No guard DE?

Gytis said:

Still I cant understand how does razor can be felt as more mild or aggressive if there is no gap, no guard, nothing...

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MisfitWy23 said:

Weight? Balance? Color? Moon phase affecting the gravitational pull? ....

(My guess would be more the first two.)

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Weight, definitely. The stainless UFO is much heavier than the aluminum one. Also, early in this thread someone mentioned blade exposure, and I think that's a factor, too. The amount of blade that sticks out on the Fatip is huge. On one of my BBX base plates the holes aren't exactly centered, so that more blade sticks out on one side than the other. The side with more blade sticking out is more effective.

So I have been doing this long before this thread was posted. A couple days after I posted this I had to try it.http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/369204-What-have-I-got-here?highlight= I have been useing it on occasion since, I had thought of filing one side of a new lc to see how it shaved also I think Ill try tomorrow.

Thanks for the reference, King camp. There I found most important evidence that almost in very beginning of DE shaving some people realized futility of guards and took them off. Unfortunately we dont know how do they called this perfect tool.

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I also think I have to post a link to old and forgiven thread with the same theme - devette http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/270613-Is-this-Gillette-modified-or-just-really-rare
Interesting is that only one member in this thread said (should be he has tried it) that this tool is really made for shaving...

Yes probably because they were used to straights at that time that link was already in mine though.

I just had to try useing it after all the commments saying how dangerous it looked and how if its for wallpaper its not for your face.

Viseguy said:

Also, early in this thread someone mentioned blade exposure, and I think that's a factor, too. The amount of blade that sticks out on the Fatip is huge.

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Yes blade exposure is a big variable in the mechanics here - my bakelite and 2013 R41 both have smaller blade exposure for a quicker easier shave, the RiMei and Yuma bigger blade exposure and perhaps slightly less comfort.

Gytis said:

Thanks for the reference, King camp. There I found most important evidence that almost in very beginning of DE shaving some people realized futility of guards and took them off. Unfortunately we dont know how do they called this perfect tool.

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OMFG!! This is the missing link isn't it?
The bit we've been missing is leaving the corners of the guard intact.
This solves the problems of the poky cap corners and being able to lay the razor down.
It's time for the New Improved Devette:


But how does it shave...?

Yes! Yes! Yes! Vicco approves!
It's the New Improved Devette with guarded corners and it turns something amazing into something PERFECT.

Old Type Devette vs New Improved Devette:

At last, the answer that devette users across the globe have been waiting for

Leaving the guard corners intact gives:

a) The same perfect zero-irritation guaranteed BBS shaves.
b) The same attractive option of steep angle.
c) Guaranteed zero-blade flex
d) The added convenience and freedom to rest the razor on its side as with guarded DEs
and
e) At last! - No more Poky Cap Corner Anxiety...ever!

Impress the ones you love with your PERFECT shaves every time.

It also has the appeal (to some) of being a bit more of a project than just snapping the guard off or using a washer.

Wow!

And massive thanks to King camp, Gytis, Mike H, M80 (who sourced the newspaper clipping) and most significantly P.W Calhoun for this amazing suggestion from the Great Depression.

It has just given me one of the best shaves of my life so far

Great, more reasons to try new things! Something to do tomorrow then!

mjclark said:

b) The same attractive option of steep angle.

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Wouldn't the two end teeth be a problem for that?

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/270613-Is-this-Gillette-modified-or-just-really-rare

I'm not overlooking the seam skinner in that link, either: the beveled top cap could be useful on the guarded side of a half-sider. I was shown a Schick Krona TTO with a similar feature.

captaincaveman said:

Wouldn't the two end teeth be a problem for that?

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No - I really thought they would cause a problem with steep angle in the RiMei but they don't!

I'm not sure why, since it's counterintuitive, and it definitely goes to show that the true mechanics of the steep angle are still obscure.

Perhaps because the skin is flexible and not perfectly flat, the guard corners cause the skin to bow outward slightly.
It's a great opportunity for some more diagrams

And really, like with our first devette constructions, I really urge people to try this out and see what happens.

For me this is the next leap forwards and a definite improvement to something that was already excellent.

tlentz said:

I have some wallpaper that won't come off. I think this will work.

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Ha ha - tlentz was curiously right on the money very early on in this thread.

So, anybody have a beater Gillette NEW or something that they are willing to sand off all the teeth except for the ones on the end and give us a report?

I like Mr. Calhoun's idea of leaving one side of the razor as it came from the factory, and turning the other side into a modified devette. It's the best of both worlds!

Unfortunately, all my NEWs are too beautiful to mess with. Maybe I can hunt down a true user grade NEW at an antique store or on e-bay and give this a try.

kingfisher said:

So, anybody have a beater Gillette NEW or something that they are willing to sand off all the teeth except for the ones on the end and give us a report?

I like Mr. Calhoun's idea of leaving one side of the razor as it came from the factory, and turning the other side into a modified devette. It's the best of both worlds!

Unfortunately, all my NEWs are too beautiful to mess with. Maybe I can hunt down a true user grade NEW at an antique store or on e-bay and give this a try.

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Well it works superbly with the RiMei so the superior build quality and spot on geometry of the NEW should create something sublime.

A few of my old bakelites had differential aggression - much more blade exposure on one side than on the other as an alternative to being adjustable, and having one side guardless takes that to the extreme.

How thrilling that we've found documentary precedent -- or rather had already done so years ago -- for the devette (beyond the anecdotal usage by fathers/grandfathers that some members have reported)!

I, for one, am a bit dubious about leaving the corner teeth intact, as it would seem to interfere with the freedom of shave* that the "Old Type" devette affords. Also, I've never, ever poked myself with a corner of the blade, so that's not an issue for me. Nevertheless, I'm glad that I have four Rimeis on the way, so that I can try it both ways. (Actually, there are four ways: full comb on one side/no comb on the other, full comb/corner comb, corner comb/corner comb, and no comb/no comb.)

BTW, how hard is it to get the teeth off the Rimei base plate? Do I need a humongous pliers, or will an ordinary-size one do?


--
* A penumbral First Amendment right, as I'm sure constitutional scholars would agree.

Viseguy said:

How thrilling that we've found documentary precedent -- or rather had already done so years ago -- for the devette (beyond the anecdotal usage by fathers/grandfathers that some members have reported)!

I, for one, am a bit dubious about leaving the corner teeth intact, as it would seem to interfere with the freedom of shave* that the "Old Type" devette affords. Also, I've never, ever poked myself with a corner of the blade, so that's not an issue for me. Nevertheless, I'm glad that I have four Rimeis on the way, so that I can try it both ways. (Actually, there are four ways: full comb on one side/no comb on the other, full comb/corner comb, corner comb/corner comb, and no comb/no comb.)

BTW, how hard is it to get the teeth off the Rimei base plate? Do I need a humongous pliers, or will an ordinary-size one do?


--
* A penumbral First Amendment right, as I'm sure constitutional scholars would agree.

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Yes thrilling is the word! This thread started out as a novelty piece and has turned into a proper 21st century shaving adventure rediscovering lost knowledge from the 1930's.

The RiMei guard snaps off for me with a normal pair of pliers and really doesn't require much force and it took only a few minutes to hacksaw through the guard on each side when I left the guard corners on.

Leaving the guard corners intact definitely improves the experience for me.
It is equally as effective, still allows for steep angle but is more comfortable and I can put the razor down flat now.

It will be interesting to hear what you make of it and what others think...

It seems like the Fatip would be a natural for the corner-guards devette. It's not hideous looking but it's not too beautiful for words/it's not too expensive/but it's made of brass, so the cut and filed portions would not open it up to corrosion. Of course I'm thinking in terms of leaving one side with the whole comb intact. It would even be easy to experiment with wild-siding since the razor has a lot of blade play.

Latest devette variant: EJ top cap, BBX base plate, Weber Bulldog handle (top cap and handle finished in Cerakote Flat Dark Earth by B&B member SubSailor).

The blade exposure is significantly less than with the Fatip top cap, which makes it more manageable. It's still a challenge, though, due to the weight of the Weber handle. This is the loudest razor I've ever used, bar none. It doesn't sing, it growls. Probably due to the fact that the EJ top cap and the Weber handle don't make a very tight fit -- in fact, there is noticeable play between the two until you insert a blade. With a blade, it's fine. I had a perfect -- BBS, bloodless, irritation-free -- shave with it last night.

Viseguy said:

Latest devette variant: EJ top cap, BBX base plate, Weber Bulldog handle (top cap and handle finished in Cerakote Flat Dark Earth by B&B member SubSailor).

The blade exposure is significantly less than with the Fatip top cap, which makes it more manageable. It's still a challenge, though, due to the weight of the Weber handle. This is the loudest razor I've ever used, bar none. It doesn't sing, it growls. Probably due to the fact that the EJ top cap and the Weber handle don't make a very tight fit -- in fact, there is noticeable play between the two until you insert a blade. With a blade, it's fine. I had a perfect -- BBS, bloodless, irritation-free -- shave with it last night.

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Superb! And it looks so good.
I guess blade exposure and razor weight are the crucial factors in devette mechanics.
Along with choice of blade of course

I just read this whole thread front to back. Quite the journey, I must say.

You people are either insane or brilliant. Once I work up the courage, I will prove one to be true...

You guys, correction, we guys must be crazy. I just made a no-guard razor after reading this thread. It's late here, so I'll clean up the
cut bar-ends tomorrow when I can use my Dremel.

I took a couple of very short dry-shave strokes with it--it's usable. Now I'll have to try it with a properly prepped face. This head's blade exposure wasn't even with the bars; but it may not matter with no bar in the way. I trashed this head earlier this evening; but resurrected it after reading this thread.






Update
Just shaved with the above, but on stubble that was only hours old. Damn, this thing shaves super-close. I no longer fear the R41 after using this razor. I'm not sure I'll venture into its territory again. Anything less than mindfulness could end in something akin to placing one's face in a deli meat-slicer. And if one's not careful, very careful, it will bite like a Tasmanian Devil. Fortunately, I had no nicks, weepers, or cuts. It may have been first-time luck. I think if I want similar blade exposure, I will look into an R41 and put the safety back in safety razor. But I confess, I've never had a closer shave. It's a bit tricky on one's upper lip, notably under one's nose. I was concerned about the stubble where my upper lip meets my mustache area, but I came away unscathed. Also, if one needs to learn 'zero pressure', this razor is 'the' rapid-teaching short-course. It was fun, guys. I kind of expected Rod Serling to appear in the mirror, "Roger has decided to take it upon himself to test fate. He's gone beyond time and space and into another dimension--a dimension we call (pause) The Twilight Zone." Da-da-da dum.