A lot of people in Manhattan wear button downs with suits, although it's not my preference. I do wear them for casual or business casual purposes. I'll confess I'm not a huge fan of khakis.
Gentlman's accessories: Ties, cufflinks, shoes, etc
- Thread starter gaseousclay
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A lot of people in Manhattan wear button downs with suits, although it's not my preference. I do wear them for casual or business casual purposes. I'll confess I'm not a huge fan of khakis.
I hadn't even thought of "Manhattan anti-prep", altho' I'm sure it exists. I was thinking more of old English "rules" and the like. Of course, the gents I was thinking of who would succeed in breaking the rule about button-downs and suits, would never want to be mistaken for a New Yorker!
The key of course (easier to say than do) is to break the rules the right way, rather than the wrong way. Therein lies style.
If you have a Jos A Banks nearby they have some really good sales from time to time. A really good custom suitmaker will charge somewhere in the neighborhood of $1200.00 for starters. You can spend more based on things like real buttonholes in the jacket, fabric, etc... As far as the half or full windsor thing, learn to tie both, and tie your knot based on the spread of your collar. The wider the points of the collar are from one another, the bigger the knot should be. You are trying to "fill" that space. I try to keep different thickneses and varieties around for just this reason. If you are buying a suit, I would also suggest a nice black, or Navy Blue as they are the most versatile.
I hadn't even thought of "Manhattan anti-prep", altho' I'm sure it exists. I was thinking more of old English "rules" and the like. Of course, the gents I was thinking of who would succeed in breaking the rule about button-downs and suits, would never want to be mistaken for a New Yorker!
The key of course (easier to say than do) is to break the rules the right way, rather than the wrong way. Therein lies style.
I do not think any Brit or European would ever wear a button down collar shirt with a suit. Button down collars from what I can tell are a States only thing, at least for non sports wear. Maybe Brits are still wearing them to play polo which is supposedly the origin.
I do not know whether J Press actually dresses the Eastern ruling elite or just seems like it does. My bet would be the former. I really like the look. American Trad as I understand it, although I bet a lot of their customers would never use that term, if they had ever heard it.
Correct, the button down collar was born during a polo match and imported to the US via Brooks Brothers and while I have seen some Europeans wear button down collars with slacks and/or a sport coat, I've never seen Europeans wear a button down collar with a tie or suit.
I was thinking more of Italians than Brits ... but in a "look at me, how stylishly I am breaking that rule about button-down shirts and suits" way rather than "this is the proper shirt to wear ... why is everyone looking at me funny?" way.
Most Italians are very fashionable...at least the ones who button their shirts up past their navel.
Yeah, I cannot think of too much about Italian suiting that seems garish or declasse or anything. Of course, I doubt that we see anything below a certain quality over here. No telling what the average businessman in Italy wears.
I guess I am not found of ventless suit coats, at least when they are not double breasted. They seem kind of unfinished to me and it seems to me that vents serve a function.
Wonder what it was that caused Italians to become so skilled in clothing, shoes, and the like.
L
Lo'Tek
On the Windsor - I wear a suit & tie at least twice a week. I use to wear a Half Windsor, but it always looked crooked, and I was tyeing it right. A friend gave me a etiquette book and I tried the Full Windsor. If you want to look classy do a Full Windsor - no one of upper status that I have ever encountered wears a half, if this means anything to you. In the end it is all about preference, but Halves are in my opinion too casual and sloppy; Halves are for teens and "brat bunch" type movie stars exhibiting the "bad boy" look. To dress to impress - go with some better looking knot. It only takes a few more seconds to go "Full" on the Windsor. If you want a smaller knot, simply use a smaller tie. To keep it from bunching while tyeing keep each pass flat with the previous pass. If you want it more casual, just loosen it a bit like you would a Half Windsor.
I also second the Men's Warehouse. I bought four suits two years ago, two from them. They where on sale & with the card I got a free pare of Cole & Han shoes in a dark, deep burgundy or plum. I'm still trying to figure out who I prefer for shirts. The thing about shirts is that they wear out at the collar and cuff, which are the parts that show when you wear a dinner jacket; they are also the parts that get food and drink stains - especially the cuff; so I try to go with off white or natural colours when casual. I prefer wrinkle resistant shirts which look good straight out of the dryer - you can always quickly hit the collar & cuff if you want it a little more crisp. I have found for my self that I tend to go with higher quality coloured shirts & slightly lower quality whites. It just stinks when you can't get a stain out of a real nice white cuff that you paid good money for, especially when it's only the first time you have worn it. Then again, maybe I just too messy and need to learn better eating etiquette.
I also second the Men's Warehouse. I bought four suits two years ago, two from them. They where on sale & with the card I got a free pare of Cole & Han shoes in a dark, deep burgundy or plum. I'm still trying to figure out who I prefer for shirts. The thing about shirts is that they wear out at the collar and cuff, which are the parts that show when you wear a dinner jacket; they are also the parts that get food and drink stains - especially the cuff; so I try to go with off white or natural colours when casual. I prefer wrinkle resistant shirts which look good straight out of the dryer - you can always quickly hit the collar & cuff if you want it a little more crisp. I have found for my self that I tend to go with higher quality coloured shirts & slightly lower quality whites. It just stinks when you can't get a stain out of a real nice white cuff that you paid good money for, especially when it's only the first time you have worn it. Then again, maybe I just too messy and need to learn better eating etiquette.
I think it goes back to the early days of the Roman Empire. Florence, Venice and Genoa were Europe's main trading hubs with the Orient, and as such the people of those cities picked up the skill of silk turning. The Roman elite used the Italians to manufacture all their clothing, a practice that continued on through the Renaissance. Italy was who the European aristocracy turned to for their clothing, so they were always looked at as being at the forefront of fashion and skill in making clothes.
Giorgio Armani no more need be said.....
Some of my favorites are Brioni, Canali, Ferragamo and Zegna.
Bumping for Memory Lane Monday a day late- sorry, I lost track of time on vacation.
I may have said it before, but accessories (watches, cuff links) are the one area where men are allowed to "bling" up an outfit.
+1 It's all about the small details.
