SOTD- sheng of the day

**thanks** · 12-20-2012, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by Kazeryu

I'm not confident that I could identify tippy properly even if it growled and bit me - still a bit new to this game. There are some stems and lots of large central leaf-veins.

The logo wasn't a saturn. Maybe this is a fake? Or something else altogether? The main feature looked like this: (Can't take a picture at work - I'd get fired).

Attachment 294142

Underneath it in larger letters is YUNNAN with "TUOCHA" superimposed.

Below that in a small, all caps serif font is written:
PRODUCED BY TEA-RESERCH(sic)-INSTITUTE OF YUNNAN
ACADEMY OF AGRICULTURAL- SCIENCE

I believe TwoDog was referring to this brand; http://www.yunnansourcing.com/store/...egory=12130706 which is the first thing that pops into my head, but I don't ever recall seeing one of their teas with that "Ying" logo anywhere on it. Possibly something different here.

**fdrx** · 12-20-2012, 02:15 PM

2012 xiaguan cha huang:
i brewed it only three times. I know it will probably age well and give a nice tea in a few years, but right now it's really not good and i'm happy it was only a 8g sample.
It tasted like a strong South Bulang pu, like a bad version of a manxinlong i had, but i have no idea if it's a tea from this region or not. It had this typical super strong taste & aftertaste (metal/spices/pinetree/smoke...?) but without the nice fast huigans and the good aftertaste... but i barely drank it, so i'm not even sure.

**thanks** · 12-20-2012, 02:52 PM

2012 YS Nan Nuo Duo Yi Zhai. Smells distinctly Nan Nuo. That floral, vegetal sweetness I often associate with this area is here as expected. Potent and enduring in every way. I won't bore with absolute superlatives, but needless to say this is typical Nan Nuo tea with more. More everything, actually. It's almost chewy. Definitely the best tea I've had from Nan Nuo at this age.

This tea is pricey, but in my opinion the asking price is in line with what I've had experience with over the years. If you had told me six years ago I'd contemplate spending upwards of $60 on a <1 year old pu'er cake I'd laugh and call you insane. Nowadays with the market as it is... it's probably good value. I have thought about this tea a bit, and decided I will not purchase any. The only reasons being that Nan Nuo is one of the most well represented areas in my collection (I'm a sucker for decent Nan Nuo), and the fact that I'm interested in trying out a few other of Scott's pricier cakes. I'm most looking forward to the Mu Shu Cha, but unless it's decidedly twice as good as the Mangfei then I have a feeling I'm almost done with my young pu'er purchases for another few years.

**shah8** · 12-20-2012, 05:13 PM

Had Nadacha Manmai today, that was good.

Mail came in...

First up is the Fengqing Sunning Daohuaxiang '06. Plantation tea. Unequivocally good. With Hobbes on this one, and at $22 @YS, well... I like Fengqing teas, always had, even that Dinjin Nuer. This tea is very hard on the tummy, has that fertilized the heck out of it plantation feel on the tongue. The aroma is not strong. However, it has a very nice, savory, and masculine flavor to it. Lasts a good while, with a bit of dynamicism, is very smooth for a plantation tea, with okay body. There are aftertastes and eyeopening caffeine/qi. I would not buy this tea to age, but I think it's a great tea to have in the rotation for that morning stimulation. I like this tea better than the '03 S. Mengku Bainian, for example.

**shah8** · 12-21-2012, 08:36 AM

This morning I had the Everlasting Manzhuang '04 from Shikunmu. I did not like it very much because after the third or fourth brew, it becomes very drying in that gummy, puckery, way, without giving much more flavor as saliva washes. It also tends to have a deep and penetrating sourness and a tendency to be harsh in the throat. I did not find it musty, moldy, or particularly aged, but not especially young for 2004. It has the tendency to give off a good aroma, some sweet aftertastes, a gentle characteristically manzhuang flavor, cooling in the back of the mouth at the soft palate and on the top of the throat. The body in the very early brews was quite acceptable. Slight flavor does linger in the mouth a long time. Worst Manzhuang I've had, but I've not had anything but very expensive Manzhuangs--2 XZH and one that was sourced by Teauchin.

Public Notice: Houde has restocked on samples of their older teas. Especially if you're poor, you should try one or two of them. The '97 Lan Yin, for example, is above $1k for a good cake. If you luck out on the sample, you'll know a bit better on what a good aged tea should be like.

**P_K** · 12-21-2012, 08:38 AM

Originally Posted by thanks

2012 YS Nan Nuo Duo Yi Zhai. Smells distinctly Nan Nuo. That floral, vegetal sweetness I often associate with this area is here as expected. Potent and enduring in every way. I won't bore with absolute superlatives, but needless to say this is typical Nan Nuo tea with more. More everything, actually. It's almost chewy. Definitely the best tea I've had from Nan Nuo at this age.

This tea is pricey, but in my opinion the asking price is in line with what I've had experience with over the years. If you had told me six years ago I'd contemplate spending upwards of $60 on a <1 year old pu'er cake I'd laugh and call you insane. Nowadays with the market as it is... it's probably good value. I have thought about this tea a bit, and decided I will not purchase any. The only reasons being that Nan Nuo is one of the most well represented areas in my collection (I'm a sucker for decent Nan Nuo), and the fact that I'm interested in trying out a few other of Scott's pricier cakes. I'm most looking forward to the Mu Shu Cha, but unless it's decidedly twice as good as the Mangfei then I have a feeling I'm almost done with my young pu'er purchases for another few years.

I agree that the Nan Nuo is quite good. However, I struggled to get much out of the Mu Shu Cha as of yet. I'm hoping it will develop into something more interesting as time goes on.

**JakubT** · 12-21-2012, 11:26 AM

shah: Where was the Manzhuan from? Is it the one from Sunsing? The one I had was certainly free of any sourness...

**thanks** · 12-21-2012, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by P_K

I agree that the Nan Nuo is quite good. However, I struggled to get much out of the Mu Shu Cha as of yet. I'm hoping it will develop into something more interesting as time goes on.

Had a somewhat rushed session with the Mu Shu Cha last night and came away from the tea table fairly disappointed. I get a little bit of the cooling sensation, which surprised me as I never experience it when others say they do. My mouth chemistry must be different. I'll try it again over the weekend as I just figured it was the rush I was in which contributed to the poor experience. "Dull, flat and low flavor" was the only thing that popped into my head a few infusions in.

So far, with Scott's 12 offerings I find the San He Zhai, Man Zhuan, and Mangfei the best. They're also the only ones I've purchased full cakes of so far, and that will probably remain the case. I have a sample of the Zhu Peng Zhai laying around, and a tiny amount of Shang Chun left (which is fine tea, but hard to see its value when compared with the San He Zhai) I should clarify that I've liked all of Scotts cakes, and if just starting to build a collection you could do much much worse than randomly pick one of his wild arbor pressings. Having said that, my shelves are already stacked as it is so it's harder for me to justify taking a punt with $25+ cakes less than one year old.

**shah8** · 12-21-2012, 02:13 PM

Okay, went with a second tea, the Nannuo White Tips from 2002 that you can buy from BTH for almost $200. Not sour, less astringent than the Manzhuang bought from Sunsing. Early brews have a good amount of qi. Not much to the taste or aroma--broad menghai (hekai to LBZ) flavor not dissimilar to the tiandiren '06 I've had. The taste is reasonably loud and there are some subtle notes in them. Soup has good body. Later brews have a slight and pleasant camphor taste. Not much in the way of huigans, mostly just lingering aftertastes. Reasonably durable and a pleasant session if not exciting. Much like the rest of BTH's selection, this is a rather poor bargain, all in all. They've increased the prices on most of their '90s teas, btw.

**JakubT** · 12-21-2012, 03:17 PM

shah: This is most peculiar. The Manzhuan I had has zero sourness and basically zero astringency. MarshalN did not mention these to me either and I do not think he'd recommend the tea if it had these features. What could go wrong?

**P_K** · 12-21-2012, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by thanks

Had a somewhat rushed session with the Mu Shu Cha last night and came away from the tea table fairly disappointed. I get a little bit of the cooling sensation, which surprised me as I never experience it when others say they do. My mouth chemistry must be different. I'll try it again over the weekend as I just figured it was the rush I was in which contributed to the poor experience. "Dull, flat and low flavor" was the only thing that popped into my head a few infusions in.

So far, with Scott's 12 offerings I find the San He Zhai, Man Zhuan, and Mangfei the best. They're also the only ones I've purchased full cakes of so far, and that will probably remain the case. I have a sample of the Zhu Peng Zhai laying around, and a tiny amount of Shang Chun left (which is fine tea, but hard to see its value when compared with the San He Zhai) I should clarify that I've liked all of Scotts cakes, and if just starting to build a collection you could do much much worse than randomly pick one of his wild arbor pressings. Having said that, my shelves are already stacked as it is so it's harder for me to justify taking a punt with $25+ cakes less than one year old.

I'll be interested too see if you get anything else out of the Mu Shu cake....if you check Hobbes' notes from last year on that cake he seemed a bit iffy on it. I'll have to get a sample of the Mangfei....I usually stay away from one leaf one bud teas, but there are always exceptions. I really like the way the Manzhuan opens in the first 3-4 brews....but then it gets into a funky fruitiness that I'm not sure I love. If you haven't tried the 11 Autumn Xi Bang I would recommend checking out a sample.

SOTD - 06 Jingmai Da Zhai Big Tree Mao Cha from CWS -
Definitely has some humid storage on it. Very sharp and angular in the first two brews, but then moves into mellower territory. Mostly wood and mushroom with some loam. Pretty good for mao cha. But it's sold out now anyway.

**shah8** · 12-21-2012, 05:44 PM

Sometimes that's just way the cake crumbles. I know very well you would not have liked the sample I had. Why it came out like that, but not like what you've made? Sometimes it's just where the sample came from the cake. Sometimes it's the water or the preparation method. My money is that this was a set of leaves that has been in a fairly airtight package for too long--some samples, if you put them in a baggie, and leave them in for a month or more, will get more sour and wierdly astringent. Airing it out may well help, and I do have one more serving of this tea. However, I don't anticipate really changing my opinion of this tea--the flavor profile is unimpressive, and more or less inferior to other Manzhuangs. The overall puerh performance compared to other teas in this age range, like ZhaiZiPo, Tai Lian Youle, or MingYuanHao Yiwu, is just not there. The Zhaizipo will beat even a good version of this tea soundly, despite the dead top flavor, because of it's good qi and excellent mouth/throat activity.

**thanks** · 12-21-2012, 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by P_K

I'll be interested too see if you get anything else out of the Mu Shu cake....if you check Hobbes' notes from last year on that cake he seemed a bit iffy on it. I'll have to get a sample of the Mangfei....I usually stay away from one leaf one bud teas, but there are always exceptions. I really like the way the Manzhuan opens in the first 3-4 brews....but then it gets into a funky fruitiness that I'm not sure I love. If you haven't tried the 11 Autumn Xi Bang I would recommend checking out a sample.

SOTD - 06 Jingmai Da Zhai Big Tree Mao Cha from CWS -
Definitely has some humid storage on it. Very sharp and angular in the first two brews, but then moves into mellower territory. Mostly wood and mushroom with some loam. Pretty good for mao cha. But it's sold out now anyway.

I have not tried the Autumn Xi Bang, I'll definitely check that out. Is that the one pressed in 2012 from 11 maocha? I'm very interested in that Spring Xi Kong he has listed, but $75 is probably too steep for my blood.

**shah8** · 12-21-2012, 05:49 PM

thanks, that and the jiabu are the only tea really worth putting on your shelves from the recent pressing. I strongly suggest that you try some of the 2010 spring YS offerings, the prices are much higher than they used to be, but they aren't too bad. Try the Gedeng, Yongde Da Xue Shan, BangDong among others...

**thanks** · 12-22-2012, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by shah8

thanks, that and the jiabu are the only tea really worth putting on your shelves from the recent pressing. I strongly suggest that you try some of the 2010 spring YS offerings, the prices are much higher than they used to be, but they aren't too bad. Try the Gedeng, Yongde Da Xue Shan, BangDong among others...

Can't seem to find the Da Xue Shan. Thanks for the recommendations though gentleman. It's hard to find a lot of views on YS pressings, so I appreciate any help I can get sifting through the countless options for samples.

**P_K** · 12-22-2012, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by thanks

I have not tried the Autumn Xi Bang, I'll definitely check that out. Is that the one pressed in 2012 from 11 maocha? I'm very interested in that Spring Xi Kong he has listed, but $75 is probably too steep for my blood.

That's the one...and I hear you on the Xi Kong. I bought the Fall 2011 version and it's a good cake. Though when you compare the price to a good Japanese sencha it's not hard to get there. But we were spoiled back in the day. The only other two YS teas I have tried and not talked about are the 12 Chen Xiang which was a smokey nightmare and the 12 Dragon of Jingmai shu xiaobing which I thought was pretty tasty.

Da Xue Shan is the Big Snowy Mountain 250g bing.

**shah8** · 12-22-2012, 11:33 AM

Sheng of the morning: 2002 Bamboo wrapped Yiwu from Fatman2 in Singapore. Best sample so far. Broadly speaking, it's like a coarser Wistaria '03 tuo, especially in that it recalls some Mengsong sensibility. Good aroma, not too strong. Strong bitterness early, but it becomes bitterfree after six or seven rounds. Broad flavor, vegetal and woody. Long lasting aftertastes, plus a few decently pungent huigans. Good body, activity in the mouth, and very good durability. The qi is never as strong as, say the '02 Nannuo Spring Tip's early brews, but it's there, it's decent, and it continues the length of the session rather than fading out. Does not really have much strong Yiwu sweetness like caramel or vanilla. Does have a couple of late sessions when the plums roll in. This...is what a good, nothing fancy, puerh with some age to it is like. There really isn't that much of it for sale, and when they do go on sale, they get sold out, pronto--like the bricks Houde sold from '03.

**shah8** · 12-22-2012, 03:46 PM

Sheng of the afternoon: 2007 Cloud's Formula. Not like the Taipei commemorative, nor like the SE Memorial, which were my two preconceptions. The Taipei is much stronger in taste and aroma, same with the SE Memorial. This tea is rather quiet and lower in the register, but it does have good flavors. What makes this a very worthwhile tea is that the body is thick and juicy/chewy. As far as the direct pleasure of drinking goes, it was really nice. That thickness also coats well enough to leave a nice finishing flavor in many brews. Not sure if there is qi, but I think so, a little.

Today was a better teaday than yesterday, that's for sure...

**shah8** · 12-23-2012, 05:15 PM

2002 Yiwu Old Tree from Best Tea House: Rather good aroma, decent body, especially early. The taste can often have some sensate sweetness, and there are some yuns. The broader taste does not generally recall Yiwu, except maybe a little, and there are some unpleasant edgy and astringent tastes to it, making it forbidding to go super deep on the session. Definitely will go more than 9 brews. No qi.

2008 Puersom Jingmai: Well cared for plantation, probably eco-tea. Relatively thin body, and volume is definitely at plantation levels. Rather smooth for both plantation and Jingmai. Decent, if light aroma, not too characteristic of Jingmai. The flavor is less heavy and nutty than I am typically used to, and there's not much fruit and little honey--it has a kind of delicate floral taste. No huigans, gives a slight buzz at the top of the throat, lingering sweetness and a short aftertaste. Very pleasant if more or less a drink it now tea. Not particularly durable.

**shah8** · 12-24-2012, 10:05 PM

I believed I had this tea today: http://www.bestteaonline.com/store/c...roducts_id=104

Short story, it's like a top grade version of the YS '10 Yongde Da Xue Shan. Not like the XZH DianGus, even though both are supposed to be Fengqing Da Xue Shan. Not really very much like a Fengqing tea in general except that it's spicy like one, with cinnamon notes. Loud tobacco florals like the afor-mentioned YS tea. Very complex taste with some fruit notes. Finish does not tend to be fruity, more spicy. Body is somewhat thin, but silky. Has to be pushed to be bitter. Warms, and goes down the throat. Will cool mouth cavity a bit. Qi is good, best thing about it is how comfortable it is in a flowing way. Aroma isn't too remarkable, I think. General flavor collapses after about six or seven brews and a different sort of session happens. I let it rest for a number of hours and restarted up late at night, when I enjoyed about five more good and very relaxing cups. Very good tea. Almost $500 good? I'm not sure I'd say so. Compare with 2007 XZH, that being the same year, and one quickly find Puzhen, DianGu to be clearly better. Huangshanlin and JingGu Nuer (at least the better sessions) competitive, and Xishangmeishao's best days are also competitive. I'm also more comfortable with the '09 Jingmai as something I enjoy more as well. These are generally roughly around the same price if you showed up at the teashop in Taiwan. Among cheaper teas, I'd say that the YQH Gushuchawang '06 is a better bet for aging. The fresh top grade Yiwus/Yibang for the same reason. I do think that this would beat the Bangwei33, but that tea isn't really asking to be $500 good anyways.

The leaves are pretty, and bear a stiking resemblance to a few of the darker leaves in the Tailian '02.

I also had the 2005 Yongpinhao Yiwu. Drinkable, but pretty awful for something with *some* positive taste and doesn't make you sick. Obviously not a Yiwu, probably Jiangchen (has that Jiangchen fruity aftertaste). Initial brews had good body and high caffeine. Went downhill from there, and I put the rest of the sample to be drunk when the Apocalypse happens.