One step forward and 50 steps back......

**cammyfive** · 02-19-2009, 04:00 PM

I've been at the DE shave for about a month or so now, and it seems I can NOT get a nick free/irritation free shave no matter what. Over that course of time I've learned how to make a great super lather, find my signature scent, prep the beard and so on.....but I cannot get a great shave to save my life. I'm using a 38C with Derby Extra blades (changing after every second shave to ensure max sharpness) and even going the extra mile by hot water rinsing and reapplying Castle Forbes PreShave ($$$$) between passes. I'm am SOOOOO close to going back to the Mach3/Fusion as much as I hate to say it. I would think now that I know how to prep properly and build a great lather, the negatives of the multiblades would be mostly negated. It wouldn't be so bad if the shave I'm getting out of the DE wasn't particularly close (they are fairly close on average), but I am nicked to high heaven and afterwards my face is on fire. As I'm a grad student and occasionally teach, I am sure I look a mess some days in front of the class. Sorry, just had to vent...........

Are there any multiblade users on this site who went back to the multiblade after using a DE? Is it possible that a DE just isn't for everyone???

**Leche** · 02-19-2009, 04:08 PM

Originally Posted by cammyfive

Is it possible that a DE just isn't for everyone???

Well anythings possible. Nicks and irritation is usually technique and since it sounds like you have your prep down that is what I would guess. Are you using no pressure and allowing the tool to do the work? Are these nicks happening WTG, XTG, or ATG? Do you have certain problem areas or do these occur randomly? Do you have your beard growth mapped out? With those answers I'm sure somebody here can give you great pointers.

**PRose** · 02-19-2009, 04:09 PM

I wasn't completely happy with my shaves for the first couple weeks. I felt I had patches that I missed. For me, it wasn't until I reached my second month that I realized my blade angle could be better. I found I needed to raise the handle up slightly higher. I found that when I got my angle better I didn't need to do as many passes. I get great shaves with 1 WTG and 2 XTG passes. I wouldn't give up yet.

Oh...face lathering helped me too.

**alabamalawyer** · 02-19-2009, 04:15 PM

It sounds like the prep work is good. The problem probably lies in technique. The 38C is a heavy razor and so errors in technique and with pressure will leave you with nicks and/or irritation. I would go back to really focusing on avoiding pressure. It sounds redundant but I discovered after several months of DE shaving that what I thought was "no pressure" was actually just "less pressure" than I had been using with my cartridge. Since I have a handle on "no pressure" now, the shaves are great.

All this having been said, if you want to use a cartridge razor then do so. I think the bottom line is to use what you want so that you enjoy your shave. If that is a cartridge razor paired with a brush and cream then you should certainly use that combo.

**Wilpar76** · 02-19-2009, 04:36 PM

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!! Stay away from the light.

I know the nicks and irritation can be a problem, but it will come with time. I am seven months into my DE shaving experience and just when I think I have the hang of it some other issue arises. I have been reading as many posts as possible, and the common theme is that practice and patience make perfect. A month is not a long time.

Also, you may want to try a different DE razor. I realize that is not an optimal move as it would require additional expenditures for something that you are on the fence about, but it is an option.

I agree with some of the seasoned vets, check you technique. I still watch the Mantic videos this late in the game.

Good luck

**Ru4scuba?** · 02-19-2009, 05:00 PM

Cammyfive,

I've been at this a month (I used a Mach III for two years prior...and got GREAT shaves...not BBS, but DFS regularly). Having said that, I'll never go back. Something about the single blade makes my face feel better period.

If you're frustrated...you're at about the right point. I shave then look at my face all day and critique. Some days, I go crazy about how crappy of a shave I've had. Others I'm pleased. Not perfect yet...but getting there.

Patience...shaving is this variety is an art.

I am active duty military in a particular job that has me wearing suits 5 days a week. I'm extremely busy and have little time...yet I prefer this longer, more time consuming method over Mach shaving.

Must be a nutter!

**Osiran** · 02-19-2009, 05:02 PM

Hi Cammyfive. I see you're in Florence - I grew up about 45 minutes south of there. Good people and good food, but I was glad to move on to a less rural area.

I've been using a DE for about 4 months now with little success until very recently. Since focusing on my technique lately I have had two or three shaves the past couple of weeks that were close and non-irritated.

Things that have helped me are face lathering, using a more aggressive razor for fewer passes, and focusing on using as little pressure as possible. Good luck, man.

**P4P GQ** · 02-19-2009, 06:19 PM

I agree with everyone's advice on pressure and angle. I've been DE shaving for 2 months now and I get BBS 90% of the time. What really did it for me was paying close attention to what your doing and finding the right blade. I can't get good shaves from a derby for the life of me. I'm not taking anything away from their quality, but they don't work well for my face. Work on pressure/technique, and try other blades, it might just be the answer your looking for.

**petr** · 02-19-2009, 06:21 PM

takes time bro.

try new blades. try a new razor.

**Mainecanefan** · 02-19-2009, 06:46 PM

The funny thing about shaving with a DE is that it takes time to get the learning curve. I've been doing this a year. My first week was miserable. I looked like I had been in a knife fight. The next couple of weeks were better, but I had a lot of neck irritation and then something clicked and the shaves got progressively better. Pressure could be the issue. The Derbys could be the issue. A lot of guys really like them, but then there are guys like me that can't get a good shave with them to save their ass. You could also be putting too much pressure on yourself to achieve bbs. For me, if bbs happens, fabulous. If I get a damn fine shave with no irritation, I'm just as happy. Don't worry about being smooth as a baby's butt, worry about technique that gets you relatively smooth without irritation.

**DarkAudit** · 02-19-2009, 06:50 PM

Blades can make a world of difference in your shave. In a week, I've sampled a few different blades, and with the same razor on the same setting, I've had vastly different results, ranging from total crap to BBS in record time. I've had crap shaves with what many think is the go-to blade, and fantastic shaves with blades others wouldn't touch on a bet.

**Slack** · 02-19-2009, 06:55 PM

Getting frustrated is natural. I can attest that it happens after 9 months and I am others will say it happens to even the most experienced shavers.

Some things you may want to try post shave.

1) an alum block and a cold water rinse. I used it alot when I first started. Yeah it stings but it surely closed all the nicks/weepers.
2) witchhazel and a cold water rinse. I use this now and it works great.
3) my nik is sealed. I used this on spots that will not stop bleeding.

Some things you may want to try pre-shave

1) hot shower. It will open all your pores and hydrate your beard
2) kyles prep method. Basically the same effect as a hot shower but also uses your shaving cream/soap. It's located somewhere on this board.
3) preshave oil. Only recently did I start using a extra virgin olive oil for a preshave oil. The shaves have been alot better.

Some things you may want to try while shaving

1) Watch the head of the razor as it is cutting
2) Hot water rinse and relather after each pass
3) Go slow

Lastly if all else fails, shave at night until your technique gets better

**ambrose** · 02-19-2009, 07:10 PM

Get some feathers

**Ramaniac** · 02-19-2009, 07:31 PM

I used to press down so hard with my M3 that I naturally brought that technique forward with the DE. My guess is that you are doing the same thing friend. Some recommend you hold the razor by the very end and go this route as it will eliminate the pressure. I personally can't do that I have to find the balance in my hand.

Have you tried shaving the night before? I do now. Let me tell you, when the work day is ahead, and all the to-do stuff your brain is sorting out in your shaving time sort of makes you blank out. The night shave gives you time just to shave, and think about it. I get up at 5:00 and shave about 9-10 pm. My shave lasts all day, and I actually sleep better with a nice clean shave too.

When I saw this on this site, I thought it was crazy, then I tried it. Love it, better shaves. Better sleep. Try it. One last thing. Use that Derby at least 3 times. I get 6 out of mine. The first shave is the 'corking' shave for some reason, and is never as good as...even..well...the 4th shave! Some guys actually wine cork the Derby.

**1WildShave** · 02-19-2009, 08:32 PM

First, let me say don't give up. I've only been at this a little over a month and the hardest part to (un)learn is technique.

Try a different blade. I found that the Red Personna blades work best for me and when I use them I get great shaves without irritation. It amazed me what a change in blade made.

So get yourself a sampler kit from West Coast Shaving. You will be glad you did.

And second, try a different razor if you can. I started with a Merkur HD and it is great. Even though I regularly use a Fatboy adjustable, the Merkur is still used quite a bit.

And last, use a good shaving cream. I have to say that the Nancy Boy (gotta love the name

) shaving cream is almost foolproof and will let you get away with a mistake here and there. You can use it straight from the jar to your face, or brush it on.

These are the tricks that work for me and I hope they work for you.

**CrimsonHorn** · 02-19-2009, 11:18 PM

I'll add one thing that hasn't been said already. Before you take your first stroke, try putting the razor at a 90 degree angle to the floor, so that the top of the razor head (the smooth metal part) touches your face and no part of the blade touches. Then, slowly angle the blade closer to your face until it touches your cheek. Likely it won't cut anything, so keep angling the blade until you hear it cut some hairs. All of this with no pressure, of course. My very first DE shave I did this for at least 5 minutes solid on all parts of my face so that I would engrave muscle memory to my blade in accordance with my face. As of today, I've yet to have any razor burn or irritation, and I can count the weepers I've gotten on one hand.

At times you'll feel the razor pull hairs. If that ever happens, stop, go back to 90 degrees, and test out the angle again until you get a smooth sweep. When your razor starts pulling it's usually because of too shallow of an angle (the blade touching almost straight on) or an old blade that needs replacement, but you said you change every 2nd shave so that will never be an issue. I usually keep a Personna, Feather, or Derby in for at least 4-5 shaves and I have no problem.

Good luck with your shaving ventures. It's all a matter of doing very tedious and boring things to get great results, as are a lot of things in life. I play guitar and for the first 6 months, all I did were really boring scale exercises. I could hardly play anything that I wanted to play. Since I took so much time doing something so lame, I am finally able to play just about anything I want. I would have never been able to do that if I didn't focus on the basics from day 1. Just keep that in mind.

**cammyfive** · 02-19-2009, 11:33 PM

I appreciate all of the encouraging words. Tonight I did the unthinkable..... I bought a power Fusion. Now I know I'll probably be banned and hanged, but after some thought, while I LOVE the idea of classic DE shaving, my lifestyle (grad student and working part time when I'm not teach class) doesn't allow me to look a 'mess' while I learn the habit. I've tried doing a 30 minute shave and following a lot of the advice given with the utmost care, but to no avail. I just posted my 38C in the shaving mall and the Derby blades. This isn't to say I'm leaving this place...I'm totally addicted to soaps/creams/balms/brushes/etc. I just need (for now....I'm SURE I'll rebuy another DE at some future date) a 'safer' way to shave now.

**DarkAudit** · 02-20-2009, 06:55 AM

I hope I'm not too late here, but as someone with just a month in myself, you owe it to yourself to try to get your hands on a different razor. Try as I might, I can't seem to avoid irritation and weepers with my 40s-era Super Speeds. But if I take that very same blade and put it in my Red Tip or Fatboy, I don't get any of that.

**cammyfive** · 02-20-2009, 10:10 AM

Well, when I begin the DE shave process again (sooner rather than later I'm sure), I'll look to a different razor and blade combo. Right now, at this point in my life with my schedule and all, I just cant afford to undergo such a steep learning curve. I will obviously continue the proper prep, lather, post shave routines I've learned here.

**gbaker59** · 02-20-2009, 12:58 PM

For what its worth I’m exactly where you are – wondering when or if this great shave will materialize. I haven’t really nicked myself but have accumulated a fair share of bloody scrapes.

Knowing my blade angle holding ability is poor and my speed is probably to fast for my technique keeps me going. I do wonder if the merkur blades need to be ditched but I’ll keep them and order a sampler pack as they get low.

Currently I use the cartridge razor as a follow up / clean up to obtain a decent shave.