Well the good ole boys in TN are raising tuition 9% this fall. So much for all that congressional oversight. The education lottery is working perfectly.
Higher and Higher Education
- Thread starter Bowcephalus
- Start date
Yeah, never mind that with every other loan getting more difficult to get, a do-nothing Congress managed to secure student loan guarantees.
Oops, I think you must have meant 6%??
http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080530/NEWS04/805300414/1018/NEWS01
Oops, I think you must have meant 6%??
http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080530/NEWS04/805300414/1018/NEWS01
- Thread starter
- #3
Wrong again Scott...."oops" indeed...(your more recent reference notwithstanding)
http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2008/may/29/regents-want-maximum-9-percent-tuition-hike-univer/
http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2008/may/29/regents-want-maximum-9-percent-tuition-hike-univer/
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- #4
...Naw man, the lottery solved the problem.
Your article is from yesterday, predecision, and mine is from today, after the Regents hashed it out.
Most universities are obviously in the business of stealing. I would like to see the books opened up on them. Tuition is increasing at an alarmingly fast rate, it makes the jump in gasoline prices look like a joke. Seriously, I put myself through college, two sons, and graduate work for my wife and me as well. Every year the price goes up 6 to 18%. I wonder where all the money is going? After visiting a few schools and seeing the new construction at most campuses, I think I have an idea. If we eliminated student loan programs I bet that tuition would decrease.
UNC-Chapel Hill has tuition rate increases and fees that are arbitrarily decided by a board. Even though students have rallied against these increases (which are incredibly high for out of state students), all the tuition cost increases have passed. What kills me is that the University's expanding and renovating all its buildings while eliminating language programs and underfunding departments, AND a week after I graduated and started the job searching process, I've gotten letters and emails attempting to guilt trip me into giving "gifts" to the University. I think if UNC were to undergo an audit by state legislature, there'd be a lot of money used for personal expense and a lot of questions as to how contracts were awarded to the most inefficient construction companies (It's taken them three years to replace a 20' section of a water main). It's not an education anymore, it's turned into an actual business.
Some of the heavy hitters are responding. Harvard is offering free tuition for students from families earning under $60K, for example, and other big universities are starting similar programs. Like I mentioned before, this seems to be because your do-nothing Congress is starting to take a look at why tuition is skyrocketing while university endowments are reaching obscene levels, and the universities would rather take the action themselves and have Congress just move on to other things.
Ending the student loan program would be a devastating thing. Tuition would likely not be impacted that much, and opportunity for many students would simply disappear.
I believe all Illinois Universities are going up 8%. good thing I graduated from college a long time ago. Shame I have an 11 year old and a 3 month old. Well not a shame, just hope they go to trade school and learn an actual skill.
Looks like the California State Universities are still a bargin (?). They are running about $60 per unit for fulltime students. This school is on a quarter system. That is about $3300 + 270 pakring per year. When I finished in 1968, the tuition was $105 per year. I worked 20 hours a week for the school at $2.50 per hour and rarely had a $20 bill in my pocket. For comparison, my graduate work, 1968 to 1975 was $50 / unit.
- Thread starter
- #11
Yep,You're right about the change in the story during the day today, that is what I was pointing out. I had actually heard the story this morning on local news as 9% and noticed the "more recentness" of your reference. But my intent was indeed to say "9%" based on what I had heard in the broadcast.
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- #12
Construction is a major factor. This is where many of my experiences and perceptions come from. A sort of "graft" to some extent.
As a side note, I am just curious, for the sake of hashing out opinion here, what would be the ramifications of giving everyone who graduates high school and equal shot at a place in the public universities? Totally eliminate tuition and entrance standards beyond simple graduation of high school. Treat the whole system like the public schools so many embrace,purely tax funded, adjusted for limited slots through a "luck of the draw" system. Hmmmmmmmm.
As a side note, I am just curious, for the sake of hashing out opinion here, what would be the ramifications of giving everyone who graduates high school and equal shot at a place in the public universities? Totally eliminate tuition and entrance standards beyond simple graduation of high school. Treat the whole system like the public schools so many embrace,purely tax funded, adjusted for limited slots through a "luck of the draw" system. Hmmmmmmmm.
I think the only reason most people need college is as a second chance to gain high school level skills. The freshman year is more and more just remedial courses.
A college degree is an advantage in the workplace only because most people don't have one. If we could wave a magic wand and give everyone the education, we would still need people to drive garbage trucks or flip hamburgers. Only difference, the people doing it would have degrees, and no doubt be resentful about it. I would rather see high school tightened up...if it takes some kids six or seven years to actually pass the work for graduation, let them take that long. And limit college to those who can actually benefit from it...the smartest kids.
A college degree is an advantage in the workplace only because most people don't have one. If we could wave a magic wand and give everyone the education, we would still need people to drive garbage trucks or flip hamburgers. Only difference, the people doing it would have degrees, and no doubt be resentful about it. I would rather see high school tightened up...if it takes some kids six or seven years to actually pass the work for graduation, let them take that long. And limit college to those who can actually benefit from it...the smartest kids.
I was once told that some countries loan students the funds to attend school. For a four year program, 25% of the loan is forgiven for each year completed. The basis was that for each additional year of schooling, the individual adds that much more to the society and also pays higher taxes.
I am not sure. I believe that many pay the prices because they do not see the cost. If moms and dads, or students had to cost flow tuition instead of delaying the pain for four years, how long before people demanded accountability from our universities? If you do not see the expense, you really do not care how much it is.
The best deal in America for a college education is the local community college. Chances are your instructor actually applies what he or she teaches in a real world scenario, and not hidden behind the ivy walls of academia. Learning chemistry from an industrial chemist is really a bargain at the local CC. I know there are four year institutions that do the same thing, University of Maryland, University College comes to mind. Students seem to be flocking to these tuition "bargains."
When I lived in Seattle they had a really cool program where high school students could forgo the last two years of high school and attend the local community college for their junior and senior years. My understanding was that all they had to pay for were books. When they completed their program they received an Associates degree and a high school diploma. In Washington, state schools must (at least back then) accept 100% of the credits awarded by the local community colleges. The thought of graduating from college at 19 or 20 with a four year degree sounds like a pretty huge benefit. It would not appeal to all, but a few could certainly get a leg up.
There are some major problems with the entire educational institution in this country. One of the chief ones is that, as with housing, there has grown this idea that everybody should be entitled to a college education, to the point it doesn't mean anything anymore. We even have to make up new majors now for those not really seeking a serious major (can anybody tell me what Women's Studies prepares you for, other than teaching Women's Studies?). Sadly, standards at the higher institutions have gone lax. Many people need their freshman year to catch up on all those things that you used to be expected to know coming out of high school. Student loans are a mixed blessing that are causing big problems (full disclosure, I am the happy owner of several thousands of dollars in student loans). It is just like the housing problems - being too loose with distributing loan money makes the universities think they can jack up prices, because nobody stops to think that it will actually cost them some day, when they can get a deferred loan right now and live it up. Cut student loans back to only funding those who have the grades to do well in college may be the ticket.
By sticking too many people in college who shouldn't be there, all you do is create a huge surplus of people with letters behind their names that they might not really deserve, feeling self-righteous and having an inflated image of their marketability. The same problem exists for science. Anytime funding goes up, schools rush to enlist as many new students as they can, flooding the field with too many scientists competing for funding that will not always be that high. The result being that soon you have a lot of unfunded PhD's walking around complaining the government doesn't give them enough to do research.
By sticking too many people in college who shouldn't be there, all you do is create a huge surplus of people with letters behind their names that they might not really deserve, feeling self-righteous and having an inflated image of their marketability. The same problem exists for science. Anytime funding goes up, schools rush to enlist as many new students as they can, flooding the field with too many scientists competing for funding that will not always be that high. The result being that soon you have a lot of unfunded PhD's walking around complaining the government doesn't give them enough to do research.
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- #17
Classic testament to human nature. Many other aspects of our society play on this. Insurance comes to mind. When was the last time a doctor discussed your bill? I can't help but reflect on my wife's 4.0 at 40 when she was paying the bill.
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- #18
That's the point I was making with the reference to the state "education lottery". I always find it interesting how so many decry the corrupting influence of money except when it comes to the cost of an education.
Ever since Texas deregulated the tuition rates, the only thing that has happened on a consistant basis is the rate increase. Now that each school is free to set their tuition, all of the state schools just keep getting more and more expensive. I graduated from college in 1994 and was able to work my way through college to pay for it. I don't think a student today would be able to to do that. Simply taking on more student loans is not the answer either.
I graduated from college about 2 yrs ago, it was more then $37,000 for tuition, room, and board in that last year. Tuition increased 3% each year I was in college. As soon as I graduated 1 of the 2 colleges I graduated from requested 'gifts' from me, I promptly called them and informed them not to send anymore 'gift' requests because at $37,000/yr I had given all I was going to give. College has become nothing more then big business, they want nothing more then to fill there pockets.
