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Politically Free Badger Harvest Question

Edit to make this clear because people think that i was too sarcastic. I don't want a politic/philosophy free thread.

Do we know if there is a reason why they would keep a badger (though many doubt it is a badger) alive when they skin it? Does it have to do with the preservation of the meat for consumption?
 
Just curious, what do we know about the harvesting of badgers? I know there is that video in that other ridiculous thread going on, but I personally don't want to get into philosophy on the nature of man so I created this thread.

Do you really think that statement is designed to keep this thread free of politics? Maybe rethink your approach because I can see how that one sentence is going to ruffle a few feathers.
 
No. There is no actual reason to skin an animal alive more than it being a challange to not be ripped appart by it. Chances are, it was some one from freaken PITA filming it and paying the guy so they can put it on the internet and have something to whine about.
 
Edit to make this clear because people think that i was too sarcastic. I don't want a politic/philosophy free thread.

Do we know if there is a reason why they would keep a badger (though many doubt it is a badger) alive when they skin it? Does it have to do with the preservation of the meat for consumption?

It's not a badger. I feel like we've pounded that fact into everyone's brains with all the websites linked showing the video that actually states it's a raccoon dog. Whatever that is.
 
Nice. Well to answer your question, sort of, the theory seems to be that they may be doing this in order to make sure the pelt stays free of damage from the killing. I don't personally believe this nor do i really believe that they are definitely being mistreated as a rule. I am interested and have helped with sending e-mails though because it would be nice to be sure. In reality though no matter what we do and no matter what proof is offered we will never really know that they are being treated humanely. I mean I thought cows were being treated humanely but then that recent news story came out. I thought Dogs we bought at pet stores were fine but then Oprah had a nice episode about breeding farms where the studs and b$$ches are kept locked up for their whole lives in small cages. After being let out these animals are unable to even walk on normal ground because they never have. These things are happening in this country so I am not going to deny the possibility of it happening in others. As far as a definite why though I have no factual answer.
 
It's not a badger. I feel like we've pounded that fact into everyone's brains with all the websites linked showing the video that actually states it's a raccoon dog. Whatever that is.

No I know its not badger, I read that on the other thread. I just misspoke on that. I will again use the "its late" excuse. Funny thing, racoon dog, btw, is on P. Diddy's Sean John clothing (http://www.hsus.org/furfree/news/sean_john_diddy_combs_mislabeled_fur.html)

I am trying to figure out the WHY of the whole thing. I mean, why would I skin an animal alive with risk of it biting me when I could have killed it first.
 
Nice. Well to answer your question, sort of, the theory seems to be that they may be doing this in order to make sure the pelt stays free of damage from the killing. I don't personally believe this nor do i really believe that they are definitely being mistreated as a rule. I am interested and have helped with sending e-mails though because it would be nice to be sure. In reality though no matter what we do and no matter what proof is offered we will never really know that they are being treated humanely. I mean I thought cows were being treated humanely but then that recent news story came out. I thought Dogs we bought at pet stores were fine but then Oprah had a nice episode about breeding farms where the studs and b$$ches are kept locked up for their whole lives in small cages. After being let out these animals are unable to even walk on normal ground because they never have. These things are happening in this country so I am not going to deny the possibility of it happening in others. As far as a definite why though I have no factual answer.

Ahh, thank make sense to me re the pelts being protected from damage. I have to imagine that is less of a concern with badger where they aren't going for an entire pelt...
 

ouch

Stjynnkii membörd dummpsjterd
I can sort of reconcile some of the horrible things that happen to animals so that I'm able to eat and wear shoes, but I can never condone gratuitous brutality toward any living thing*.





*There are, of course, exceptions, usually reserved for humans.
 

ouch

Stjynnkii membörd dummpsjterd
I can sort of reconcile some of the horrible things that happen to animals so that I'm able to eat and wear shoes,

There is so much that I don't understand about Ouch. I now have to add his eating habits to that list.

Cheers


Jeremy

No mystery there. I'm a carnivore, and no matter how I try to rationalize it, my meal oftens depends on some poor creature sacrificing its life for my meal; sometimes for a single bite. I'd prefer that the world worked otherwise, but I'm okay with it.

I'll tell you this- if I had to be accountable for everything on my dinner plate, I'd be eating a lot of grains and vegetables, and my protein intake would consist mostly of fish. I think that's the only member of the animal kingdom that I could successfully catch, prepare, and cook.
 
Below is an email that I received today from Mr Christian Mueller, Managing Director of MÜHLE / Hans-Jürgen Müller GmbH & Co.

This is one of several emails that I have received from Mr Mueller and, in each, he has displayed a great deal of compassion and a strong commitment to ensuring that his company obtains badger-hair through ethical means.

I am extremely grateful to Mr Mueller. I also believe that it is worth noting that his responses have been far more forthcoming than the British companies that I have contacted. This will have a major influence on my future purchasing decisions.

I do not believe that it would be fair to post Mr Mueller's email address here, but if anyone wants to PM me any comments to pass on to Mr Mueller, I will consolidate them and send them to him in a single email.

Cheers


Jeremy

__________________________________________________ _____________________________________


"Dear Jeremy,

we are currently preparing our trip to China and I promised to get back to you before our departure. We are visiting factories in China that process badger hair. I am very keen to investigate more and set some standards. I have therefore worked on a list with questions that I would like to bring up and discuss with the people in charge there. I would like to have confirmation on the information I have researched so far. Again, we are taking your concerns very serious and will use our influence to prove that what is shown in the video is not the norm of our industry.

I will be back in touch soon.

best regards,

Christian Mueller

MÜHLE / Hans-Jürgen Müller GmbH & Co. "





.
 
There are now several threads on this topic - can people please pick one or two threads to discuss this issue.

I do think this is a worthwhile issue to discuss, but I don't think we need duplicate threads on this subject.

Also, these threads belong in the Barbershop and not the Shaving Brush forum - these threads are political/philosophical in nature and not about shaving brushes per se.

Oh, one more thing, let's keep it gentlemanly.

Thanks gents.
 
I am trying to figure out the WHY of the whole thing. I mean, why would I skin an animal alive with risk of it biting me when I could have killed it first.

There is no reason to do so. It's a propaganda film, designed to get people emotional.
As far as keeping the animal alive so the pelt isn't damaged during the killing - that's pretty much BS too in my opinion. There is a much greater chance of damaging the pelt while trying to skin a live animal that is fighting for its life than there would be in just quickly killing the animal and then proceding to take its pelt.

I hate animal cruely as much as anyone and I know it does go on in the world, but the extreme you see in that video is just that - an extreme. There is no other reason to perform a live skinning on any animal other than shock value (or some type of satanic ritual)
 
There is no reason to do so. It's a propaganda film, designed to get people emotional.
As far as keeping the animal alive so the pelt isn't damaged during the killing - that's pretty much BS too in my opinion. There is a much greater chance of damaging the pelt while trying to skin a live animal that is fighting for its life than there would be in just quickly killing the animal and then proceding to take its pelt.

I hate animal cruely as much as anyone and I know it does go on in the world, but the extreme you see in that video is just that - an extreme. There is no other reason to perform a live skinning on any animal other than shock value (or some type of satanic ritual)

Dusty

There have been several calls for factual information on the various threads dealing with this issue. While I'm not disagreeing with you about the film, the one thing that no one here has done is find out who made it and why. Any chance of you delving into it and coming up with some answers? It could help to put a lot of minds at ease.

Cheers

Jeremy
 
While I'm not disagreeing with you about the film, the one thing that no one here has done is find out who made it and why.

I don't see how this is helpful. Say you see videos of rather horrifying car crashes in traffic school. You then track down the guy who shot the video and ask him his motivation for doing so? Finding out the information doesn't suddenly justify or negate the actions depicted in the videos.
 
There are now several threads on this topic - can people please pick one or two threads to discuss this issue.

I do think this is a worthwhile issue to discuss, but I don't think we need duplicate threads on this subject.

Also, these threads belong in the Barbershop and not the Shaving Brush forum - these threads are political/philosophical in nature and not about shaving brushes per se.

Oh, one more thing, let's keep it gentlemanly.

Thanks gents.
Suzuki-
I should have put it in Barbershop I suppose, but I made a new thread because I was trying to avoid the political/philosophical discussion that the other threads had become. I just wanted some factual discussion instead adn I didn't think that the other threads were on that route.
 
I don't see how this is helpful. Say you see videos of rather horrifying car crashes in traffic school. You then track down the guy who shot the video and ask him his motivation for doing so?

Absolutely. If I suspect that the guy who shot the video didn't just happen by but actually paid some other guy to crash into people in order to capture sensationalist footage.

That seems to be the concern of several members about the skinning video. Some believe that the video was staged by an extremist animal rights group. Some believe that what is seen on the video is common practice. I would be much more comfortable making an informed decision than just taking a guess.


Cheers

Jeremy
 
Absolutely. If I suspect that the guy who shot the video didn't just happen by but actually paid some other guy to crash into people in order to capture sensationalist footage.

That seems to be the concern of several members about the skinning video. Some believe that the video was staged by an extremist animal rights group. Some believe that what is seen on the video is common practice. I would be much more comfortable making an informed decision than just taking a guess.


Cheers

Jeremy

+1
it would be nice to know what the heck is actually going on before we start calling for anything. Like Ouch, I am not going to support anything that is needlessly cruel to animals, but I am not going to avoid things (eating meat, using a badger brush, etc) just because an animal dies. Hmm... At this point, politics start to enter the thread-- maybe converge back onto those other threads?
 
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