Anybody use Suita stone?

[Plein]

Unlucky me that I interesting on razor cause I sold my nakayama karasu to my best friend and he told it quite special.

no strop needed and better result than Nakayama kiita maruka.For now I may not have a chance to get that kind of stone anymore.Have just hard Okudo shiro Suita and Shobudani shiki suita su nachi.

both get ok or nice I'm not sure.No another hardest stone to compare but wanna know if anybody use Suita stone to hone and what kind of use that bring you the best result(i mean only water or lot of slurry...etc...)

thank you so much!

 

[Steve56]

I've used one and so has Alfredo (Doc226) I believe. Getting the best edge takes a lighter touch on them, if they are fine enough, not all of them are.

Cheers, Steve

 

[Gamma]

Different suita = different techniques.
Many Suita are softer and seemingly not as fine as what most of us choose for finishing razors.
I do like edges off my Okudo, Ive had other Suita that gave up good edges too.
But - those edges arent like what I get from harder/finer stones from other layers.

 

[buca3152]

I have 3 that I would regard as finishers. An okudu sunashi , a shinden yama renge that is harder than my wakasa tomo, and an ozaki suita. Different edge than a harder stone though. Certainly sharp enough to shave with. And my hideriyama suita that I love to use for prefinishing.

 

[Plein]

I've used one and so has Alfredo (Doc226) I believe. Getting the best edge takes a lighter touch on them, if they are fine enough, not all of them are.

Cheers, Steve

Hello!Steve

Thank you so much.

Plein

 

[Plein]

Different suita = different techniques.
Many Suita are softer and seemingly not as fine as what most of us choose for finishing razors.
I do like edges off my Okudo, Ive had other Suita that gave up good edges too.
But - those edges arent like what I get from harder/finer stones from other layers.

Let Say most Suita(Ex.Ohira) that easy to use came at 3.5 hardness my Okudo shiro suita and Shobu Shiki Suita Su nachi is around 4.5

but different edge would be a key that why I feel a bit strange.

 

[buca3152]

A 3.5 hardness vs a 4.5 hardness(assuming the rating is consistent and accurate) for a finisher will create a completely different edge. If they were the same fineness, I think the softer stone would be releasing many more particles that the harder one. You could try under running water to constantly clear the particles that are self slurrying as you are using it. I dont think I would unless I didnt have anything else to use. That is your choice of course.

 

[Plein]

I have 3 that I would regard as finishers. An okudu sunashi , a shinden yama renge that is harder than my wakasa tomo, and an ozaki suita. Different edge than a harder stone though. Certainly sharp enough to shave with. And my hideriyama suita that I love to use for prefinishing.

Thank you so much!
I agree that It certainly sharp enough.
Anyway the key is going to be a kind of different Edge feeling,right?
It not that smooth as good asagi or karasu cut.It feel more drier in my opinion.

 

[buca3152]

Ive gotten very keen and smooth edges from my shinden. BUT I have a few go to finishers that are easy and produce great edges quickly without too much fuss. The suita has to be worked to deliver the sharpness, the others dont need that.

 

[Plein]

A 3.5 hardness vs a 4.5 hardness(assuming the rating is consistent and accurate) for a finisher will create a completely different edge. If they were the same fineness, I think the softer stone would be releasing many more particles that the harder one. You could try under running water to constantly clear the particles that are self slurrying as you are using it. I dont think I would unless I didnt have anything else to use. That is your choice of course.

Thank you!

 

[Gamma]

Many suita have a particular composition that, IMO, doesn't lend it self well to what people think they know about hardness ratings.
Truthfully, very hard Suita are often viewed as low quality, but it's a subjective thing and I'm just starting to understand it now.
My Okudo is hard, but not hard like a Tomae.
Different stone - different understanding.

For me - LV numbers are sort of a joke and reliance upon them a complete waste of time.
I've stopped using them completely. I have two stones that are both very hard, equally hard actually - but with totally different densities - they do not behave the same in any regard. As much as some poobahs have touted that the main (only) POV is hardness - the story is deeper than that, much deeper. Much much deeper actually.

Saying this/that stone is a 'finisher' is sort of a misnomer - because whatever you finish on is the finisher.
Me, I have another layer of concern and I look for what the stone's overall capability is, edge wise. So - I finsih on my Okudo but I don't consider it a 'finisher' - not really. But I hate the word pre-finisher so I just say I finish on it.
I get lovely edges on that stone, and they're different edges. Yet I don't call it a finishing stone. I think, technically, it isn't - but that's not why. I just don't see them as finishers. I know - that's contradictory at one level. A deeper understanding yields a broader understanding. Somedays - the more I learn the less I know.

Getting different edges is a good thing - I like using all sorts of hones to finish on.
Even though people said you can't finish on Suita, my 2nd or 3rd Jnat was an Okudo Suita;I wanted to try it out. Sure - I honed and shaved well off it. The next Suitas I owned gave good, but completely different, edges though. All in good fun. I have two suita now, love them.

Back when - The grand wizards of the universe had decided that Suita were not fit for honing or finishing razors. Having read so much b/s about Jnats I figured I'd give it a spin. Worked well. The wizards were wrong. Imagine that.
You can use Mikawa Nagura with theim too - no problem - they were wrong about that also.
Yeah yeah - I know, burn the witch.


What I find to be important - is the cutting action (speed) and how well the slurry behaves. Hardness? Meh - to a point it's important, sure.
Surely, finish honing a razor on a very very soft Suita is terrible for me, same for just about any type of stone - but once the stone hits the 'hard' level other factors become equally or more important. Moreso than it does with the more popular and harder layers.

 

[jklip13]

I like to finish razors on an Okudo Suita I have, although its not a typical suita. I cant see any Su and to be honest it performs a lot more like a hard Tomae

 

[Gamma]

That's a pretty stone.
Suita were the stones that attracted me to Jnats first - just the looks were enough to grab me.
I had an Okudo that was similar to how you describe yours, very different type of stone for sure.

 

[Plein]

Many suita have a particular composition that, IMO, doesn't lend it self well to what people think they know about hardness ratings.
Truthfully, very hard Suita are often viewed as low quality, but it's a subjective thing and I'm just starting to understand it now.
My Okudo is hard, but not hard like a Tomae.
Different stone - different understanding.

For me - LV numbers are sort of a joke and reliance upon them a complete waste of time.
I've stopped using them completely. I have two stones that are both very hard, equally hard actually - but with totally different densities - they do not behave the same in any regard. As much as some poobahs have touted that the main (only) POV is hardness - the story is deeper than that, much deeper. Much much deeper actually.

Saying this/that stone is a 'finisher' is sort of a misnomer - because whatever you finish on is the finisher.
Me, I have another layer of concern and I look for what the stone's overall capability is, edge wise. So - I finsih on my Okudo but I don't consider it a 'finisher' - not really. But I hate the word pre-finisher so I just say I finish on it.
I get lovely edges on that stone, and they're different edges. Yet I don't call it a finishing stone. I think, technically, it isn't - but that's not why. I just don't see them as finishers. I know - that's contradictory at one level. A deeper understanding yields a broader understanding. Somedays - the more I learn the less I know.

Getting different edges is a good thing - I like using all sorts of hones to finish on.
Even though people said you can't finish on Suita, my 2nd or 3rd Jnat was an Okudo Suita;I wanted to try it out. Sure - I honed and shaved well off it. The next Suitas I owned gave good, but completely different, edges though. All in good fun. I have two suita now, love them.

Back when - The grand wizards of the universe had decided that Suita were not fit for honing or finishing razors. Having read so much b/s about Jnats I figured I'd give it a spin. Worked well. The wizards were wrong. Imagine that.
You can use Mikawa Nagura with theim too - no problem - they were wrong about that also.
Yeah yeah - I know, burn the witch.


What I find to be important - is the cutting action (speed) and how well the slurry behaves. Hardness? Meh - to a point it's important, sure.
Surely, finish honing a razor on a very very soft Suita is terrible for me, same for just about any type of stone - but once the stone hits the 'hard' level other factors become equally or more important. Moreso than it does with the more popular and harder layers.

most stone for me is for carpenter tool.I experience with just 4-5 suita.ever have one that very hard okudo su nachi suita( same hardness as very hard nakaya asagi/kiita) cant use without slurry.but result is one of the best stone I ever have along with that karasu I sold to friend.
Most of my stone came from collector in Japan (he can share me some that not perfect shape but good quality) who my brother have some special connection with him.But agree with you that hardness will not tell exactly quality of stone.I just talk about hardness at all good quality one.
when I start to buy the stone I bought from famous vendor he told his 3.5 stone better and harderthan another not nice vendor level 5 stone I have.
i believe in him and bought his stone.the result= his 3.5 is 3.5 and much more slower than not nice vendor stone(and double price).
then hardeness might important to consider when it from same nice seller.

and really agree with ability of use(cutting speed+finess) that why I use them for tool now.hardness at normal level suita that many tool world think it good is not actually my type,too.I love the harder one that I feel my edge(tools) more stable when sharpen but have to be nice quality.but hardest one will take your time a lot and might be never get the perfect look especially on soft steel.
that why I sold all hardest stone before I start to love the razor

Anyway,thank you so much for your answer and it surely help.

 

[Plein]

I like to finish razors on an Okudo Suita I have, although its not a typical suita. I cant see any Su and to be honest it performs a lot more like a hard Tomae
View attachment 492425

Your stone look very nice(expensive too)This is my Okudo Shiro Suita.I use nakayama Kiita maruka nagura for now might be nice to find suita nagura as yours.
and I also have hard satin plate tomae that I feel opposite but same to you.What I feel that hard satin tomae feel like Suita

 

[jklip13]

View attachment 492505
Your stone look very nice(expensive too)This is my Okudo Shiro Suita.I use nakayama Kiita maruka nagura for now might be nice to find suita nagura as yours.
and I also have hard satin plate tomae that I feel opposite but same to you.What I feel that hard satin tomae feel like Suita

Very nice Okudo you have there. On my Okudo I prefer to use atoma1200 slurry, I actually dont like to use the Tomo Nagura. I think the slurry is too fine and sometimes a little scratchy. The atoma makes really fast slurry that cuts metal quickly then breaks down as well
Which tomae do you ave that fels like Suita? can we see pictures?

 

[Plein]

here you are!It ohira tomae satin.As fast as suita stone.It have more longer name but I can't remember.The big wave part will make you feel stumble a bit but no scratch.And it contrast the detail of steel as nice as suita,too.

 

[jklip13]

very cool

 

[Plein]

very cool

Thanks !!!
this is what I'm talking about contrast grain of steel so nice just for 2 minute!

 

[Gamma]

Very pretty stone, nice piece.