Army Adopts Sig 320

From John Farnam's DTIQuips report of the SHOT show:

"This afternoon, we received the news that the US Army has officially
adopted the SIG320 Pistol to replace its ageing (and never popular) fleet of
Beretta 92s. Friends at SIG are delirious! They tell me that SIG’s clever
modularity was the major selling point. It’s a good choice, and will serve
the Army well!"

Have never owned a Sig. Now I wish I had some Sig stock! Wow, that's a major contract, one that will last for years.

Sure, just a few months after I hang up the uniform for the last time. I would have loved to try a Sig. Guess I will have to wait until I can purchase one of my own. Grin.

Sent via mobile - Chris

SIG stock...I too wish I had some. However it doesn't seem to be a publicly traded company. Only ones I found were Ruger and S&W.

Lightcs1776 said:

Sure, just a few months after I hang up the uniform for the last time. I would have loved to try a Sig. Guess I will have to wait until I can purchase one of my own. Grin.

Sent via mobile - Chris

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Thanks for your service!

nortac said:

Thanks for your service!

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The Army was really good to me. Great training (I work in IT), and generally great people to work with.

Sent via mobile - Chris

Sure looks like striker fired pistols are the wave of the future. Truth be told I carried a M9/92F for maybe 15 years. Never had a problem with it. In fact I rather liked it....

Acmemfg said:

Sure looks like striker fired pistols are the wave of the future. Truth be told I carried a M9/92F for maybe 15 years. Never had a problem with it. In fact I rather liked it....

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I agree, the M9 works just fine. I sure hope it isn't striker fired. I have a striker fired firearm, but really prefer the lighter trigger for getting follow up shots on target at the range.

Sent via mobile - Chris

I like the M9/92 for standing at a range and shooting. It is very accurate and feels good in my hand. My biggest complaint with it was always the safety. It is a large framed pistol, and my hands are fairly normal sized. Putting a safety that works in the reverse of my natural gripping motion all the way at the top of the pistol slide out of reach, is a hindrance. That design seems fairly popular with Beretta though.

I love my Sig (229). For me personally, the biggest thing I don't like about the 320 is that it is striker fired. I have been at the range with some other shooters and we were going through a big buy of some "NATO/surplus" ammunition. This stuff had some really hard primers, and some of the strikers were struggling with it. In fact, that is the only time I have ever seen my friends FN have any sort of malfunction. My hammered DA/SA pistols, you just pull the trigger again.

And to all of you guys above, a very heartfelt thank you. Your service is much appreciated.

There isn't really anything technically wrong with striker fired pistols. Glocks for example are seen in wide distribution among law enforcement and military users from many varied parts of the world. Sure, it isn't a 1911 or Sig P210 or ...

Bad ammo is just that, bad ammo. DA/SA pistols can and have choked on bad ammo before too. The key is making sure you have the correct parts in the pistol to deal with the ammo issues and dirt and other debris you expect to encounter.

The other thing to keep in mind is that the US D.O.D. does not use anything close to the same selection criteria most civilians do. Heck, even most law enforcement contracts are driven by things civilians never even consider.

As a topic for water color debates, the Sig P320 like the M9 before it will have many detractors and a few supporters. The reality is that it is really a secondary arm for most people in the US D.O.D. I hope people don't loose sight of some more basic primary needs at the expense of excessive focus on this pistol selection.

I see it:

http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2017/01...320-handgun-to-replace-m9-service-pistol.html

I assume they will be made here (Exeter)?


AA

Hasn't been announced yet based on what I have seen but, it will be produced stateside like the M-9 and other 'foreign' firearms used by the US D.O.D.

sidpost said:

There isn't really anything technically wrong with striker fired pistols. Glocks for example are seen in wide distribution among law enforcement and military users from many varied parts of the world. Sure, it isn't a 1911 or Sig P210 or ...

Bad ammo is just that, bad ammo. DA/SA pistols can and have choked on bad ammo before too. The key is making sure you have the correct parts in the pistol to deal with the ammo issues and dirt and other debris you expect to encounter.

The other thing to keep in mind is that the US D.O.D. does not use anything close to the same selection criteria most civilians do. Heck, even most law enforcement contracts are driven by things civilians never even consider.

As a topic for water color debates, the Sig P320 like the M9 before it will have many detractors and a few supporters. The reality is that it is really a secondary arm for most people in the US D.O.D. I hope people don't loose sight of some more basic primary needs at the expense of excessive focus on this pistol selection.

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I agree that there is nothing wrong with it being striker fired, and realize now the way I typed that. I meant for my personal preference, not as a overall generalization that strikers are bad. Sorry about that confusion.
The instance I was referring to, was with a foreign surplus ammunition that had hard primers. I was able to just pull the trigger again to get it to fire on the very few that didn't in my pistol. The strikers that were there seemed to hit lighter, and you need to move the slide to get them to re-set.

But as you said, bad ammo is bad ammo. Absolutely no argument there.
SIG is a great manufacturer IMO, and I am sure they are on top of it. Glock isn't on the top of my list just because of the way it fits my hand, but as you pointed out, it has proven itself as a very reliable striker fired pistol, as have a few others.

The military firearms instructors I have been around and the formal classes I have taken were all "Tap, Rack, Bang!" drills with any semi-auto pistol if I had a failure to fire.

This actually happened to me with one formal qualification course. That one was an exception where the dud round had to be adjudicated by range officers before I could continue since we had a fixed number of rounds to fire, on a fixed course of fire, under stressful time limits for a formal score for record. Normally, I would just tap, rack, bang or if I'm deep into a magazine I would do a tactical reload and 'bang' on. Thankfully I have never had to run a malfunction drill when it really mattered but, just like shooting off-hand unsupported weak-side it is a skill I practice.

A bit off topic but, have you ever tried to rack and shoot a Remington 870 with one hand on your non-dominant side? I have ...

While I have mixed feelings with small arms procurement in the US D.O.D. in general, the current crop of semi-auto pistols coming from 'major' players in the industry are a huge leap forward in general. I wish all soldiers well with whatever sidearm they are issued from the armory. Like the early M-9's ejecting slides, I'm sure there will be some teething problems with this pistol as well but, I doubt any will present a significant obstacle with the resources of Sigarms behind it with the 'support' of the US D.O.D. The political and legal aspects are whole different topic and again I wish soldiers well as they navigate these waters too.

As an instructor, I do teach the tap, rack, bang drill, and as a competitor, I have actually had to use it. Definitely a good drill to know. Just this one instance was line firing though, and we knew what the issue was.

I have done the entire reload a pistol one handed, both strong and weak sides, but never a shotgun. That sounds.... difficult.

When I was in The Army we adopted this one-eyed emaciated dog with a partially caved in skull. He was struck by a machete accidentally while the villagers were harvesting sugar cane. We named him Bocephus.

El perro peligroso was his other name.


I think I am having a flashback.

sfeile said:

As an instructor, I do teach the tap, rack, bang drill, and as a competitor, I have actually had to use it. Definitely a good drill to know. Just this one instance was line firing though, and we knew what the issue was.

I have done the entire reload a pistol one handed, both strong and weak sides, but never a shotgun. That sounds.... difficult.

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One-handed pump shotgun usage means you are in 'deep doo-doo' but, at least you are still in the fight. After the FBI encounter with Matix and Platt in Miami, 'wounded' officer survival drills become more prevalent in my world even though I have never been a LEO. Texas DPS moved away from the 45ACP to the 357SIG after some bad encounters with semi-rigs.



Events like this along with the 'war on terror' have caused many things to change. Case in point the US D.O.D. move back to 45ACP for some military units and the submission of 40S&W pistols to these pistol trials. In the European theatre, shooting to wound might make sense from a logistics point of view but, for someone crashing a security checkpoint with a suicide vest on requires a different set of engagement criteria. Now add the urban warfare component from Iraq and Afghanistan and observe the changes made to the pistols submitted for this evaluation.

Punch, counter punch. The fight evolves and tactics will too or, you will end up with a 12 gauge Trench Broom and a 1911 in a 'cyber-war'. Thankfully, it looks are our soldiers will have a sidearm they can depend on and not one designed by some committee skilled in government bureaucracy. Anyone remember the Mark-23 and Knight suppressor 'offensive handgun'? On paper to a congressional mall ninja or career paper pusher in the D.O.D. it might seem ideal but, only if you never had to carry and use one (I'll take a PDW/SMG any day over this monstrosity).

sidpost said:

There isn't really anything technically wrong with striker fired pistols. Glocks for example are seen in wide distribution among law enforcement and military users from many varied parts of the world. Sure, it isn't a 1911 or Sig P210 or ...

Bad ammo is just that, bad ammo. DA/SA pistols can and have choked on bad ammo before too. The key is making sure you have the correct parts in the pistol to deal with the ammo issues and dirt and other debris you expect to encounter.

The other thing to keep in mind is that the US D.O.D. does not use anything close to the same selection criteria most civilians do. Heck, even most law enforcement contracts are driven by things civilians never even consider.

As a topic for water color debates, the Sig P320 like the M9 before it will have many detractors and a few supporters. The reality is that it is really a secondary arm for most people in the US D.O.D. I hope people don't loose sight of some more basic primary needs at the expense of excessive focus on this pistol selection.

Click to expand...

Great post. Love the Sig 320. My preference will always be, consistent trigger pull from first to last, versus 15# pull first shot...

I remember the MK-23. I actually have it's little brother that was designed at the same time. I have a USP 40, and it is incredible! Pushing the 80,000 mark through mine.
The USP was the original design of the two, but the DOD contract came up at the same time so they altered things and made the MK-23 also. Awesome firearm, but just too darn big. And I'm with you, PDW/SMG first!

sfeile said:

I remember the MK-23. I actually have it's little brother that was designed at the same time. I have a USP 40, and it is incredible! Pushing the 80,000 mark through mine.
The USP was the original design of the two, but the DOD contract came up at the same time so they altered things and made the MK-23 also. Awesome firearm, but just too darn big. And I'm with you, PDW/SMG first!

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I wouldn't consider the HK USP to be similar to the MK-23 personally. Sure, there is some family lineage there but, it really is a different pistol. I tried to warm up to the HK USP but, it never really did anything for me good or bad. I ran the 9mm some suppressed and it was ok but, again nothing special to me. The new LEM trigger is nice though and I must admit to having a P30L and a pair of HK-45 Tacticals (the magazines took almost a year to get though ... ). Now all I need is a can like the SiCo Osprey or one of the newer variants from Dead Air or Rugged and I can kick the MK-23 to the curb.

While I would like a threaded barrel for my DAK P226, I may have to give one of these new P320's a good run if they release a Tactical model with tall sights and a threaded barrel. Good timing too as I was starting to consider a S&W M&P 2.0 to augment my G17 which at some point is going to wear out (>100K rounds several years ago).