Does Grind and Steel matter?

I've been hearing from most people that as long as a straight razor is "shave ready" no matter the brand/grind/steel type you should be able to get a great shave.

Now I've been having a tough go at it with my Dubl Duck straight. I've actually read that a few people have used for example Razor X and have had a hard time getting a good shave, and than have switch to Razor Y and have gotten a great shave. So I wanted to ask to confirm, for you guys does grind or steel type or anything else matter in achieving a good shave with a straight? Have any of you for example used a certain brand of razor and gotten terrible shaves and than switched to another brand of razor and gotten great shaves? Let's assume that all razors are truly shave ready and prep/lather/stropping is not an issue.

Again the reason I ask is because I have thick/course facial hair, I shave with a few days of growth always, never everyday, so I was wondering if a thicker grind like a 1/4 hallow or 1/2 hallow would work better for me than a full hallow razor.

I get better shaves with a larger hollow ground razor-but that is because that is what I like.

Wedges can shave the same way but feel very different.

I have a full and heavy beard as well but prefer thinner grinds.

I chuckle when I read folks saying "those shave great"-IMO anything can shave great or anything can shave bad-all depends on the honing.

The best shaving razor in the world (whatever that is) will shave like crap if not honed correctly.

A GD well honed shaves as well as anything

They all taste like chicken, to me.

Grind and steel matter, but in very different ways. Steel is simple; it is either razor quality steel or it isn't. Stick to well known razor makers and the steel will be of good quality. Dubl Duck is well known for good steel so that is not a question unless the blade has been reground or something similar by someone that doesn't know how. I believe different steels can feel different, but the differences are far to small to turn a good shave into a poor shave. Grind on the other hand is totally a matter of personal preference. Assuming again that we start with a quality razor then the difference between a full hollow and a wedge are down to personal taste. I slightly lean towards the heavier grinds, but it is only slight. I use them all and enjoy them all with only a small preference for heavier grinds.

give some deets on your razor. width, condition, model

did you hone it and when? is this your first foray into straights? are you adept at stropping?

hows your lather? describe it. mountains of lather and airy or thin and dense?

Doc226 said:

I get better shaves with a larger hollow ground razor-but that is because that is what I like.

Wedges can shave the same way but feel very different.

I have a full and heavy beard as well but prefer thinner grinds.

I chuckle when I read folks saying "those shave great"-IMO anything can shave great or anything can shave bad-all depends on the honing.

The best shaving razor in the world (whatever that is) will shave like crap if not honed correctly.

A GD well honed shaves as well as anything

Click to expand...

Steel and grind don't matter.

And neither does honing method.

As long as it gets properly sharp, doesn't matter how you get it there: Jnats, cotis, film, Naniwas.

The steel does matter "within reason".. if it didn't you'd see more Pakistan razors being used.
Also grind can matter to a individual person, like the OP.
I'm sure there are a number of people on here that get better shaves with one type of grind versus an other type.
To the OP, I would suggest picking up a heavy 1/2 hollow or 1/4 razor and give a go.
The best person to decide if there is a difference is you.
Good Luck.

so in another thread, another person says that all the pakistanis seem to need to figure out is tempering to razor standards... is this a variation on your steel comment or is the steel used wholly unsuitable?

MileMarker60 said:

The steel does matter "within reason".. if it didn't you'd see more Pakistan razors being used.
Also grind can matter to a individual person, like the OP.
I'm sure there are a number of people on here that get better shaves with one type of grind versus an other type.
To the OP, I would suggest picking up a heavy 1/2 hollow or 1/4 razor and give a go.
The best person to decide if there is a difference is you.
Good Luck.

Click to expand...

Well that depend on which Pakistan razor. If it's one of the damascus ones... it seems to be the steel.
If it's one of the mono steel Pakistan razors it seems to be more about the wrong dimensions.
In my unscientific testing (playing around ), the handful of Paki mono steel razors I've broken seem to have better HTing then GD's.
That being said the type of steel used by both is a variable.

Steel matters. Tempering matters. They are both important, and they are completely separate things. I have a Filly from late production that was made with ****e Pakistani steel and it is a gigantic PITA to get a great edge on. It can be done, but it's a job and a half. If too aggressive a stone is used, it seems to shed chunks from the bevel and edge, as if carbides were being pulled out. (Visible only under high magnification). This is a steel issue. Does it mean that all Pakistani steel is garbage? No, of course not.

I used to be a machinist and we got a lot of Chinese steel toward the end of my tenure - there were a LOT of issues with cold seams in steel products that we needed to be air or water-tight with Chinese steel that were NEVER there for decades when using U.S. made steel. For instance we would weld up a tank and find that it was leaking from the middle of a 2 foot square steel plate - nowhere near a weld! Poor steel quality makes a huge difference.

Heat treat, or temper, also plays a role - both in ease of sharpening and in shave quality. The harder the steel, the less important it is to use a super fine abrasive - very hard steel resists deep scratching, so razors with good hard steel take longer to sharpen, but they are easier to get a comfortable edge on. Softer steel sharpens easier and quicker, but needs a little more finesse/technique to give the same comfortable shave as a harder razor.

Personally, I think this is part of the reason that some folks have trouble getting a good comfortable shave with certain stones. I have a couple razors I almost think I could hone with a brick and get a good shave.

Within reason, steel and grind are small issues at best. Yes, there are examples of both that make a razor virtually unusable. But for ordinary razors actually meant to be shaved with, and made by knowledgeable and dedicated makers, its all about the edge.

Yes steel and grind matter depending on a person's preference. In your case half hollow, quarter hollow, hard steel (French, Swedish, Torrey) or big blades 7/8 plus would be my recommendation.

I don't know much about shaving other than how to shave and what my face tells me during the shave.
Extra hollow grinds hurt my face while the thicker grinds do not.
If it matters, I have a very thick course bear .

Bk124tt said:

I have a very thick course bear .

Click to expand...

Put him on a diet. And teach him some manners and refinement.

Bk124tt said:

I don't know much about shaving other than how to shave and what my face tells me during the shave.
Extra hollow grinds hurt my face while the thicker grinds do not.
If it matters, I have a very thick course bear .

Click to expand...

Slash McCoy said:

Put him on a diet. And teach him some manners and refinement.

Click to expand...

Am am I the only guy this happens to? I can have a properly spelled word and when I double space it will leave a period but also delete the last letter of the word.

A perfectly dialed-in edge will shave no matter what you shave ! You will just hear a little difference from a wedge to a full hollow ...from an "audio" standpoint ! I agree with previous similar comments. One thing though ...once you will learn to properly hone a straight you'll find the stones and technique you like most for your face. It takes time but it works !

Six of one, half a dozen of the other. Each to their own liking.

You have a DD razor which are know to have quality steel that will take and hold a good edge. Different grinds feel different on the face when shaving but all will shave equally well if shave ready. So long as you are talking quality razors shave ready honed it makes no practical difference in whisker cutting ability, at least for me.

Bob

Deferent "feel", same results. It's more a matter of preference.