Commercial Espresso at Home, Advice Needed

Hello all, hope everything is well. I have spent some time away from B&B but still shave with the tools that brought me here in the first place. In my time away, I have been exploring some of the other finer things in life, most recently coffee.

I am considering installing a commercial espresso until in my apartment, however I could use some advice. I currently use a gage classic which gets used but I want to step up to something a little better. My search for a good condition used commercial machine has gone on for some time now, and I have noticed one thing, in the world of commercial units, the use of 110v single groups units is uncommon and finding a used one has proven more difficult than a 220v 2 group unit.

Do any of you currently have a larger 220v 2 group machine in use? If so I have a few questions, First of all how long does yours take to heat up and is it more economical to just leave it on. Also have you noticed any ridiculous increase in your electric bill.

Lastly if anyone has electrical experience and could help me with the last piece of the puzzle, that would be great. I don't currently have a 220v line available and would have to set one up. I looked in my breaker box and it is full unless come of the breakers ca be converted to skinny breakers. I will upload a picture of the box for reference. Can you tell me if setting up a new breaker is possible with my current box and how much something like this would cost. The outlet would go directly below the breaker box about 5 feet so not very far. Otherwise is there some way around setting up a new 220v line.

Thank you for the help in advance.
-Anthony

My primary question would be, "why do you want a 2 group unit for your apartment?" Having said this, I live in an apartment and want a commercial 2 group. HA! The La Marzocco GS3 seems to be a pretty solid prosumer unit that does very well at home and for a smaller café and requires only 110 volt. Locally, a gentleman and his wife had a stand with a GS3 and the machine seemed to perform very well.

As far as wiring, I would highly recommend speaking to an electrician. I wouldn't just be concerned about the breakers, but the actual wiring as well.

I'm not necessarily looking for a 2 group but I do want a commercial unit. I can't afford a brand new commercial unit which relegates me to used machines and many of them happen to be 220v 2 group machines.

The gs3 is a wonderful machine. My friend recently opened a cafe and I've had the opportunity to play around on his machine which is a La Marzocco Strada 2 group and it is amazing. The gs3 is kind of a less commercial Strada so I'm sure it is amazing too but it is outside of my budget.

Personally a commercial 1 group that runs off of a 110v outlet would be ideal although I also like the idea of a nice 2 group taking center stage in my kitchen.

Living in an apartment will limit you as far as electrical work goes (unless you want to risk getting thrown out for endangering the other tenants).

If you have an electric stove you can come off of that outlet for your voltage without incurring the wrath of your landlord. You can run a "temporary" line up to a counter where you can put another box to make your connection.

Problem 2 that you have not mentioned.

ALL commercial 240vac units will be direct plumb (i.e. you need a water line AND an electric line).

Problem 3 that you have not mentioned.

Most all commercial units will have direct plumb drains (i.e. you need access to your wast pipes to take the line to)

This should be enough cost take you away from a "cheap" used commercial machine into an "expensive" NEW prosumer unit and keep a few hundred $$$ still in your pockets.

Used Expobar Lever machines are out there and not that expensive. They DO NOT need 240vac (110). They DO NOT need plumbing (internal tanks). They DO NOT need a waste drain. They WILL work as well as any commercial machine.

I only mention this brand as they are not expensive new and when they come up used they are very reasonable. They are made in Spain. They use a commercial E-61 head/brew group. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faema

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odk...xpobar+Lever.TRS0&_nkw=Expobar+Lever&_sacat=0

I am already planning a little cart for the machine to sit on which will have an empty jug for the drain line to run into and a 5 gallon jug and a flojet to pump the water. I work in catering and this is the setup which we use for events and it works very well.

I have also looked into e61 prosumer machines, however I would rather have the "plumbed in" setup which requires a rotary pump. Some of the e61 machines do have rotary pumps, however they are on the higher end of the price range and do not come up used as often as the tank units.

I already have a 220v line running to my AC unit and considered setting up the coffee station close to that to use the outlet but that would mean that I can only use one of them in the summer when the AC is needed by me. This limits me to either an existing 110v line or a new 220v line.

I will most likely end up with a 110v machine because I only really need 1 group and there are a few smaller commercial units that operate this way. Also the sheer size of a 2 group as well as my current electrical situation is inconvenient but I figured I would ask around over here to see if anyone had a different solution.

If you already have a 240vac outlet GO FOR IT.....

I know several people who pull water from a 5 gallon jug into their "plumbed" machines and putting another waste jug beside it is no big deal.

If your AC is a window unit with a plug YOU WIN....... Just change the plug out with a 240vac duplex and bada-boom bada-bing... you are all set and running

Is it possible for both of them to run at the same time. My ac is a large sleeve unit around 20,000 btu and I believe that the 220 is a 20 amp breaker but you can confirm from the picture above. It is on the top right.

The only way for it to be plausible is if both of them can run at the same time.

Why commercial? And what are you doing for a grinder? Don't obsess over the machine and leave the grinder as an afterthought. A commercial machine with a poor grinder will produce poor results. The grinder is much more important.

ACorazza said:

Is it possible for both of them to run at the same time. My ac is a large sleeve unit around 20,000 btu and I believe that the 220 is a 20 amp breaker but you can confirm from the picture above. It is on the top right.

The only way for it to be plausible is if both of them can run at the same time.

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Short answer: No. There are ways you can draw test to see, but either way, some how I am guessing this would be frowned upon by your building management.

I want commercial because I plan on buying used and feel that they are often made from better and more replaceable parts. I often also make a few drinks at a time and would rather have a machine well beyond my needs.

As far as the grinder it is already taken care of. I got a good deal on a mazzer super jolly that I couldn't refuse.

I didn't think it would work but thanks for the help guys. I'll keep looking for a 110 machine

What is your budget?

Expobar Brewtus IV-R is designed to be directly plumbed into a water line, in fact it has no reservoir. It also has a rotary pump, PID control, E61 brew group, and dual boilers.

If I had not gone with my Rocket R58 V2 I probably would have purchased the Brewtus.

The La Marzocco Linea Mini looks well built.

I would like to keep my budget around 1200. Less if I can which I why I am not looking at new machines. The rocket is a beautiful machine but they don't come up used very often. Currently I'm looking at a rancilio Epoca https://www.seattlecoffeegear.com/rancilio-epoca-e-1-group-automatic-commercial-espresso-machine

Although they are very expensive new, I have seen a few for sale used that are not that bad and there was a 2 group Epoca for sale on Craigslist for not much more than my budget which is kind of what sparked the idea of this thread.

Without knowing why you need a 2-group machine, I'll offer some of my own experience. When we got into home espresso we faced the sometimes decaf, sometimes regular obstacle. We got a mid-high end Jura super automatic machine that had a bypass to allow brewing different coffee than whatever the machine had in the hopper. It became quite a nuisance. We then went with two separate Gaggia platinum super automatics, one for decaf one for regular. This has really worked well.

These machines go for about $6-700 on WholeLatteLove.com. We did look into one high end Jura with dual hoppers but for no apparent reason that was over $4000

I don't need a 2 group machine. However I see more used commercial 2 groups for sale than single group machines and one particular was in my area. I spoke to the seller and little and realized that it was a 220v machine so I figured I would find out if it was possible to use it. Based on most of the information above it sounds like I have would have to make some modifications and I'm probably better off with a one group machine.

I've really been looking into a Breville dual boiler. It seems to have great reviews and has a lot of features that I want.

Right now I have both a gaggia classic and a breville. I believe that the breville is an 820. I have had it for a few years and it is very good but I am looking to upgrade. The dual boiler looks very nice but I am looking for a company who deals more exclusively with espresso machines. On another note I also have a breville juicer which I use to go through about 10 lbs of vegetables at a time and it has performed flawlessly every time.

Darnit. You may be talking me out of the 920...

The gentleman with the screenname, poison, would recommend the Astra Pro. It seems like a solid performer. It's not a dual boiler, it's a heat exchanger machine.

tailoredfamcam said:

The gentleman with the screenname, poison, would recommend the Astra Pro. It seems like a solid performer. It's not a dual boiler, it's a heat exchanger machine.

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Cameron, I'd forgotten about that thread. Your post jogged my memory, here it is:

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/463757-The-Astra-Pro-espresso-machine