Vermouth

In the "Shaken or Stirred" Martini thread, @Edinburgh mentioned his discovery of Dolin vermouth. (quoted below)

Made me think that Vermouth should have its own thread, since it is so vital to so many cocktails - be it Sweet Red or Dry White style.

What're your favorites? What new kinds have you found?

My latest discovery.... Carpano Antica Vermouth.
I admit that plain old Martini Sweet Vermouth is my everyday go-to, but I'll reach for the Carpano when I want a treat. If you've never tried it, it will blow you away. It has very rich, smooth flavors -- not flowery or bitter herbal -- more of a fruity, deeply spiced profile. It is amazing in a Manhattan.
It's pretty expensive (about $30 for a liter, IIRC) but well worth it. Many of the "craft" cocktail bars I've been to use it. (and is what made me search it out.)

Edinburgh said:

My discovering Dolin was life-changing, and nowadays I use nothing else. I used to think that I could never enjoy a Martini with more than just a few drops of Vermouth, but not anymore. I would encourage everyone to try using Dolin and then to increase the ratio of Vermouth slowly over time. I think many would be genuinely and pleasantly surprised with the result. I've also begun using Dolin in Manhattans and it's made a world of difference in them also. Dolin is more expensive, of course, but you really do get what you pay for when it comes to this.

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I must admit that I do not know a great deal about sweet vermouths. I can't even say I have a favorite, as I just don't use it that much around the house. I wouldn't mind changing that, but we aren't quite there.

My favorite dry vermouth was Noilly Prat Original (French) Dry. I say "was" because I'm having a devil of a time finding the stuff around here. Everything is the "extra dry." The story is that stuff is supposed to be made for an "American Dry Martini," but it lacks so much character that I may as well save a couple of bucks and get Martini (and that is a true shame).

I'm dying to try the Dolin.

langod said:

My latest discovery.... Carpano Antica Vermouth.

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Wonderful stuff. Best I've found.


Noilly Prat is my favorite for Dry.

Dolin is solid vermouth.
I've never had Carpano Antica Vermouth. I do Carpano enjoy Punt e Mes.
Cinzano is a solid budget friendly one to try out.
Cocchi Americano makes a good substitute (a touch bitter and quite lots of citrus)
Imbue from Oregon is more for enjoying on the rocks or with club soda. I like it, but I've never tried to mix a drink with it.

My personal favorite for a Martini is Cocchi Americano. I like like around a 4:1 gin to Cocchi ratio and a few drops of orange bitters. I serve it with an orange or lemon twist.

TexLaw said:

I must admit that I do not know a great deal about sweet vermouths. I can't even say I have a favorite, as I just don't use it that much around the house. I wouldn't mind changing that, but we aren't quite there.

My favorite dry vermouth was Noilly Prat Original (French) Dry. I say "was" because I'm having a devil of a time finding the stuff around here. Everything is the "extra dry." The story is that stuff is supposed to be made for an "American Dry Martini," but it lacks so much character that I may as well save a couple of bucks and get Martini (and that is a true shame).

I'm dying to try the Dolin.

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I'm not impressed with the Noilly Prat, either. I can get it readily, but haven't really found it to be much of a difference from Martini.
A dry vermouth I DO like -- although it isn't really a Vermouth -- is Lillet Blanc. It's not the same as what James Bond specified so famously for his Vesper Martini in Casino Royale*, but it is quite good. A little floral and maybe a touch sweeter than a true dry vermouth. The original Kina Lillet had Chinchona (quinine) in it, so was (reportedly) slightly bitter, but is not made anymore.


*"A dry martini," Bond said. "One. In a deep champagne goblet.""
Oui, monsieur."
"Just a moment. Three measures of Gordons , one of vodka, half a measure of Kina Lillet. Shake it very well until it's ice-cold, then add a large thin slice of lemon peel. Got it?"
"Certainly, monsieur." The barman seemed pleased with the idea.
"Gosh, that's certainly a drink," said Leiter.
Bond laughed. "When I'm...er...concentrating," he explained, "I never have more than one drink before dinner. But I do like that one to be large and very strong and very cold and very well-made. I hate small portions of anything, particularly when they taste bad. This drink's my own invention. I'm going to patent it when I can think of a good name."
—Ian Fleming, Casino Royale, Chapter 7, "Rouge et Noir'

ciderguy said:

My personal favorite for a Martini is Cocchi Americano. I like like around a 4:1 gin to Cocchi ratio and a few drops of orange bitters. I serve it with an orange or lemon twist.

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I'm going to have to find that..... Sounds great!

langod said:

I'm going to have to find that..... Sounds great!

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Cocchi Americano is very good. I use it as a sub for the original Kina Lillet in a Corpse Reviver #2.

I recently bought a bottle of Cocchi Vermouth di Torino but I won't open it until the open bottle of Carpano Antica is gone. I hate to have more than one bottle of each (sweet/dry) open at a time. They just don't keep that well...

langod said:

I'm not impressed with the Noilly Prat, either. I can get it readily, but haven't really found it to be much of a difference from Martini.
A dry vermouth I DO like -- although it isn't really a Vermouth -- is Lillet Blanc. It's not the same as what James Bond specified so famously for his Vesper Martini in Casino Royale*, but it is quite good. A little floral and maybe a touch sweeter than a true dry vermouth. The original Kina Lillet had Chinchona (quinine) in it, so was (reportedly) slightly bitter, but is not made anymore.


*"A dry martini," Bond said. "One. In a deep champagne goblet.""
Oui, monsieur."
"Just a moment. Three measures of Gordons , one of vodka, half a measure of Kina Lillet. Shake it very well until it's ice-cold, then add a large thin slice of lemon peel. Got it?"
"Certainly, monsieur." The barman seemed pleased with the idea.
"Gosh, that's certainly a drink," said Leiter.
Bond laughed. "When I'm...er...concentrating," he explained, "I never have more than one drink before dinner. But I do like that one to be large and very strong and very cold and very well-made. I hate small portions of anything, particularly when they taste bad. This drink's my own invention. I'm going to patent it when I can think of a good name."
—Ian Fleming, Casino Royale, Chapter 7, "Rouge et Noir'

I'm going to have to find that..... Sounds great!

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I discovered Cocchi Americano when experimenting with the Vesper Martini. Many say it is the closest thing to Kina Lillet. I never expected to enjoy it so much. It is a regular part of my bar now. I'll even drink it with a twist and soda water.

I use Lillet Blanc for a different inspired cocktail that came about by my endless martini variations. 4:1 ratio again. Martin Miller's gin, a few drops of Crème de violette (Creme Yvette will work as well), 1 Dash of Orange Bitters, 1-2 Dashes of Cardamon bitters, flamed orange twist. A little elaborate, but I really enjoy it.

OldAF said:

Cocchi Americano is very good. I use it as a sub for the original Kina Lillet in a Corpse Reviver #2.

I recently bought a bottle of Cocchi Vermouth di Torino but I won't open it until the open bottle of Carpano Antica is gone. I hate to have more than one bottle of each (sweet/dry) open at a time. They just don't keep that well...

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Yes, Vermouth doesn't keep that well. I try to use a bottle within a month of purchase, and I keep them in the refrigerator.

langod said:

In the "Shaken or Stirred" Martini thread, @Edinburgh mentioned his discovery of Dolin vermouth. (quoted below)

Made me think that Vermouth should have its own thread, since it is so vital to so many cocktails - be it Sweet Red or Dry White style.

What're your favorites? What new kinds have you found?

My latest discovery.... Carpano Antica Vermouth.
I admit that plain old Martini Sweet Vermouth is my everyday go-to, but I'll reach for the Carpano when I want a treat. If you've never tried it, it will blow you away. It has very rich, smooth flavors -- not flowery or bitter herbal -- more of a fruity, deeply spiced profile. It is amazing in a Manhattan.
It's pretty expensive (about $30 for a liter, IIRC) but well worth it. Many of the "craft" cocktail bars I've been to use it. (and is what made me search it out.)

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Great thread!

Carpano Antica is my "go to" Sweet Vermouth. A Manhattan depends too much on the quality of the vermouth to mess around with that IMHO. It iOS also fantastic in a Negroni, Vieux Carre, and La Louisianne.

For a day vermouth I like Ransome.

Last night, I had a Manhattan made with the Dolin sweet vermouth, and it was quite good.

TexLaw said:

Last night, I had a Manhattan made with the Dolin sweet vermouth, and it was quite good.

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Dolin is some good stuff.

TexLaw said:

My favorite dry vermouth was Noilly Prat Original (French) Dry. I say "was" because I'm having a devil of a time finding the stuff around here. Everything is the "extra dry." The story is that stuff is supposed to be made for an "American Dry Martini," but it lacks so much character that I may as well save a couple of bucks and get Martini (and that is a true shame).

I'm dying to try the Dolin.

Click to expand...

I was dismayed to discover today that I can't get Noilly Prat "French Dry" anymore either. My local guy recommended Dolin as a replacement and of course, people here have said good things about it. Still, I'm always disappointed when something I like changes for the WORSE.

OldAF said:

I was dismayed to discover today that I can't get Noilly Prat "French Dry" anymore either. My local guy recommended Dolin as a replacement and of course, people here have said good things about it. Still, I'm always disappointed when something I like changes for the WORSE.

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Try Ransom for good dry Vermouth. I think it works very well.

eezee said:

Try Ransom for good dry Vermouth. I think it works very well.

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Thanks, I'll look for it. I've been acquiring a few sweet vermouths to try lately but I doubt any will surpass Carpano Antica Formula in a Manhattan.

OldAF said:

Thanks, I'll look for it. I've been acquiring a few sweet vermouths to try lately but I doubt any will surpass Carpano Antica Formula in a Manhattan.

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I agree 100%. I just don't think you can beat Carpano.

I had a Manhattan the other day and it was made with Dolin Sweet Vermouth. It was very good. I still prefer the Carpano, but Dolin is certainly a fine vermouth.

I came across this yesterday and found it interesting. A guide to vermouths by style: http://vermouth101.com/vermouth-styles.html

bigxnyc said:

I came across this yesterday and found it interesting. A guide to vermouths by style: http://vermouth101.com/vermouth-styles.html

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That's a nice guide with good information. Thanks!

bigxnyc said:

I came across this yesterday and found it interesting. A guide to vermouths by style: http://vermouth101.com/vermouth-styles.html

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Awesome link! Thank you for sharing!

ciderguy said:

Yes, Vermouth doesn't keep that well. I try to use a bottle within a month of purchase, and I keep them in the refrigerator.

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I have a half-used bottle of vermouth in the basement fridge from back in the day when I was keen on martinis. That was about 15 years ago.

I guess I should probably toss it.

Doc4 said:

I have a half-used bottle of vermouth in the basement fridge from back in the day when I was keen on martinis. That was about 15 years ago.

I guess I should probably toss it.

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It loses it flavor and can become oxidized or undergo maderization. I'm not sure if it goes bad to the point where it becomes harmful. I've never had a bottle last long enough to find out.