Edging Off The Grid

Well, took another step towards reducing the appalling amount of my paycheque that goes to the power bill.

The local hardware was blowing out solar recharging fluorescent light kits, complete with solar panel, battery, light and plenty of wire length.

I mounted one each over the kitchen sink, inside the front door, over the bathroom sink, over the laundry, inside the garage doors, over the headboard of the bed (bought an additional cover for that one), over my office desk, my workbench and over the couch in the TV room (with another extra cover). Just finishing up now, in fact (23:30 MDT).

That *ought* to cover the majority of the house lighting. Is it perfect? No. It will provide "enough" light for common tasks, with the regular lighting for backup.

All in all, a good day's work.

- John

At this point anything you can do to reduce the ever increasing power bill is a good thing. Good job. I'm just waiting for the commercial price of solar to get to the point where it is cheaper then coal. I know one company is producing a panel that is, but it's not in the commerical market yet.

robertw said:

At this point anything you can do to reduce the ever increasing power bill is a good thing. Good job. I'm just waiting for the commercial price of solar to get to the point where it is cheaper then coal. I know one company is producing a panel that is, but it's not in the commerical market yet.

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It's coming. I have a friend in the business and he says he can get 60 Celsius water on a -30 C day, and about half or more of power requirements. If I was an owner instead of a renter, I would have the roof done, half power, half heat.

The trial run this morning went very well.

I had pre-charged a couple of the battery units so that I could use them this morning.

When the cat got me up for his breakfast, I used the bathroom and kitchen units. As I thought, the units don't throw ward-off-a-vampire light but they are adequate in the twilight, so in the dark they will be more than enough.

Va bene' as my ancestors would say.

Right now it takes a savage commitment to go with solar for the purpose of saving money. It's a huge financial outlay that will start paying for itself years later. Kind of like buying into a failing stock in the hopes that it will recover.

I know this suggestion is almost useless at night, but you should look into tubular skylights as well. We have one in each of our bathrooms because we can't put windows in them. They provide a good amount of light and they're completely passive. Unless it's a full moon you're not going to get much light through them at night though...

robertw said:

At this point anything you can do to reduce the ever increasing power bill is a good thing. Good job. I'm just waiting for the commercial price of solar to get to the point where it is cheaper then coal. I know one company is producing a panel that is, but it's not in the commerical market yet.

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Check with your local electric company ... mine has discount and rebate programs with manufacturers and installers that will reduce your start-up costs by a significant amount. However, it takes a lot of research and legwork to get hooked up with the best deals, since the front-line CSR's don't know much about it.

Although it seems counter-intuitive, electricity suppliers want us to go solar.

I'm all for that, and as MoreSaltThanPepper noted, if I was an owner instead of a renter, I would upgrade to solar as soon as possible.

rabidpotatochip said:

I know this suggestion is almost useless at night, but you should look into tubular skylights as well. We have one in each of our bathrooms because we can't put windows in them. They provide a good amount of light and they're completely passive. Unless it's a full moon you're not going to get much light through them at night though...

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That's right on the money, Chip. They are cheap (although doing a retro-fit on a house with the classic through-the-roof style is pricey). They are available in horizontal and angled models, some using fibres to transmit the light. They throw an insane amount of light, even if you're in a neighbourhood with bright street lights at night.

I would recommend them to anyone building a house.

- John

dpm802 said:

Check with your local electric company ... mine has discount and rebate programs with manufacturers and installers that will reduce your start-up costs by a significant amount. However, it takes a lot of research and legwork to get hooked up with the best deals, since the front-line CSR's don't know much about it.

Although it seems counter-intuitive, electricity suppliers want us to go solar.

I'm all for that, and as MoreSaltThanPepper noted, if I was an owner instead of a renter, I would upgrade to solar as soon as possible.

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Even with the rebates and incentives, the out of pocket is still generally too expensive. Add to that the 25-year life span of most panels, and you have hard time justifying the cost.
I love the idea of utilizing solar, and geothermal. But, they're like CFL bulbs. Some people like them, others (me) think they have potential only if major advancements in technology make them useful.

robertw said:

Even with the rebates and incentives, the out of pocket is still generally too expensive. Add to that the 25-year life span of most panels, and you have hard time justifying the cost.
I love the idea of utilizing solar, and geothermal. But, they're like CFL bulbs. Some people like them, others (me) think they have potential only if major advancements in technology make them useful.

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Some truth to that, too. As noted, the electric companies want you to have other means, so they can continue to charge you "administration and hookup fees" while selling your electricity to someone else.

The fact remains that I now have long lasting light in a blackout and will easily make up the cost of these units in a year's worth of electrical savings.

Some clever person (not me, I'm a dummy) might also look at the fact that most home electronics (TV, radio, computer, stereo) actually are powered by 12 VDC and could easily be sourced by a similar system to these little units . . .

It's always cheaper to reduce your consumption than to buy solar gear (but it's less fun). About 6 months ago I dropped my daily power consumption an average of about 4kwh a day. The easiest thing to do: turn down the fridge and freezer! Set the fridge at 4-5 and the freezer will keep things solidly frozen set to "4". I also put everything that had an instant on feature (remote capable) on power bars as they tend to use about 60% of their "on" power while turned off. Compact fluorescent lighting didn't reduce my powerbill much but it helped. For those of you who live in Canada- put your air exchanger on a timer! I have a cheapy air exchanger that basically runs non stop and blows in a lot of cold air, and blows out a lot of expensive warm air. I set my timer to run about 12 hours instead of 24 hours a day and dropped my home heating fuel consumption considerably (good idea for those of you electrically heating your home!). Just a few ideas that worked alright for me. Maybe they'd work for you too.

MoreSaltThanPepper said:

The fact remains that I now have long lasting light in a blackout and will easily make up the cost of these units in a year's worth of electrical savings.

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At the end of the day, you can't beat that. Also lets not forget the fact that people spend a lot of money on things that don't give you a real return on investment. (ie: exercise equipment, home theater rooms, pets, boats, motor homes....)

cesium said:

It's always cheaper to reduce your consumption than to buy solar gear (but it's less fun). About 6 months ago I dropped my daily power consumption an average of about 4kwh a day. The easiest thing to do: turn down the fridge and freezer! Set the fridge at 4-5 and the freezer will keep things solidly frozen set to "4". I also put everything that had an instant on feature (remote capable) on power bars as they tend to use about 60% of their "on" power while turned off. Compact fluorescent lighting didn't reduce my powerbill much but it helped. For those of you who live in Canada- put your air exchanger on a timer! I have a cheapy air exchanger that basically runs non stop and blows in a lot of cold air, and blows out a lot of expensive warm air. I set my timer to run about 12 hours instead of 24 hours a day and dropped my home heating fuel consumption considerably (good idea for those of you electrically heating your home!). Just a few ideas that worked alright for me. Maybe they'd work for you too.

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Now we're talking

robertw said:

Even with the rebates and incentives, the out of pocket is still generally too expensive. Add to that the 25-year life span of most panels, and you have hard time justifying the cost.
I love the idea of utilizing solar, and geothermal. But, they're like CFL bulbs. Some people like them, others (me) think they have potential only if major advancements in technology make them useful.

Click to expand...

Compact flourescent's actually do pay off. If you can keep from mashing the bulb and breaking it over the many years it lasts, you have done the following:
1. spent less on the electricity to run the bulb, and saved some money
2. dealt with less mercury than you would with coal fired electricity even though the ballast has mercury in it.

Solar IMO has it's own limitations, as does wind, so I'm partially with you on that one. These limitations are not a reason to avoid investing in the technology however, and I think both should be invested in both in private and public sectors. Neither technology is able to produce electricity at all times, and neither is entirely feasible in all climates. That said, they are fantastic additions to any energy grid, and in fact they are probably enough that some houses can pull a lot less (sometimes even 100 percent less) electricity from the grid than they used to. They won't fix the problem in office buildings and major cities. For those areas, and to suppliment the energy produced for residential purposes, other technologies are needed. Honestly the only technologies that fit that bill without creating any greenhouse gasses are (IMO) hydropower and nuclear fission. Of course whenever anyone says the word nuclear, people freak out, and hydropower can actually cause environmental damage of it's own so it must be used carefully.

have you ever checked out one of these?

www.cansolair.com

I bought one of these two years ago and I love it! So does the wife, so that says a lot too. I've seen this thing produce 44 degrees C in february on a sunny day- basically heats my entire upper level by itself whenever it's bright out. With the change in my air exchanger useage (above post), this thing, and new thermostats I've cut my oil useage down from 2800 litres to 1900 litres (last yr)- and this year I'm on track for about 1700.

robertw said:

. . . things that don't give you a real return on investment. (ie: exercise equipment, pets...)

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+1

*pats his ever-expanding bulk and glares at the feline reclining in the mathematical centre of the sofa*

cesium said:

have you ever checked out one of these?

www.cansolair.com

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Sweet

BUT

"Cansolair Inc.
4 Hill Road
Dildo, NL A0B 1P0
Canada "

robertw said:

Even with the rebates and incentives, the out of pocket is still generally too expensive. Add to that the 25-year life span of most panels, and you have hard time justifying the cost.
I love the idea of utilizing solar, and geothermal. But, they're like CFL bulbs. Some people like them, others (me) think they have potential only if major advancements in technology make them useful.

Click to expand...

Maybe a push is necessary, I don't know. Europe is phasing out filament bulbs.

Press Release:

At today's meeting of the Ecodesign Regulatory Committee, EU Member States experts endorsed the European Commission's proposals for a regulation progressively phasing out incandescent bulbs starting in 2009 and finishing at the end of 2012. By enforcing the regulation of switching to energy saving bulbs, EU citizens will save close to 40 TWh (roughly the electrictity consumption of Romania, or of 11 million European households, or the equivalent of the yearly output of 10 power stations of 500 megawatts) and will lead to a reduction of about 15 million tons of CO2 emission per year.

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Basically, if you like the filament bulbs, you'd better stock up before September because, as I understand it, you won't be seeing them on the shelf anymore (over here that is).

You guys are way ahead of me. I can't seem to get my girlfriend to shut off lights when leaving the room. I am seriously thinking of installing motion detectors that will shut off the lights after a period of no activity.

cesium said it: to reduce you dependency on resourses seems like the best bang for the buck.

The biggest problem I have with CFL bulbs is the color of the light. No matter how much 'correction' is applied to the bulbs they still throw off a horrible grey color. I know some people will say they don't notice it. If you are one of those people, I am happy for you; really. I just can't get past how bad it makes everything look. Probably about twice a year, I will look for different CFL bulbs to test. I have never found one that comes close to an incandescent bulb in terms of light quality. I know they are going to get better; it's just a matter of when.