and turned out fine - but better: perfect for your face/beard. That would be so much better for you than a $750 razor with absolutely the wrong level of aggression. Sure, it's nice to have both: high quality and a perfect match between razor and face/beard (assuming you're able and want to spend the money), but the match is way more important than the quality.
Like the Elvis painting, there is nothing wrong with loving a cheap razor that's a perfect match for you and gives you great shaves. Choice is a good thing, and it wouldn't be a real choice if you only shopped for high quality.
