First time newbie seeks assistance from the fine experts here (long post)

cpacamper · Mar 21, 2015

Hi gents,

I love wet shaving. I love buying gear, trying gear, the smell of great soap, the feel of warm wet lather, the kiss of a shave brush, the symphony of the whisker shear. I want to embrace all this hobby has to offer, so what better way than to try my hand at custom brushes.

My first idea:

This is what I believe is a Frank Shaving 27 mm knot silvertip badger brush, set at a 55mm loft. I face lather and like my brushes to have medium backbone. This brush, to be kind, is a complete floppy wet noodle.

I'd like to reset the knot lower, maybe at 50mm. I think this would give the knot enough backbone to make it a pretty decent face latherer.

My idea is to steam the knot out of the handle. Then, I'd like to clean the handle and remove 5mm from the bottom. Last, I'd re-glue the knot with 5 minute marine grade epoxy.

Does my plan seem sound? I don't have any fancy tools like a Dremmel, so what's the best way to remove the 5 mm of material from the bottom?

Thank you very much!

labrax · Mar 21, 2015

That sounds like a workable plan. Hopefully you can get the knot out using the steam method. You could then buy a Forstner bit the size of the hole in the handle for the knot and then borrow a drill to use it with. Get some painters masking tape - blue tape - to protect the top of the hole when you drill. Then you can seat it in with silicone adhesive at 50mm and use it for face lathering brush.

Big Jim · Mar 22, 2015

Be aware that there is some risk involved. Removing a knot to replace it, destroying it in the process, isn't very difficult. Removing the knot to use it over and save the handle may not work as planned.

So go into it knowing that everything may work as planned, or that you may need to get another knot.

Klovgren · Mar 22, 2015

Setting your new knot with marine grade epoxy will keep it in the handle from our experience for ever. When we make new handles and et the knots that's what we use. There have been a couple of occasions where we tried to remove them. The steam method refinished the handle after an hour (start with lower times it was cumulative in our case) and didn't budge the knot not one little bit. lol. It was pretty funny with a little time in between. Should've taken a picture.

If steam doesn't work:
Getting the knot out is hit or miss. If you are keeping the handle (not the knot) , cut away as much of the hair as possible. slowly, very slowly drill away the epoxy the hair is sitting into. flake by flake. try not to get into the handle. It's not easy. Be calm and slow.

My most honest suggestion is that you consider the first one a trial. You are learning a new skill. That way if you get frustrated, throwing it in a fire (not with hair knot - that smells awfullllll!!!!! okay frustration level was pretty high, all in all really satisfying even if it smelled horrible.) not so bad.

Give it a go. Try the ideas about steaming. Maybe the setting in adhesive isn't that great and it'll pop right out with steam. You don't know until you get in there. Best of luck! let us know how you do/did :thumbup1:

wooky · Mar 22, 2015

Personally, I would use a o-ring around the base of the knot to add a little to the backbone. If that idea didnt work, then resetting the loft down to 50mm would have been all for not. This way you dont have to worry about saving this brush, if the o-ring idea doesnt work you could sell it off or trade it off and get another brush more to your liking.

cpacamper · Mar 22, 2015

Klovgren said:
Setting your new knot with marine grade epoxy will keep it in the handle from our experience for ever. When we make new handles and et the knots that's what we use. There have been a couple of occasions where we tried to remove them. The steam method refinished the handle after an hour (start with lower times it was cumulative in our case) and didn't budge the knot not one little bit. lol. It was pretty funny with a little time in between. Should've taken a picture.

If steam doesn't work:
Getting the knot out is hit or miss. If you are keeping the handle (not the knot) , cut away as much of the hair as possible. slowly, very slowly drill away the epoxy the hair is sitting into. flake by flake. try not to get into the handle. It's not easy. Be calm and slow.

My most honest suggestion is that you consider the first one a trial. You are learning a new skill. That way if you get frustrated, throwing it in a fire (not with hair knot - that smells awfullllll!!!!! okay frustration level was pretty high, all in all really satisfying even if it smelled horrible.) not so bad.

Give it a go. Try the ideas about steaming. Maybe the setting in adhesive isn't that great and it'll pop right out with steam. You don't know until you get in there. Best of luck! let us know how you do/did

This is definitely a practice run. I want to learn and make mistakes with this one and the next one after that til I get it right!

I will post progress pics for sure.

wooky said:
Personally, I would use a o-ring around the base of the knot to add a little to the backbone. If that idea didnt work, then resetting the loft down to 50mm would have been all for not. This way you dont have to worry about saving this brush, if the o-ring idea doesnt work you could sell it off or trade it off and get another brush more to your liking.

I wrappped a rubberband around the base this morning to see. I think the knot ended up at about 48, too small but with ok backbOne. I will try a zip tie which will set it at about 52mm and see. Kind of a brush shim!

rudyt · Mar 23, 2015

As others have stated, steaming a knot *might* work, but will most likely damage the handle and in rare instances, the knot itself. The reality of it is you can most likely save the handle, or the knot, but not both unless they used a really crappy glue.

I've had partial success with Semogue brushes - the knot survived (but needed a lot of prying because of the ring), but the finish on the handle was completely destroyed.

I've had zero success with Vie-Long brushes. Even after one hour of steaming, the knot doesn't budge. The good news is the finish on their handles is indestructible. I wound up cutting off the handle to get the knot out.

Whipped Dog badger - seaming didn't budge the knot either.

If you like the knot, I'd say sacrifice the handle and get a new one from Whipped Dog for like $6-$8, or better yet, a cool vintage handle from eBay.

When you do reset your knot, I would suggest staying away from epoxy and use good old GE Silicone. It's more than strong enough, is completely waterproof, and best of all, you can remove the knot at a later time with a solid sharp twist -- really useful if you're playing with getting the perfect loft.

BSAGuy · Mar 23, 2015

I agree with stuff above. I think you need to decide on whether you want to save the knot or the handle. Very difficult to do both. Steaming can be really rough on these handles and may or may knot remove the knot.

Good luck.

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First time newbie seeks assistance from the fine experts here (long post)

cpacamper

labrax

Big Jim

Klovgren

wooky

cpacamper

rudyt

BSAGuy

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