I was surprised as well. It’s a pretty dark roast, but not as dark as Starbucks or Peet’s. If I were just guessing I’d have gone closer to .35 or lower, but I’ve never measured coffee density before, so it wouldn’t be based on any real experience in that regard. I double checked my measurements, but I’ll probably repeat it to make sure. The recipe did work very well, though, so I doubt I was off by too much.
Coffee bean density
- Thread starter gpjoe
- Start date
I don't think it's actually off by too much, probably recipe 46. I hate to admit how much time I just spend on Don Pablo's website, but that's only because I was legitimately impressed. All of their descriptions indicate that their coffee should be all the way to second crack, but just. The other thing to consider is that Latin American coffees are inherently less dense to start with so I would expect the roasted bean to be on the lower end for it's roast level. I should add that all of my coffee roasted to 375 has no oils at all and that agrees with the density website and other publications. If Don Pablo's has even a few spots, it's darker.
At risk of making myself look even dumber, I want to share something I did today. I was trying to do a Nordic style roast on an Ethiopian coffee, ended up at City- which is technically further than they usually go. Or so I thought... I hadn't checked the density, just used my best guess on the grind and went with it. I was only one step too fine, I did check the extraction for my own entertainment and it was right where I like it.
So here's the thing, if I go by roast level and try to figure out which recipe it's just not right. But once I checked the density, two different vessels multiple times, I landed right on 450! That is a dense coffee no doubt, but it's not a cinnamon roast. So I think some of the wording needs to be reworked on the recipes to indicate a range of roasts that will use this density, I know that's a lot of work. After bringing up recipe 128, it perfectly corelated with what I was aiming for and would have hit had I not had the grind one step too fine. Incredible, like some kind of black magic! If you go by density and stick to it.
Addendum: looking again the recipe says light/light city for this one. It's the coffee roast levels chart page that has got some inconsistencies, but apparently the recipes already do account for my particular extra dense coffee.
So here's the thing, if I go by roast level and try to figure out which recipe it's just not right. But once I checked the density, two different vessels multiple times, I landed right on 450! That is a dense coffee no doubt, but it's not a cinnamon roast. So I think some of the wording needs to be reworked on the recipes to indicate a range of roasts that will use this density, I know that's a lot of work. After bringing up recipe 128, it perfectly corelated with what I was aiming for and would have hit had I not had the grind one step too fine. Incredible, like some kind of black magic! If you go by density and stick to it.
Addendum: looking again the recipe says light/light city for this one. It's the coffee roast levels chart page that has got some inconsistencies, but apparently the recipes already do account for my particular extra dense coffee.
I thought about this quite a bit last night. The 375 just didn’t sit right with me and your post confirmed I was right to doubt it.
This morning I had some time so I made an effort to shore up my measurements. First I weighed out 100 g water into my measuring cup to ensure the 100 mL line on it was accurate. That proved good so I moved on to measuring the Don Pablo beans again. I filled the cup to the 100 mL mark (after leveling with the Flair pro 2 tamper), weighed it, emptied out and refilled/weighed 2 more times. It’s possible that I’m off, but I was careful throughout the process and my results were consistent: 36.1, 35.9, 36.1. So I took the average of the three and used the recipe for 360. My grind was about 1 click too coarse, but the recipe worked exceptionally well. There was a very pleasant acidity present that I wouldn’t have really guessed could be that pronounced in a bean this dark. Shows how little I know about this science/art.
After the holidays calm down I’m going to get the 100 mL cylinder he recommends on the site just to eliminate that variable. I don’t know if 360 really matches up to the roast on these beans - there’s definitely some oil present. I’m open to the possibility of a flaw in my process and will be happy to revisit it if I made some glaring mistake. Here’s a pic of the beans from my bag for you to get an idea.
I love how you are figuring this out, you did exactly what I would have done with that bean. I honestly think you have the right number now for that bean. If you read the website carefully they pretty much hint that they are only roasting just to first crack and no further, if that’s true then it should preserve much of the flavors instead of converting them into caramel. You should be able to simply keep going finer until it tastes bitter and then back it off one, this is standard coffee making and will get as much out of the coffee as your palette wants! I have a TDS meter which helps tell me where I am on a coffee control chart, but honestly you can just use one and estimate based on your ratio. By grinding finer or using more beans, you are increasing your TDS even if you don’t know your starting point. There are lines on the chart and you basically are moving to the next one up, but you moving perpendicular not straight up so your extraction actually decreases slightly if all you do is change your ratio. I can post a link, but I use the SCAE chart instead of the SCAA one because it’s easier to use for single serving sizes.
Surprise!
Coffee Brewing - SCAE Special Coffee Association of Europe
SCAE: The Special Coffee Association of Europe - This Brewing Control Chart reflects the European standard and taste in brewed coffee.
mountaincity.com
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Time is one of those parameters people spend far too much time angsting over. It more of a ball park thing. Yes from first drip. If the recipe calls for 30 secs, and it comes flooding through in 15 sec, then you need to grind finer. If its choked up and its taking a minute for force anything through then grind coarser. but if its like 25 secs, dont sweat it. With your Flair you can ease of on the pressure and stretch the time out a bit if required anyway. You dont have to be perfect on any given recipe, just consistent. Then if you need to change recipe, its done by taste.
Absolutely and in fact this is what I have been meditating on all day without posting. I generally don't stick to time strictly, but yes you do need to make some adjustments if you are going to run long. I am lucky to have the TDS meter, even if only as a guide, because I can measure a shot that has gone long and decide whether I should adjust or not. The thing that is new to me is using less than 10 bar for every shot and trying to figure out how to get a high enough extraction without doing so. That is what I am still meditating on.
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