Theird Issard for a newbie

Evening all,

Recently I have entered the world of straight edge shaving, from DE shaving. It is going well using a shavette, but it is time to step it up and get a proper straight razor. Before I do I wanted to do my research and was hoping I could get some pointers and things to watch for from, people that have been here and done that.

After doing doing company research I determined that I want a Theird-Issard brand of razor (just a personal preference on their look)

I have been trying to get a few things straight (no pun intended):
1. how hard is it to strop a full hollow ground razor, if that is what I am going to be starting on, is it a good idea?
2. what should I be looking for in a new razor?
3. how much should I be spending on my first strop?

The two razors I have narrowed my search down to is

http://www.fendrihan.com/thiers-issard-limited-edition-legende-collectors-straight-razor-p-3557.html
http://www.fendrihan.com/thiers-iss...or-bocote-handle-p-2574.html?cPath=116_22_109

If anybody has anything to say whatsoever I would love to hear any input and I just want to be a sponge and soak up the knowledge. Thanks!

I wouldn't spend that much on a razor until after I learned how to use it and care for it. You're much better off starting with a competently prepared, modestly priced razor that won't make you cry when you ding it. Ditto for the strop. If you get a nice one (I'm a huge Tony Miller fan) make sure to get an additional "second" or "practice" strop to use until you get the hang of the contortions of stropping.

Remember that straight razor shaving requires a complete commitment- you have to master shaving, stropping, and honing. The learning curve may take quite some time to master.

Those are 2 very nice blades (I especially like the Durandal). A bit on the large side though. New Thiers Issard measurements do not take into account the spine, so those 6/8 are comparable to 7/8. Still very manageable, but a 6/8 might be a bit easier to start on.
Both are round points, which is a bit more forgiving for a beginner.
If you want to try on more modest blades, you can find vintage Thiers Issard 5/8 to 6/8 for a lot less than those 2 blades are going for.

As for the strop, I messed up my expensive Dovo one on my very first shave. Not too bad, as I am still using it 2 years later, but that is something I would have rather avoided.
I've bought a few cheap strop of eBay and Amazon and it has been hit or miss (mostly miss), so not something I'd recommend as for the price I spent on several unusable strop, I could have gotten myself a big daddy or a Tony Miller.
There is a good beginner strop sold by a hobbyist (whippeddog) here called the "poor man strop". A few of my friends got that and are happy with it.

ouch said:

I wouldn't spend that much on a razor until after I learned how to use it and care for it. You're much better off starting with a competently prepared, modestly priced razor that won't make you cry when you ding it. Ditto for the strop. If you get a nice one (I'm a huge Tony Miller fan) make sure to get an additional "second" or "practice" strop to use until you get the hang of the contortions of stropping.

Remember that straight razor shaving requires a complete commitment- you have to master shaving, stropping, and honing. The learning curve may take quite some time to master.

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Yep, that sounds like real good advice. Those Theirs Issards are really nice razors. I really love mine. All four of mine are very nice shavers and three of them were purchased used. The new one shaves as well as the three vintage ones do. That is as long as I do my part.

Good luck.

Chasmo

I purchased a GD 208 right here on B&B (Buca) and its been perfect I then purchased a Le Grelot (Marc) here as well and it's been perfect as well and both combined were not even 1/2 the cost of one of those razors, not saying they are not worth the coin but you may be better off starting off with one that's a lesser cost to get your feet wet.

Brand of razor with few exceptions is irrelevant. More important is who hones it and their reputation. Plus if you get a razor on the low side to start theres your guunea pig for honing if you decide to learn that as well in the future. A 300 razor as a first hone doesnt sit right imo.

Those are great looking razors you picked out. I would agree with most of the above comments though. Get something a lot cheaper, make sure it is for you then treat yourself to the expensive blade if you want. Look at the hobbyist section on B&B, some great razors at a much lower price.

Strops can vary a lot in price, in the UK the cheapest one that is acknowledged as ok is around the low £20s, say $30. Cheaper than that seems to be a big drop in quality.

A a general rule a round point is preferable to a square point for newbies, but the most important thing is to get one that is guaranteed shave ready. Hobbyists here will do that, eBay sellers may well not. If you must have a brand new razor, check out GoldDollars, there are some great ones for sale as well as some cheap and cheerful ones that are also shave ready.

Good luck!

If you buy a less expensive razor first, don't think of it as 'instead of the one I want', think of it as 'in addition to the one I will be getting'. Having two or more razors is a very good thing, especially while you are learning and trying out different honing and stropping techniques.

I tend not to agree with the "get the cheapest razor as possible as your first razor" rule. I mean, making mistakes and figuring things out are part of the process, and a very enjoyable one, where you really learn how to do it on your own. I believe it's better to do it with a tool that you like and gives you confidence.

I purchased a cheap vintage razor as my first straight. To be honest, I didn't like its looks at all and I couldn't shave with it more than two times. Once I got the Dovo I wanted, things improved naturally. I mean, you don't have to spend $300+ on your first razor, but why not $100-$200 on something that you really enjoy? If you are careful, the worst thing you can do is dull the edge and have to send it out for honing... No big deal, IMO.

I purchased a $300 razor as my "first" (Hart).
But - I also ordered a Whipped Dog special. I ordered the Hart before I had any competence in the WD.

Alfred is a great guy, at Fendrihan, but last I checked he does not do any honing. Something to be mindful of considering that you're learning and will need it honed in the future. Classic Edge is the only Canadian shop I know of that does honing.

Back to your original questions:
1. No difference in the grind for stropping. Always keep in mind that you do not want to apply pressure when stropping. Full hollows are light blades.
2. Shave-readiness. You want to make sure that it's sharp. The rest is up to you and down to personal preferences.
3. Minimal; I'd say under $50 for your first strop. You'll likely nick it a few times. The Star Shaving strop has replaceable leather. The Whipped Dog poor man's strop is also similarly cheap.

I would also consider getting an inexpensive razor that's well honed to pair with your new shiny razor. This inexpensive razor can be held in reserve - used when you think your new razor is getting dull to give you comparative feedback on the edge as well as give you a tool to learn how to hone (or have backup when you send your other razor for honing).

One accidental drop or a misguided clang against the bathroom faucet and your new razor may be ruined. I would get several S.R. Shaves under my belt before purchasing a new razor.

Thank you everybody for all the advice so far!

I understand all the concern for getting such a nice blade right off the bad, however, if I do ding it, is it not possible to send it off to be honed? And the info on Fendrihan not shave-readying their blades is really useful! I may take a closer look at ClassicEdge!

Part of the interest in my first blade being so nice is because of my Father, he recently told me he wants to get me something that will last a lifetime and I might even be able to pass down, so I gave it solid thought for quite a few months and figured there is nothing more symbolic than a straight razor being passed down from Father to Son. So I want to do it right.

Finally, I have been shaving with the cheaper Shavette to get use to how to treat and shave with a Straight Razor (and I know the angle is going to change, and well you don't strop a shavette) are straight edge blades more delicate than a DE blade in a shavette?

Thanks All!

do it, get the TI you like and a cheaper vintage... at least having the TI in your sight will keep the fire alive


you never know whats going to happen to a straight edge if you ding it or drop it. maybe a nick than can be fixec, maybe a bad crack (ppht pppht phhht), maybe a cut hand trying to catch it..

better to learn how to handle a straight with a cheap one and have the TI ready to go once you have comfort and technique..

The more I hear the mention of having two... the more I like the idea...hmmm

Get the TI if you like. They're beautiful razors and I'm eventually going to pick one up. I bought a Ralf Aust as my first big splurge and a TI will eventually follow.

Now...order yourself at least one (I'd get 2) shave ready straights from Bill (Buca) or Larry (Whipped Dog). Either of these guys will get you started for cheap and after only spending a few dollars (comparatively speaking) you will get fine razors and a cheap strop, sage advice and plenty of support. I reckon that once you find your stride with straights, one of these guys might even hone your fancy new razor for you.

This is just my suggestion/opinion. Oh!...And have fun! Best of luck, sir.

Buy it, you can get most of your money back if you decide its not for you.

Slym said:

The more I hear the mention of having two... the more I like the idea...hmmm

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I recommend first a cheap one. if you don't like it then you haven't lost much to begin with. also if you messed it up no biggie. my first straight was not shave ready. until I bought a shave ready Gold dollar from ebay for 25$(as i remember). it made A WORLD of difference. so good and sharp. I still keep it and shave with it from time to time. I love thick grinds. and large silent beard killers. the Gold dollar is 1/2 hollow. but i do have other hollow razors. this takes the cake.

the most important part is not the razor. it is the honer. I got a Jackson Smith Sheffield razor. wedge type. the edge lasted for almost a year. I still shave with it. and never honed it. also i got a Sutcliffe Sheffield wedge. my treasured devil. the edge dulled in less than a month unfortunately. why? because it depends on the honer. my GD was honed by really good honer from ebay. so good that gave a good general idea about straight razors.

if the honer isn't good. then you might take it badly. it might ruin the whole experience.


Edit: I think i need a shave. the Jackson Smith is waiting for me

I haven't really thought about that, but it is a very good point! Does anybody know how swell the ClassicEdge hone is? I can only assume it is good since they offer to do it before you recieve the blade, and a coupon for a free one after...

also, I have thought about what you all have said and my splurge lust has gone down, I think I may go with this one as my good blade:
http://classicedge.ca/index.php?route=product/product&path=71_70&product_id=1211
I think I want to go with the plastic resin for the scales just for longetivity sake (I can't quite ensure I can keep the wood dry quite yet)

now, given I don't wreck the blade for a stupid reason, how long 'should' I be able to go before having to hone the blade? (or get somebody to do it for me that is)

Thanks you all again for all your answers, I am still getting all the info straight before plunging all in.

Slym said:

I think I want to go with the plastic resin for the scales just for longetivity sake (I can't quite ensure I can keep the wood dry quite yet)

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I would not worry about the water on wood. It is stabilized. The blade will rust before the wood deteriorate if humidity is involved.
It is true that over centuries, wood might not make it, but I think you are safe for a couple of lifetime.

Slym said:

now, given I don't wreck the blade for a stupid reason, how long 'should' I be able to go before having to hone the blade? (or get somebody to do it for me that is)

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You'll get many answer to that one. Doc shave over 120 times in a row with a TI with only stropping maintenance. When he stopped the test, another member tried the razor and thought the edge was still fine to his standard. That is a lot of shaves, but not everybody will have
1/ the straight honed by Doc
2/ the stropping expertise
3/ the shaving expertise (a bad angle is bad for the edge)


But then again, this was with no maintenance. You can easily extend the edge longevity with crOx applied on a balsa board or on a suede strop.

Slym said:

I haven't really thought about that, but it is a very good point! Does anybody know how swell the ClassicEdge hone is? I can only assume it is good since they offer to do it before you recieve the blade, and a coupon for a free one after...

also, I have thought about what you all have said and my splurge lust has gone down, I think I may go with this one as my good blade:
http://classicedge.ca/index.php?route=product/product&path=71_70&product_id=1211
I think I want to go with the plastic resin for the scales just for longetivity sake (I can't quite ensure I can keep the wood dry quite yet)

now, given I don't wreck the blade for a stupid reason, how long 'should' I be able to go before having to hone the blade? (or get somebody to do it for me that is)

Thanks you all again for all your answers, I am still getting all the info straight before plunging all in.

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Only those who tried Classic edge can tell you about them. In general I never talk about something unless I try it. Because it is unfair and dishonest to give an opinion about something I know nothing about. In the end I will cause more bad than good

How long will it take until it needs honing?. Depends on who honed it. I bought my Jackson Smith in 2013. I am not sure if it is almost or passed a year since I bought it . Yet. It doesn't need honing at all.

The main reason is not to make you have bad expectations. It is simply so you can avoid the bad experience. 1 good way if really want a TI. And only a TI. Is buy one and send it to a honer. In the end O1 steel will remain O1 steel. No matter where it was made or by who. As Buca said. "Irrelevant". Just like paracetamol will remain paracetamol. If bought it for 1$ or 10$. It is still the same.

Just remembered. The guy who I bought the GD. I also sent to him 2 other razors for honing last year. They also came good and shave ready. I really wish if could remember the guy who sold me the Jackson smith. I would have have told you his account on ebay. It is 100% foolproof way to buy a truly awesome shave ready razor. I would bet on it!. I cannot tell how long will the edge last. Man the edge won't dull .

The guy named Buca also sells good shave ready razors. I read too much about him here. Talk tim if you are interested or ask him for honing.

Or I could look for the guy who sold me the Jackson Smith. if you want to. I don't know if he accepts you buying a razor then directly sending it to him for honing. But it doesn't hurt to ask.