can we talk about the environment?

Lots of folks say that they like the idea of SE, DE and, especially, straight edge shaving because they are all better for the environment than using electrics or carts...less waste, less plastic, less energy, etc. Is there anything we could do to _quantify_ that? Wouldn't it be great if we could do a little (even very primitive) analysis along these lines?

I was struck by the fact that our local health food stores all carry at least a little in the way of all vegetarian ingredient, no animal testing, no alcohol, etc., shave creams and after shaves...wouldn't they be great places to appeal to, to carry more (and encourage more) traditional wet shaving methods?

and if this has been brought up before (I've only been a member for a few days!) I'd love any pointers to members or threads along these lines.

thanks!

I do notice this. I have a big stock of soaps and creams, most of which are far more "natural" than the chemical stuff sold at the drugstore. One razor, one brush, one bowl = totally content. The best thing is that I don't need those wasteful, expensive carts any more! It will probably take me a year to fill my tin can with used blades, which are then easily recycled.

I suspect that after a year of this wonderful DE shaving, I will have found the perfect set-ups. So no more purchases for a year, maybe, which is good for the environment. Just a new blade every 2-3 shaves, for pennies.

Hmmm, I don't remember hearing anyone mention the environmental aspect before, and I'd never thought about it till now. I'm not one to obsess about such things (I'm from Kansas, environmental awareness isn't cool here), but I also loath excessive plastic packaging. The amount of waste generated and the recyclability of such waste should be fairly easy to quantify, should someone take the task upon himself. As far as energy consumption goes, I'd say that would vary a lot from person to person: amount of hot water used, time spent with the bathroom lights on, electricity used to play a CD because your shave now takes twice as long, shipping cost due to ordering products from an online store in Timbuktu, etc., etc.

There's a moderately amusing thread on this topic (sort of!) here...to be taken tongue in cheek:

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/54479-Shaving-and-the-environment

I know which would take up less room in landfill. A year of DE blades (recycle), soap or cream containers, aftershave bottle. A year of Disposable heads, packing and head racks, canned goo. A year of disposable razors, their packing, canned goo. You may not pull the hippy chicks with how green you are, but it beats driving a Prius. Go vintage and it gets better since no packaging waste, the energy to produce it was already brought down to about nothing after years of use. Skip the hot towels or other preshave rigormarole, cold water shave, make your own soap and aftershaves; boom you out green the stinky bearded dude, and ya smell better!

tejolot3 said:

Hmmm, I don't remember hearing anyone mention the environmental aspect before, and I'd never thought about it till now. I'm not one to obsess about such things (I'm from Kansas, environmental awareness isn't cool here), but I also loath excessive plastic packaging. The amount of waste generated and the recyclability of such waste should be fairly easy to quantify, should someone take the task upon himself. As far as energy consumption goes, I'd say that would vary a lot from person to person: amount of hot water used, time spent with the bathroom lights on, electricity used to play a CD because your shave now takes twice as long, shipping cost due to ordering products from an online store in Timbuktu, etc., etc.

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That's what I've thought about before. I WANT to have a lesser impact on the environment with my shaving choices, BUT when it comes down to it, I'm really being more wasteful. The amount of oil's and energy that goes into making plastic throw away's is probably insignificant compared to the amount burned in flying and trucking all my blades, soaps, creams and etc.'s around. The only way really to shave whilst being mindful of the environment is to shop locally. And really, if that's how I did it, I'd be back on Barbasol and Good News razors. Thus, recycling back to where I was.

Well dang, now my minds racing on this one!

A Dutch consumer organisation calculated this a few years ago; electric shaving, using a non-battery shaver, has the least environmental impact during the entire life cycle.

Cash_Stronomer said:

That's what I've thought about before. I WANT to have a lesser impact on the environment with my shaving choices, BUT when it comes down to it, I'm really being more wasteful. The amount of oil's and energy that goes into making plastic throw away's is probably insignificant compared to the amount burned in flying and trucking all my blades, soaps, creams and etc.'s around. The only way really to shave whilst being mindful of the environment is to shop locally. And really, if that's how I did it, I'd be back on Barbasol and Good News razors. Thus, recycling back to where I was.

Well dang, now my minds racing on this one!

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Someone above mentioned filling a tin can with used blades, but I've been using the same can for almost three years now, and using Feathers I can go twice as long as my previous blade, and my can is maybe 20% full. Also, if you go through some small artisan vendors, a lot of them sell their melt-and-pour soaps wrapped in plastic, so you can just melt it into a plastic tub. I have it on good authority that you can mail the plastic screw-on-lid tubs back to Mama Bear when you use them up, and she offers them free if you ask nicely.

Yeah, but once I have everything set up, I'll only have to buy 100 +/- blades a year. My soap will out-last me.

Environmental concerns were one of my deciding factors in switching to DE - my pot of used DE blades won't be full for another couple of years at least and are easier to recycle. And no more tinned goo, so no more aerosols. And no more of these super-tough plastic packaging that can cause injury when trying to open!

Cash_Stronomer said:

That's what I've thought about before. I WANT to have a lesser impact on the environment with my shaving choices, BUT when it comes down to it, I'm really being more wasteful. The amount of oil's and energy that goes into making plastic throw away's is probably insignificant compared to the amount burned in flying and trucking all my blades, soaps, creams and etc.'s around. The only way really to shave whilst being mindful of the environment is to shop locally. And really, if that's how I did it, I'd be back on Barbasol and Good News razors. Thus, recycling back to where I was.

Well dang, now my minds racing on this one!

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Take a deep breath and don't panic about all that transportation. Keep in mind that the fuel expended to fly and truck all your blades, soaps, creams and etc. around is also moving all the other cargo on board the truck, plane or train. In reality the lightweight items you mention have a miniscule impact on fuel consumption. Now, if you were ordering barber chairs on a regular basis it would be an entirely different matter.

Not a concern of mine. But, I guess it's better than using plastic cartridges.
My thoughts are that this is one of the few luxuries I afford myself, and I will not obsess about the environmental concerns related to it. For me, that would ruin the fun.

oldbluelight said:

Take a deep breath and don't panic about all that transportation. Keep in mind that the fuel expended to fly and truck all your blades, soaps, creams and etc. around is also moving all the other cargo on board the truck, plane or train. In reality the lightweight items you mention have a miniscule impact on fuel consumption. Now, if you were ordering barber chairs on a regular basis it would be an entirely different matter.

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Agreed. And when you buy a Quatro or whatever that ridiculous Dyson vacuum cleaner looking craziness is called, it's also being shipped from Korea or China or something, so that wouldn't be better. And as has been mentioned, after a while your purchases will mostly be limited to the 100-200 blades per year that you need. I have five soaps, and already I feel I can probably stop buying soap for a good while. If I start buying kilos of Cella I would probably only have to buy soap once every five years. That's less than ten pounds of stuff every five years, with plenty of room for random "fun purchases." I think we can call a tie, if not points for traditional shaving, when you consider the places things are shipped from (China in particular has terrible environmental impact), and the quantity of products purchased over many years, cart and can might be worse purely in terms of transportation. Not to mention all the other ways it reduces your environmental impact. IMHO.

I suppose ya'll are right. And at least when I do buy things, it's generally in bulk so it would be quite a long while before I reorder anything.

If you really want "green", grow a beard and be done with it.

If the industrial giants, China, India, etc, don't stop their environmental impacts, what we do will have absolutely no impact whatsoever. The simple fact of the matter is, there are too many people on this planet, needing too much, to be ecologically sound, and the giants of it do not know of other means to produce what we need, cleanly. The planet as a whole must make the change and every single person needs to make the sacrifices.
One thing I would like to see is a return to longevity in the manufacturing sector. Things simply do not last anymore and the system wants to make money out of us all the time. For example, If we all had a washing machine that lasted 30 years, how would it effect the amount being made? Cars could last longer, but we want to change them all the time.

Beard Dregs said:

You may not pull the hippy chicks with how green you are, but it beats driving a Prius.

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Almost anything beats driving a Prius. Especially when you consider that when you include the environmental cost of building and maintaining the car, a Prius has as large a carbon footprint as a Honda Civic. My car gets better mileage than a Civic, so I figure I'm doing my part.

GordyN said:

If the industrial giants, China, India, etc, don't stop their environmental impacts, what we do will have absolutely no impact whatsoever. The simple fact of the matter is, there are too many people on this planet, needing too much, to be ecologically sound, and the giants of it do not know of other means to produce what we need, cleanly. The planet as a whole must make the change and every single person needs to make the sacrifices.
One thing I would like to see is a return to longevity in the manufacturing sector. Things simply do not last anymore and the system wants to make money out of us all the time. For example, If we all had a washing machine that lasted 30 years, how would it effect the amount being made? Cars could last longer, but we want to change them all the time.

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The best thing we can do for the environment is to encourage those developing economies to grow and join the 21st century as fast as possible. Wealthy societies clean up their messes. Poorer and collective societies tend not to, as evidenced by the horrifying environmental issues revealed in Eastern Europe after the fall of the Soviet Union.

Many thanks for all the responses...very gratifying to see others thinking along these lines. I'll respond in detail later, but in the meantime:

@Eeyore, hoe is het?! I'd love a link to that Dutch consumer org's report on shaving's environmental affects, and yeah, I read Dutch fine, bedankt.

@Cash_Stronomer, how come you have a Dutch sig...seems an odd coincidence that you and Eeyore post back-to-back.

@stromboneliness, a friend of mine toured a while with Buddy Rich's Big Band

regards to all,

dave

I cannot find the original article anymore, just a quote:

De Consumentengids heeft de volgende aanrader. 'Natscheren belast het milieu meer dan elektrisch scheren. Van een natscheerapparaat gooit elke gladgeschoren man geregeld mesjes weg. Deze worden niet hergebruikt. Ook het karton en plastic van de verpakking van de mesjes komt bij het huisvuil terecht. Vervolgens wordt er voor elke scheerbeurt zo'n vijf liter water verbruikt en vervuild met scheerzeep.'

I gotta say, my blood is Dutch, my speech is VERY much not! I'm the guy at the family dinner wondering if the jokes about me!
Though I don't get the language down, there's the Klompen beside my Converse, everything I make tastes like almond, and chocolate sprinkles? YESS!! Here's the kicker though, I HATE CHEESE.