Honing prep for Surgical Black Ark

I'm interested to see how some of you are setting up your edges so that you can finish on a surgical black ark. Are some of you doing synth work up to 8k, 12k? What about other naturals prior to the SB? I'm trying to explore some options that might allow me to get the most benefit from using the SB as my final finishing stone. Thanks.

I think synth to 12k to ark would work well. I usually come off a natural like a maxed out coti edge then to the trans or black. I've also done jnat to ark with success.

I do soft Ark to trans black.

I've just started to use Arks and have come off Jnats with great results.

I've come off synthetics and naturals. No difference to me. The black arks are polishers. You may occasionally run across one that has a little cutting ability which will refine an edge right off an 8K and not be as good of a polisher. Same with trannies. The cool surrounding naturals is that no two are alike. I have one setup where the SB follows the tranny and another one where the tranny follows the SB. Naturals can be frustrating until you figure them out but once you nail your stone, look out whiskers!

Up to this point I haven't mixed my SB w/ any stones other than arks. I was doing a soft to hard to SB ark progression with slightly less than desired results. I mean the shave was decent but I felt that I hadn't achieved the level of refinement I was hoping for. I'm going to get to work in the morning on another razor and mix it up a bit.

Fine India > modern hard Arkansas > black hard Arkansas works well for me as a complete oil-stone progression. Soft Arkansas to modern hard Arkansas are very close, so close as to be redundant from my experience. Given what you said, my suggestion is to go from from soft to "SB ark," leaving out the middle stone.

Alum of Potash said:

Fine India > modern hard Arkansas > black hard Arkansas works well for me as a complete oil-stone progression. Soft Arkansas to modern hard Arkansas are very close, so close as to be redundant from my experience. Given what you said, my suggestion is to go from from soft to "SB ark," leaving out the middle stone.

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Same here. Many soft arks are easy to slurry which expands their range. If the edge is tree-topping off the soft, the hard arkie is redundant.

Sorry, strict oil use in my case with Arkansas stones and their ilk, involving variable pressure. Slurries are best reserved for water-stones; and even there, the benefit of a slurry is debatable. Slurry in oil?--no way, as viscosity there differs greatly compared to water.

But I will wholeheartedly agree with you in this:

kelbro said:

If the edge is tree-topping off the soft, the [current or new appellation] hard arkie is redundant.

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Slurry on a soft arkansas w/ oil isn't like slurry on a waterstone. The slurry is ideally flushing away; but the fact it's raising means a very crumbly, roughed up surface is exposed... which means the stone cuts faster; not because of the free particles, but because the surface is left very aggressive by the freed particles. It's not really something you encounter with razors (maybe with some very rough honing on wedges, I guess), but it's a common thing with heavier tools.

I've actually been interested in the fine India hone for a while. I had forgotten about it though until Alum had mentioned it. I've always been curious as to what they're like to hone on.

SliceOfLife said:

Slurry on a soft arkansas w/ oil isn't like slurry on a waterstone. The slurry is ideally flushing away; but the fact it's raising means a very crumbly, roughed up surface is exposed... which means the stone cuts faster; not because of the free particles, but because the surface is left very aggressive by the freed particles. It's not really something you encounter with razors (maybe with some very rough honing on wedges, I guess), but it's a common thing with heavier tools.

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Correct. More applicable to edged tools.

I have one that creates a great purple slurry. Once or twice I tried it with water to compare to BBW with slurry and it seemed to create a lower grit but I'm pretty certain that it was due to a 'cleaner' surface and not so much the slurry.

Here's a video I just posted in which I start over at bevel set then to a 5k. I'm going to deal with the surgical black finishing on a video soon but I think I'm going to refine the edge beyond what's in this video. Thanks ahead of time for those that watch.
https://youtu.be/OwMn7NqwY6Q

Here's part 2...
https://youtu.be/qwmr-hVsJdI

Here's the last video. I'm doing the finishing work on a 6X3 surgical black.
https://youtu.be/ujGVn3VKlqo

My progression is Norton 1k -> 4K -> 8K -> Chinese 12K -> Chinese 15K -> Finish on black Arkansas. When on the finishing the blade really glides at first. Then it seems stick or grab after a bit then I know its done.

Ark medium-Ark fine-Ark translucent-Ark black. Truth be told, I'm still in the apprentice stage with Arkansas stones on my razors. They do a hell of a job on my knives however. I'll get there though. My best edges are coming off a coticule. The incorporation of a BBW before starting the dilicot thing really helps with the process.

Thanks a lot for the ideas guys. BTW I pulled the first 2 videos off but the last one is still up with an extra one available if you go to my channel. I'll be posting more here and there but nothing too involved I don't think. I did shave off the edge I did on the video and man it did not disapoint!

What's a Chinese 15k, the synthetic Jade they sell on eBay?

SliceOfLife said:

What's a Chinese 15k, the synthetic Jade they sell on eBay?

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When I bought mine on ebay it came a 12x3x18 slab for $100. I had a friend with a lapidary saw cut up into a bunch 3x6x2 hones. I wish I could find the seller again. I'd cut more.

I'd think you can find a Chinese 15k on ebay for something like $40.

I can't remember if we are allowed to post ebay links or not. However, they are there.