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Most economical way to start honing?

S

SamDE

So I've read through the stickies, but I'm still a bit confused.

Here is where I am now. I have a shave-ready RenRen, and Gold Dollar. Both were honed and stropped by a friend of mine, and provide an amazing shave...mind you I'm coming off shavettes and safety razors.
Here is what I Think I need: A strop, and something to keep the edge sharp.

For the strop: I'm currently using an old leather belt, but will be purchasing a cheap "Made In China" strop...I've been told they will get the job done.

For the hone: My friend mentioned that I don't need lower grit stones (1k, 4k, etc.). I believe he mentioned that I should go with a 12k stone, or film lap.

So the question is, which stone should I go with if I just want something to keep an already-shave-ready blade sharp? If not a stone, which film do I need? I'm trying to keep this as wallet-friendly as possibly.

My local pawnshop has a "pike's strop-babrber hone" for $25...not sure if I should get that, or a cheap strop ($10) and either lapping film or a higher grit stone. What would you guys recommend?
 
David

David

B&B’s Champion Corn Shucker
I don't know much about film, but as far as stones go I'd recommend something like a naniwa 12k. It won't come flat, but you can lap it with wet/dry sandpaper and a cheap glass plate or tile from lowes.
Personally I would not get the barber hone.
OR, another option would be pastes on a cotton/linen strop or on a piece of balsa wood
 
jKyro

jKyro

I've done some work using lapping film and it leaves a pretty solid finish. You just have to make sure you have a PERFECTLY flat surface, like a tile sample from Home Depot to put it on. I started with one that had an ever so slightly raised bevel and inadvertently gave my first razor a frown near the end. I've always purchased mine from fiberoptics4sale.com but Amazon is also a good place too. Someone else can chime in on this as I can't remember if I used the silicone or aluminum type film. Get the full sheets and for polishing you'll want 1um or lower. 1um is somewhere around 14,000 grit and .3 I believe is 30,000.

Another cheap alternative if you don't want to buy a stone is a balsa strop with .5um diamond spray or .3um CrOx paste. I've used the paste and I still polish with the 1um film myself.

The he only thing I don't like about film is it has a tendency to leave a more harsh edge than a nice stone, however I don't have a stone above 8000 grit right now. I plan on getting one as I want to try something more smooth.

Hope we this helps a little bit. But beware, Alice, this is one deep rabbit hole :)

Kyro
 
S

SamDE

Thanks guys.

Avenopey, which lapping film would I need? I've looked around but can't really find what everyone is recommending.

Dcaddo111, I figured I should stay away from it. I was considering the Naniwa 12k, but it's a tad out of my price range, for now at least. I may have to go the paste/strop route, although it seems like the stone would be more economical in the long run.
 
S

SamDE

jKyro said:
I've done some work using lapping film and it leaves a pretty solid finish. You just have to make sure you have a PERFECTLY flat surface, like a tile sample from Home Depot to put it on. I started with one that had an ever so slightly raised bevel and inadvertently gave my first razor a frown near the end. I've always purchased mine from fiberoptics4sale.com but Amazon is also a good place too. Someone else can chime in on this as I can't remember if I used the silicone or aluminum type film. Get the full sheets and for polishing you'll want 1um or lower. 1um is somewhere around 14,000 grit and .3 I believe is 30,000.

Another cheap alternative if you don't want to buy a stone is a balsa strop with .5um diamond spray or .3um CrOx paste. I've used the paste and I still polish with the 1um film myself.

The he only thing I don't like about film is it has a tendency to leave a more harsh edge than a nice stone, however I don't have a stone above 8000 grit right now. I plan on getting one as I want to try something more smooth.


Hope we this helps a little bit. But beware, Alice, this is one deep rabbit hole :)

Kyro
Click to expand...

Thanks a ton, Kyro. I will check out those recommendations. If I do go the film route, I will probably stick with a 1um film.
To your last point...it seems like I am learning that the hard way!

Edit: I just checked out the site you linked. Apparently there are a few different 1um films...now I'm confused again, haha.
 
Last edited:
Avenolpey

Avenolpey

PM Seraphim and he will dial you in. But don't get suckered into the film with Japanese writing. He charges a premium for it.
 
Seraphim

Seraphim

Get the 3um and the 1um.

$27, cut each sheet into 4 3.25"x9" sheets (or 3 3"x13" sheets) and you'll be set for a looooong time.



Fiber Polishing/Lapping Film for Use with Stainless Steel Ferrules


proxy.php

Thorlabs offers Aluminum Oxide and Silicon Carbide lapping / polishing sheets to polish a connector after the fiber has been epoxied into the ferrule. Lapping sheets are like sandpaper for optical connectors. Tiny aluminum oxide or silicon carbide particles are glued to a substrate of polyester with resin. Since we highly recommend a four step polishing process when using aluminum oxide or silicon carbide sheets, we offer our sheets in four different grit sizes: 3, 1, and 0.3 µm grits using Aluminum Oxide and 5 µm grit using Silicon Carbide.
Typically, each area of each sheet can only be used once to polish a single connector. Also, care should be taken when polishing your connector as these sheets can cause undercutting especially with ceramic or zirconia ferrules. Undercutting occurs when the fiber material is removed quicker than the ferrule material creating a dip just above the fiber. When the connector is mated to another connector, instead of getting a good glass-to-glass interface, the air gap created by the undercutting causes a glass-air-glass interface and undesirable excess loss.
These 13” x 9” sheets should be used with our glass polishing plates and rubber mats (see below).
Note: Aluminum oxide and silicon carbide sheets are sold in packages of 10.




Based on your currency / country selection, your order will ship from Newton, New Jersey
+1QtyDocsPart Number - Universal/ImperialPriceAvailable / Ships
LFG03P13" x 9" Aluminum Oxide Lapping (Polishing) Sheet, 0.3 µm Grit (10 Sheets)
$15.50
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Today
LFG1P13" x 9" Aluminum Oxide Lapping (Polishing) Sheet, 1 µm Grit (10 Sheets)
$13.80
proxy.php
Today
LFG3P13" x 9" Aluminum Oxide Lapping (Polishing) Sheet, 3 µm Grit (10 Sheets)
$13.80
proxy.php
Today
LFG5P13" x 9" Silicon Carbide Lapping (Polishing) Sheet, 5 µm Grit (10 Sheets)
$13.80
proxy.php
Today


 
Seraphim

Seraphim

I dislike both the 0.3 & the 5 um.

The level of refinement that the 0.3 gives is superfluous. The abrasive on the 5 um is not well bonded, and doesn't function as well as a result.

I have tried a stone like you linked to. I found it extremely slow in cutting ability, and the resulting edge was not worth the effort I put in to getting it there. But every stone is different, so who knows?
 
Last edited:
S

SamDE

Seraphim said:
I dislike both the 0.3 & the 5 um.

The level of refinement that the 0.3 gives is superfluous. The abrasive on the 5 um is not well bonded, and doesn't function as well as a result.

I have tried a stone like you linked to. I found it extremely slow in cutting ability, and the resulting edge was not worth the effort I put in to getting it there. But every stone is different, so who knows?
Click to expand...

Thanks again! I'll stick with the lapping sheets.
 
Gamma

Gamma

The Pike Strop Hone is a pretty nice piece actually. It'll probably need some work but once the stone is lapped, conditioned, etc - you'll have a very good maintenence hone.
Most are pretty beat up - the leather side is usually trashed, etc. So it's a project, and the cost of admission isn't bad but the overall condition weighs into the cost.

If you don't want to spend a lot of coin, buy a cheap cotton belt from the thrift shop and get a 10 dollar tube of TI white paste or the Dovo black paste. That set up will cost you about 15 bucks and barring an accident, it'll keep you shaving for a very very long time.

I've yet to see a Chinese strop that's worth buying. I keep hearing about them but I've not seen one.
For the 10 bucks they cost - I'd rather use an old belt. But that's just me.

Jarrod sells a 20 dollar with shipping German Herold starter strop, I think that's a deal that's hard to beat. He used to sell the Dovo pastes too, but I'm not sure.
 
S

SamDE

Gamma said:
The Pike Strop Hone is a pretty nice piece actually. It'll probably need some work but once the stone is lapped, conditioned, etc - you'll have a very good maintenence hone.
Most are pretty beat up - the leather side is usually trashed, etc. So it's a project, and the cost of admission isn't bad but the overall condition weighs into the cost.

If you don't want to spend a lot of coin, buy a cheap cotton belt from the thrift shop and get a 10 dollar tube of TI white paste or the Dovo black paste. That set up will cost you about 15 bucks and barring an accident, it'll keep you shaving for a very very long time.

I've yet to see a Chinese strop that's worth buying. I keep hearing about them but I've not seen one.
For the 10 bucks they cost - I'd rather use an old belt. But that's just me.

Jarrod sells a 20 dollar with shipping German Herold starter strop, I think that's a deal that's hard to beat. He used to sell the Dovo pastes too, but I'm not sure.
Click to expand...

The pike may be worth looking at then. I believe the pawn shop owner said that it was his; never used the stone side but the leather did look beat up.
I do have an old belt that I no longer use; one side is smooth leather, the other is untreated. I'll check out Jarrod's strop. Thanks! That paste option may be the most inexpensive one yet.
 
Gamma

Gamma

The old baber hones tend to 'dry' out or something along those lines. If you get it - be sure to lap it to a very fine degree and then try putting mineral oil on it. You might be able to replace the leather, I forget how it's attached on that one.

Hard to beat the TI white paste for touch ups. Some say the Dovo black is finer but I'm not entirely convined of that. They're close enough to be used interchangeably I think though.

There are a million ways to skin this cat - pastes are (IMO) one of, if not the simplest, cheapest, and easiest way to get it done.
 
S

SamDE

Gamma said:
The old baber hones tend to 'dry' out or something along those lines. If you get it - be sure to lap it to a very fine degree and then try putting mineral oil on it. You might be able to replace the leather, I forget how it's attached on that one.

Hard to beat the TI white paste for touch ups. Some say the Dovo black is finer but I'm not entirely convined of that. They're close enough to be used interchangeably I think though.


There are a million ways to skin this cat - pastes are (IMO) one of, if not the simplest, cheapest, and easiest way to get it done.
Click to expand...

After reading through a few more threads, I've decided to stick with the paste, then try lapping film. Regarding the paste, would you recommend green (.5) or white (.25)? I just need something to maintain an already sharp edge. How often should I strop with the paste? And would I have to reapply every time? Thanks for the help!
 
Gamma

Gamma

The white paste I'm talking about is the Theirs Issard white paste and AFAIK there is no particle size given by the manufacturer.
There have been 'claims' that 'someone' tested it but thus far no one has posted any lab reports.

I prefer TI white over .3µm and .5µm Crox.
But you may not feel the same way - they're cheap enough to experiment with so trying both makes sense.

There are coarser pastes also - for edges that have degraded a bit further.

One application lasts a long while and you don't need to put a lot of product on the substrate.
 
S

SamDE

Gamma said:
The white paste I'm talking about is the Theirs Issard white paste and AFAIK there is no particle size given by the manufacturer.
There have been 'claims' that 'someone' tested it but thus far no one has posted any lab reports.

I prefer TI white over .3µm and .5µm Crox.
But you may not feel the same way - they're cheap enough to experiment with so trying both makes sense.

There are coarser pastes also - for edges that have degraded a bit further.

One application lasts a long while and you don't need to put a lot of product on the substrate.
Click to expand...

I guess I'll just have to try both! There's a local shop here that sell a 6 oz bar (similar to a crayon I suppose) of green chromium oxide. The owner said it's equivalent to about .5 microns and stated that it should be enough to touch up an already shave-ready razor. He sells them for $11, which seems like an amazing deal from what I can tell. I'll pick up the TI paste as well. There's also another place that sells the Herold paste's (8 grams/$7 for either the green, red, or yellow).

Here is what I am considering: Green chromium oxide ($11), Paddle Strop ($30) OR old belt/inexpensive strop w/ a fiber and leather side ($10), and TI paste (?). If I'm not mistaken, I should be set with that combination for at least a year or so.

Seraphim said:
I'm using a pasted cotton strop that I haven't put new paste on for over three years.
Click to expand...

That's great to hear, I believe that may be the best route for me then. How often do you touch up your straight's with the pasted strop? I know most people use the leather side every 6-8 shaves, but I'm still a bit confused about touching-up.

Again, thank you all for the help.
 
Gamma

Gamma

Yellow paste is strop dressing - some sort of wax/fat type of stuff. Not a honing paste.

The red/green herold pastes are - I think 3µm and 6µm - not really finishing grits but good for bringing up an edge that's beyond the point that the finer pastes can deal with.

Most people strop on plain leather for every shave. Touching up is done when it's needed - as in, when the edge starts to feel notably less sharp.
 
jKyro

jKyro

SamDE said:
I guess I'll just have to try both! There's a local shop here that sell a 6 oz bar (similar to a crayon I suppose) of green chromium oxide. The owner said it's equivalent to about .5 microns and stated that it should be enough to touch up an already shave-ready razor. He sells them for $11, which seems like an amazing deal from what I can tell. I'll pick up the TI paste as well. There's also another place that sells the Herold paste's (8 grams/$7 for either the green, red, or yellow).

.
Click to expand...
Be careful with the brand. If it's the one that comes in a yellow box, it's not true CrOx. There was a long threat I got into with some guys over on SRP.com and one of them ended up contacting the company that made it for their MSDS. It has particles up to 300 grit size. He ended up contacting the guy to verify it and it was true. I threw that strop and "CrOx" in the trash.
 
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