About those Carries of the Day ...

[Whisky]

I own a fair number of handguns but my EDC is almost always one of three. I grew up shooting 1911’s so they are the most natural for me to carry. The second one is a S&W M&P 9c WITH a thumb safety. I find the ergonomics and thumb safety are similar enough to my 1911’s that I am equally proficient with both. 3rd is an LCP that I slip in my pocket if I’m wearing running shorts or some other piece of clothing that doesn’t require a belt. With a Beltman belt and a Milt Sparks holster I can conceal the 1911 or M&P easily in any attire. The 1911 usually gets the nod when I’m dressed “fancy” just because it’s a little slimmer and maybe a tad more concealable.

 

[Earcutter]

Pictures do speak a thousand words. Bravo sir. Bravo.

Being a skilled operator and knowing the weapon you choose to be that with is a good thing.

But even yet, there is combat pistolcraft and there is purposed driven carrying. They are not one and the same and cannot be reasoned as such.

This isn’t rocket science. I won’t be carrying a .454 Casull concealed at church or a 9mm Glock fly fishing in bear country.

All weapons are a point and shoot proposition. Regardless of their manual of arms. Yes, get good and know your one gun for the rare possibility you might be in a gunfight to defend yourself.

But know, you better be just as competent with that big caliber revolver that has a completely different manual of arms when that Grizzly comes a callin’.

So I believe a moose is a tougher animal than a black bear. Don’t get me wrong, out in the woods, I think I’d be marginally more afraid of a black than I would the moose, but if you’ve ever hunted, you know a 30-30 is just fine on a black bear. It’ll take a moose too, but I wouldn’t pick one to hunt a moose with. So imagine my surprise when I saw a dude on his sled being blocked by a moose pull out his Glock and down the thing then and there!

I think the shooter is an idiot, but still. I was a little surprised it downed the animal. I wish he’d have at least killed it before driving off though.

Thats all to say, if the video illustrates anything, it illiterates the importance of getting rounds on target.

 

[wksimple]

Be knowledgeable and reasonably proficient with everything.

+1. When I entered the Academy in '77, we were taught to carry "the same gun, in the same holster, in the same place, everyday. And practice with what you carry." Good advice then, good advice now. When you draw your weapon FOR REAL, you want no surprises, no confusion.

My weapon platform has always been a revolver, being a K38 for duty, and a M49 for backup and off-duty. After I retired, I continued carrying the M49 always. It's old, beat up, shows its age, but is still tight and shoots where it's pointed.

BUT..............................

With recent events, I have finally felt the need to change weapon. For the past 5 months I have carried ONLY a Glock 26 and a 21-rd mag for backup. Make of it what you will.

If you want to get really good with your weapon, pick ONE and shoot the crap out of it!!!

 

[OkieStubble]

So I believe a moose is a tougher animal than a black bear. Don’t get me wrong, out in the woods, I think I’d be marginally more afraid of a black than I would the moose, but if you’ve ever hunted, you know a 30-30 is just fine on a black bear. It’ll take a moose too, but I wouldn’t pick one to hunt a moose with. So imagine my surprise when I saw a dude on his sled being blocked by a moose pull out his Glock and down the thing then and there!

I think the shooter is an idiot, but still. I was a little surprised it downed the animal. I wish he’d have at least killed it before driving off though.

Thats all to say, if the video illustrates anything, it illiterates the importance of getting rounds on target.

10mm for the win?

 

[Earcutter]

10mm for the win?

Are you confident it was a 10mm? I remember back in the day someone reported it was a 9. But man who knows. Pretty soft recoiling 10.

 

[xiletero]

But don't some people have a "primary" and a backup....
Or a carry and a truck....
Man I shave half my face with one razor and the other with another...just for the thrill of it (and to use them all).
And we haven't even touched much on the different holster types....
Day and night options might vary....(light/laser)
Location, location....where are you going.... needs might be different.
Magazine cap, weight, conceal.... . How many mags....and which size.....(or speedloaders/strips)
And then there is a blade and maybe pepper spray...., but I don't wear the same pants, same belt, boots and coat every day.... so there are choices.

 

[OkieStubble]

Are you confident it was a 10mm? I remember back in the day someone reported it was a 9. But man who knows. Pretty soft recoiling 10.

My Glock 20 recoils pretty soft.

 

[ScottChapin]

But don't some people have a "primary" and a backup....
Or a carry and a truck....
Man I shave half my face with one razor and the other with another...just for the thrill of it (and to use them all).
And we haven't even touched much on the different holster types....
Day and night options might vary....(light/laser)
Location, location....where are you going.... needs might be different.
Magazine cap, weight, conceal.... . How many mags....and which size.....(or speedloaders/strips)
And then there is a blade and maybe pepper spray...., but I don't wear the same pants, same belt, boots and coat every day.... so there are choices.

Exactly. I do keep the manual of arms the same, but at some point, muscle memory kicks in. When I pick up my accordion I don’t wonder whether it’s my fiddle and music comes out of either.

I would be concerned switching back and forth between guns with and without safeties.


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[jar_]

Exactly. I do keep the manual of arms the same, but at some point, muscle memory kicks in. When I pick up my accordion I don’t wonder whether it’s my fiddle and music comes out of either.

I would be concerned switching back and forth between guns with and without safeties.


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I have long carried both revolvers and semi-automatics (often at the same time) and so the issue of with or without safeties has never yet been an issue. I have on occasion caught myself swiping the safety to the fire position even on a safety-less semi.

 

[ScottChapin]

I have long carried both revolvers and semi-automatics (often at the same time) and so the issue of with or without safeties has never yet been an issue. I have on occasion caught myself swiping the safety to the fire position even on a safety-less semi.

I could see that, if you shoot with safeties often enough. I don’t and haven’t fired my 1911s for a few years. That’s sad when I think about it


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[dojpros]

"I won’t be carrying a .454 Casull concealed at church or a 9mm Glock fly fishing in bear country."

Frame of reference is everything. I do not hunt nor fly fish so I confess the backwoods/church dichotomy never got on my radar screen. Having said that, I would split the baby with the same Glock 40 I already own. Speer Gold Dots for Church and something by Buffalo Bore for the woods.

My post was in the CCW/Defensive use context and what I believe is mostly a false dichotomy between "full" sized guns i.e. Glock 19 and pocket pistols/sub compact etc.

 

[xiletero]

I drive a 4wd SUV mostly but sometimes a sports car with a stick shift and then sometimes a bike. Now these are very different machines, chances of something happening are way higher while driving than (a gun fight); yet I manage.

 

[OkieStubble]

"I won’t be carrying a .454 Casull concealed at church or a 9mm Glock fly fishing in bear country."

Frame of reference is everything. I do not hunt nor fly fish so I confess the backwoods/church dichotomy never got on my radar screen. Having said that, I would split the baby with the same Glock 40 I already own. Speer Gold Dots for Church and something by Buffalo Bore for the woods.

My post was in the CCW/Defensive use context and what I believe is mostly a false dichotomy between "full" sized guns i.e. Glock 19 and pocket pistols/sub compact etc.

Fair enough David, Fair enough.

 

[OkieStubble]

I drive a 4wd SUV mostly but sometimes a sports car with a stick shift and then sometimes a bike. Now these are very different machines, chances of something happening are way higher while driving than (a gun fight); yet I manage.

Now those definitely have different manual of arms! Great post! Humans are multi-capable that way.

 

[TimeOnTarget]

There was a time in my life when I was flying UH-60 helicopters and 747s concurrently. It all boils down to training and familiarity.

I admit that I ride the trigger reset on my Glocks, but I was also trained to understand the difference. It was impressed upon me that a wise man allows the trigger of an unfamiliar gun full and unhindered travel.

Your toolbox should be as large and complex as your needs and abilities.

 

[dreadpirate]

I just have one CCW. For my situation, I really don't need another one.

 

[dojpros]

TOT

I would go as far to say your reflexes, processing speed, etc are better than the average bear given what you do, how long you have done it and where/under what circumstances. Ergo, you ability to platform hop in the firearms context is simply superior.

In sum I think too many people look for hardware solutions to software problems because that have not spent the time/talent/treasure to get unconsciously competent with a given platform before jumping to another.

I posted the following below in a different forum where the OP was spending a bunch of time going back and forth re gun/holster and belt when he had not trained formally and have never evaluated his skill set against any objective standards for accuracy/time.

I asked:

Can you present from your preferred concealed carry system with your preferred platform and hit an 8 inch circle at 3 yards in under 2 seconds, COLD, every time?

Can you present from your preferred concealed carry system with your preferred platform, and do a FAST Test in under 10 seconds, COLD, every time with no points down? (Presumes Pistol, not Revolver)

F.A.S.T. (Fundamentals, Accuracy, & Speed Test)

designed by Todd Green Range: 7 yardsTarget: 3×5 card (head), 8″ plate (body), download .pdfStart position: weapon concealed or in duty condition with all holster retention devices activ…

pistol-training.com

Can you present from your preferred concealed carry system with your preferred platform, taking a big step off line and hit an 8 inch circle at 5 yards, with 5 rounds, in under 4 secs., COLD, every time?

Can you present from your preferred concealed carry system with your preferred platform and hit an 8 inch plate at 10 yrds, at will, COLD, every time with no time constraints?( bang, tink, bang, tink, bang, tink etc.)

Can you present from your preferred concealed carry system with your preferred platform and shoot a 5 shoot group at 5 yrds that you can cover with a credit card, COLD, every time?

Have you taken any formal training beyond a CCW class in the last 24 months?

If one cannot say yes, perhaps they should "dance with the one they brung" until they can. I know for me, that unless I have been doing the work, that precludes me carrying a J frame as opposed to my next smallest pistol- a Glock 19.

 

[TimeOnTarget]

I completely agree with what you are saying.

We have to be honest with ourselves about how much we are willing to invest in any endeavor.

I would rather see a person have one simple tool that they have mastered than to be overwhelmed and underperform with extra gizmos.

I can answer yes to your above questions, but this came at a cost.

And we all have to start somewhere.

 

[ScottChapin]

5 shots at 5 yards in a 3x5 index card in 5 seconds is good enough for Tom Givens. It’s good enough for me.


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[dojpros]

SC
I concur. I have hosted Tom, RO'ed for Tom and trained with Tom on multiple occasions.

My question is how many people can do it with all of the platforms they carry and/or use for defensive purposes?

Because if you cannot, I would suggest that platform might not be the best one for you for CCW/Defensive purposes.

Bottom line: if you can do put 5 shots in a 3x5 in 5 seconds every time with a given gun, rock on!

For me, today, that is probably not a J-Frame. That is probably not even an M9 or 3rd Gen S&W because the safety is "backwards" and I only have a few hundred rounds thru those platforms period.

With a Glock 19+ or a 5 inch 1911, I am probably in the game.