There are a lot of huge differences between all types of Jnats.
Some are subtle, some are not so subtle.
It takes a long time and a lot of hands on use of stones from many strata, mines, etc - to be able to see, hear, and feel the differences.
That's why people that are new to the game are best served with an entry level stone most of the time, and a softer one at that.
Most people wouldn't be able to accurately determine what is LV 5 or LV 5+ or LV 3 from LV 4. And its really unneccesary to do so IMO.
Hard is hard - and harder than hard is very hard. Keep is simple and life gets better.
The numbers are ball-park references, the methods used to determine those numbers aren't regulated by NIST.
Within the group of what any one person calls LV 5 - some will be harder than others and markedly so. Same for all levels.
Not to mention - some stones absorb water more easily and soften up quicker.
Add in how the stone is polished on top - there's another variable.
Plus - each person's technique adds a different dimension.
My favorite variable - lap a LV 4 stone and turn up a LV 5+ surface. Yes - it happens.
About hardness;
There's a saying - when translated it goes something like this;
"A good grinder can do it with a softer potato."
I sold a beautiful Karasu to a friend of mine - it's softer than hard but not very soft. Finishes on water-only wonderfully.
It gives up stellar edges too.
A lot of users would say 'I need a LV 5+ to finish."
This is not true - my friend is skilled and dialed into that stone - that matters more than hardness.
He also has a very hard Jnat - and he's dialed into that one too.
LV xyz are just qualities that speak to the job at hand and the users wants, needs, and capabilities.
Very soft is is a quality that, for razors, is very difficult if not impossible to overcome - slurry will come up fast and getting the final refinement we seek is not going to happen.
But stones that are softer than very hard or even just hard can still be very good stones to finish razors with. They can't polish to the same degree but ease of use and compromise is up to the user. Everything in life is a compromise at some level, and skill-sets are what they are.
Additionally - sometimes, the edge off a softer stone is more desireable, which is yet another story.
The super hard stones force the user has to have outstanding skills to get the max out of the stone.
But not all very hard stones are very good stones. Some are just too hard and they do not have a good abrasive content.
Hardness is but one quality - there are others. I have had very hard stones that were basically useless - their only purpose would be to support the honing and Nagura slurry.
They 'worked' - in one sense, because the edge sharpened. But they did not work in the true sense. They were more of a substrate than a hone.
I have one Nakayama, it's retardedly hard. It's also a super super fine stone. The slurry that it gives up is wicked good and it can polish an edge to a very refined state.
I love that stone - but to finish on it takes work, skill, and a great level of concentration. It's totally unforgiving of any errors, and finishing on straight water (consistently) is impossible for me to do at this point. Whether or not I'll ever posess that level of skill is unknown.
A very knowledgeable Jnat-centric person once told me - 'you'll probably never find a harder and finer stone. It's possible but unlikely, and if you did find such a stone the difference would be negligable."
I love that stone - challenges and all. For me it's a benchmark piece, I judge all others against it.
As for the Jnat to Jnat within the same strata thing.
One can not say Tomae is a good strata - it just doesn't work that way.
Simple fact is that the layers or strata were formed in a way that precludes anyone from saying one strata is best or worst.
Besides - there are 48 layers in Tomae alone.
I've had a lot of Jnats here - a lot. More than I can count really. In and of itself the number of stones anyone has handled doesn't mean much - quality time on the stone is what matters most. Quality time being somehting more than honing a razor or two.
I tend to obsess over each stone until I'm satisifed. I like to push them to their limits. Even then - there's no way to ever know what's under the layer I'm honing on.
Someone once told me it takes many years to truly know a stone. I believe him - he's got more time using jnats than most.
At any rate - I don't choose Jnats based purely on hardness. For me that would be foolish. Choosing a stone based on overall quality and my ability to match it with a Tomo makes more sense.
Some are subtle, some are not so subtle.
It takes a long time and a lot of hands on use of stones from many strata, mines, etc - to be able to see, hear, and feel the differences.
That's why people that are new to the game are best served with an entry level stone most of the time, and a softer one at that.
Most people wouldn't be able to accurately determine what is LV 5 or LV 5+ or LV 3 from LV 4. And its really unneccesary to do so IMO.
Hard is hard - and harder than hard is very hard. Keep is simple and life gets better.
The numbers are ball-park references, the methods used to determine those numbers aren't regulated by NIST.
Within the group of what any one person calls LV 5 - some will be harder than others and markedly so. Same for all levels.
Not to mention - some stones absorb water more easily and soften up quicker.
Add in how the stone is polished on top - there's another variable.
Plus - each person's technique adds a different dimension.
My favorite variable - lap a LV 4 stone and turn up a LV 5+ surface. Yes - it happens.
About hardness;
There's a saying - when translated it goes something like this;
"A good grinder can do it with a softer potato."
I sold a beautiful Karasu to a friend of mine - it's softer than hard but not very soft. Finishes on water-only wonderfully.
It gives up stellar edges too.
A lot of users would say 'I need a LV 5+ to finish."
This is not true - my friend is skilled and dialed into that stone - that matters more than hardness.
He also has a very hard Jnat - and he's dialed into that one too.
LV xyz are just qualities that speak to the job at hand and the users wants, needs, and capabilities.
Very soft is is a quality that, for razors, is very difficult if not impossible to overcome - slurry will come up fast and getting the final refinement we seek is not going to happen.
But stones that are softer than very hard or even just hard can still be very good stones to finish razors with. They can't polish to the same degree but ease of use and compromise is up to the user. Everything in life is a compromise at some level, and skill-sets are what they are.
Additionally - sometimes, the edge off a softer stone is more desireable, which is yet another story.
The super hard stones force the user has to have outstanding skills to get the max out of the stone.
But not all very hard stones are very good stones. Some are just too hard and they do not have a good abrasive content.
Hardness is but one quality - there are others. I have had very hard stones that were basically useless - their only purpose would be to support the honing and Nagura slurry.
They 'worked' - in one sense, because the edge sharpened. But they did not work in the true sense. They were more of a substrate than a hone.
I have one Nakayama, it's retardedly hard. It's also a super super fine stone. The slurry that it gives up is wicked good and it can polish an edge to a very refined state.
I love that stone - but to finish on it takes work, skill, and a great level of concentration. It's totally unforgiving of any errors, and finishing on straight water (consistently) is impossible for me to do at this point. Whether or not I'll ever posess that level of skill is unknown.
A very knowledgeable Jnat-centric person once told me - 'you'll probably never find a harder and finer stone. It's possible but unlikely, and if you did find such a stone the difference would be negligable."
I love that stone - challenges and all. For me it's a benchmark piece, I judge all others against it.
As for the Jnat to Jnat within the same strata thing.
One can not say Tomae is a good strata - it just doesn't work that way.
Simple fact is that the layers or strata were formed in a way that precludes anyone from saying one strata is best or worst.
Besides - there are 48 layers in Tomae alone.
I've had a lot of Jnats here - a lot. More than I can count really. In and of itself the number of stones anyone has handled doesn't mean much - quality time on the stone is what matters most. Quality time being somehting more than honing a razor or two.
I tend to obsess over each stone until I'm satisifed. I like to push them to their limits. Even then - there's no way to ever know what's under the layer I'm honing on.
Someone once told me it takes many years to truly know a stone. I believe him - he's got more time using jnats than most.
At any rate - I don't choose Jnats based purely on hardness. For me that would be foolish. Choosing a stone based on overall quality and my ability to match it with a Tomo makes more sense.
