Long Time, First Time

Hi everyone, I'm newly registered here, but have been searching posts on B&B for at least 3-4 months now. I started wet shaving in November (almost 6 months now) after my brother got me a Merkur 23C (or 180) long handle and some CO Bigelow shave cream. I was hooked instantly. Since then I've bought a shave brush, tried a few different shave creams, and all of the blades in my sampler pack that I got from Amazon.

Even though I've been wet shaving for a while, I still get irritation, and am convinced its technique. In 6 months, I can count the number of irritation free shaves on one hand. So I know its possible with my equipment, just not consistent. I've asked my wife for an EJ 89 for my birthday in 3 weeks, and I'm hoping it has better balance than the 23C. I feel like the 23C is not head heavy enough and I lose the blade angle easily. The EJ also comes with Derby blades which I've been wanting to try.

I recently started holding the razor high up on the handle (the balance point is about 3/4" below the head) which allowed me to apply very little pressure and have noticed a huge reduction in irritation, but there's still some irritation and I still lose the blade angle if I don't apply some pressure. If I hold the razor tight to maintain the blade angle, then I start applying too much pressure and get irritation. I really like the Astra SP blades and I thought I liked Crystals (IPs), but when I made the switch to very little pressure, they tugged a bunch. So now I'm only using Astra and Personna Labs, anything else and I get lots of tugging on the first pass (Shark SC, Red IPs, Crystal, Astra SS (horrible), Sharp, etc).

So here's my routine:
1. Shower and wash face first (soaking my brush in a mug)
2. Bowl lather Kiss My Face (mint flavor) with badger brush
3. Merkur 23C with Astra SP or Personna Labs
4. 3 passes, WTG, XTG ear to chin, XTG/ATG chin to ear (growth is all north to south)
5. Cold water rinse, towel dry, and Neutrogena Razor Defense shave lotion (Just started using witch hazel this week before the Neutrogena, lets see how that works).

I've read countless posts on good blade angle and no (very little) pressure, but I'm still not getting that complete irritation free shave that everyone talks about and I feel like if I don't apply pressure the blade won't go anywhere ( or just scrape the skin). Am I missing something or is it my razor?

I'm definitely getting the EJ because one of the things that drives me crazy about my Merkur is half the time the blade does not align properly, and one side feels like there's no blade in it. I found the consensus to be a Merkur issue or quality.

Thanks in advance
Joe

Welcome to the club, Joe. Glad to have you aboard. If your angle is correct, you really shouldn't need to apply any pressure. The razor should just glide across your face like glass as long as your lather is good. Blades can certainly make a difference, but generally any of them will work well on the first couple of shaves. Tugging might be indicative of a less than good lather on the first couple of shaves on a blade.

Welcome to B&B.

I have the 23C. It's mild razor. I like the longer handle and haven't found it difficult to maintain an angle, but then I've been shaving longer.

With a mild razor it's easy to use too much pressure in an effort to extract a super close shave from the razor as well as trying to maintain angle. What angle are you using? Shallow or steep?

I might suggest giving your face a break by not shaving for a couple of days (if that's possible) and when you resume, back down from the three pass shaves. Try WTG and touch up for a couple days and see if irritation goes away.

xxvaleria said:

Welcome to the club, Joe. Glad to have you aboard. If your angle is correct, you really shouldn't need to apply any pressure. The razor should just glide across your face like glass as long as your lather is good. Blades can certainly make a difference, but generally any of them will work well on the first couple of shaves. Tugging might be indicative of a less than good lather on the first couple of shaves on a blade.

Click to expand...

So tugging may be lather? I always associated it with needing a sharper blade, which is why I thought the Astras and Labs were working well. I think the consistency of the lather is good, but I'll admit, I don't spend a whole lot of time working it in. Maybe 10 seconds on each quadrant, then another 5 seconds painting it to get it even.

Dog Whiskerer said:

I have the 23C. It's mild razor. I like the longer handle and haven't found it difficult to maintain an angle, but then I've been shaving longer.

With a mild razor it's easy to use too much pressure in an effort to extract a super close shave from the razor as well as trying to maintain angle. What angle are you using? Shallow or steep?

I might suggest giving your face a break by not shaving for a couple of days (if that's possible) and when you resume, back down from the three pass shaves. Try WTG and touch up for a couple days and see if irritation goes away.

Click to expand...

If I'm trying to reduce irritation I use an angle more parallel to the floor (shallow??), but I find if I increase the angle, I actually get the lather off of my face in a single pass. I know its a mild razor and the EJ I'm getting soon is mild, but I honestly believe there's no reason I can't get a good shave from a mild razor as long as I'm using good technique. I like to play golf and I always see people blaming the clubs when its really their swing. Granted different razors (golf clubs) may take some getting used to, but they should be able to accomplish the goal.

Welcome to B&B, you're off to a good start.

When I get a new razor, I like to do a bunch of "dry runs", usually while watching TV. I'll leave the blade out, and practice my normal Shaving strokes. I can feel when the safety bar/teeth are "biting", so I back off on my angle. When I can feel only the top cap, I increase the angle. I just sit there and feel the "feel" of the razor. The bar/teeth and top cap should be kissing your cheeks at the same time and with the same amount of "kiss". After a couple of hours of practice, I've developed enough muscle memory to pull off an irritation free shave with that particular razor. I can go back to any of my razors, and that muscle memory is still there! It looked odd to my wife, the first time, but it works!

Hello and welcome, Joe. Great to have you here on B&B. Wander on over to the Hall of Fame and introduce yourself.

Glad you came out of the shadows!

Welcome to the forum, Joe !!

Welcome to B&B! Great advice given. Best of luck!

Glad you joined us!

fordfather said:

When I get a new razor, I like to do a bunch of "dry runs", usually while watching TV. I'll leave the blade out, and practice my normal Shaving strokes. I can feel when the safety bar/teeth are "biting", so I back off on my angle. When I can feel only the top cap, I increase the angle. I just sit there and feel the "feel" of the razor. The bar/teeth and top cap should be kissing your cheeks at the same time and with the same amount of "kiss". After a couple of hours of practice, I've developed enough muscle memory to pull off an irritation free shave with that particular razor. I can go back to any of my razors, and that muscle memory is still there! It looked odd to my wife, the first time, but it works!

Click to expand...

Sounds like a good idea, any sort of "practicing" that I do already gets disapproving looks from my wife.

I'll try working in the lather a little more or face lather tomorrow to see if that helps.

Thanks everyone for the welcoming comments and advice.

Hi Joe, welcome to B&B

I use a similar technique as [MENTION=79047]fordfather[/MENTION] described. When I get a new razor I've found that if I place the top of the razor against my face (handle parallel to the floor) then tilt the handle down just until I feel the blade I end up with the optimum angle. Maintaining that angle requires you to maintain a solid wrist and shave with the big muscles of your arm instead. Your technique will improve until you reach that moment when a light shines over your head and a choir sings "Ahhh". It will be an epiphany. Most important is enjoy!

I think you keep doing what you are doing and lighten up on the pressure.
Yes, you can get a good shave with a milder razor. I have used the Muhle R89 (very close to the EJ head), which is medium-mild, and get a good 3 pass shave. Every time I have gotten irritation, it is on my neck, and I pushed too hard.
I am willing to get BBS sometimes and DFS others, and not "try" to always get BBS by applying pressure.

You have a great routine and good hardware. Enjoy your shaves!

Welcome from Arizona !

It may not be your razor or blades. You may have sensitive skin. Get some samples of different soaps. I find I have reactions to about 1/4th of the soaps I have tried.

The EJ 89 is one the best razors out there so I think you will be happy with it. The Astras with the EJ is a great combo.

Good luck.

Hello Joe and welcome to B&B!

Herm2502 said:

I use a similar technique as [MENTION=79047]fordfather[/MENTION] described. When I get a new razor I've found that if I place the top of the razor against my face (handle parallel to the floor) then tilt the handle down just until I feel the blade I end up with the optimum angle. Maintaining that angle requires you to maintain a solid wrist and shave with the big muscles of your arm instead. Your technique will improve until you reach that moment when a light shines over your head and a choir sings "Ahhh". It will be an epiphany. Most important is enjoy!

Click to expand...

Thanks for this advice. I realized that when I started shaving with less pressure I focused on a loose grip, but that led to a soft wrist also. I realized this morning that I can have a solid wrist and still maintain a soft grip and had an excellent shave today.

Using the big muscles made a huge difference and I was able to maintain the blade angle. I did a 3 pass shave and did an extra 2 passes on my chin because the beard is much thicker with minimal irritation only on spots of my chin. Thanks for the advice.