Real or fake?

I like Joseph Rodgers razors, and I just bought the following on eBay...





Why might it be a fake? Well, there's no star and cross trademark, and there's no crown with the "GR" stamp. And if you believe the company's blurb from the 19th century, people were faking their products all the time.

But if it's real, it's clearly pre-1891 so the only GR that would match is George IV. The company's very first royal warrant to George IV was in 1821 or 1822 (I can't remember), which would suggest this dates from then to 1830. "Cutlers to His Majesty" (rather than "Their Majesties") fits in with the first warrant too.

I thought it was worth a £35 gamble (inc shipping), but it's a shame the original scales haven't survived.

I would say its real the tail style is around 1800. Very nice pickup.

I've never seen a "fake" razor and I've seen more than my fair share. It would cost as much to make a good fake as it would a real razor.

I agree with the above. Seems to me like faking a razor would be more trouble than it was worth, but then again, humans never cease to amaze me.

I faked a BBS shave one time...

If it is a pre-1891 certifiably fake, I would think that would make it a collector item. More valuable than the real thing, as rarer.

Thanks folks - and yes, hah, I hadn't consider a fake might be more desirable!

It doesn't look like it should need much honing - so hopefully I'll be shaving with it before very long.

Looks like a good score to me as well. I doubt it's a fake. Anyone faking the JR&Sons razors back in the day were way more likely to have copied the 1840-1890 models, not the pre-1830 stuff.

johnmrson said:

I've never seen a "fake" razor and I've seen more than my fair share. It would cost as much to make a good fake as it would a real razor.

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+1. If I was going to create something fake to sell and make money I'd certainly choose something with a higher value. The price of this item wouldn't justify the time and effort it would take to create a fake.

johnmrson said:

I've never seen a "fake" razor and I've seen more than my fair share. It would cost as much to make a good fake as it would a real razor.

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dfoulk said:

+1. If I was going to create something fake to sell and make money I'd certainly choose something with a higher value. The price of this item wouldn't justify the time and effort it would take to create a fake.

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I am pretty sure the OP was referring to the trend back when those were brand new on the shelves in stores type razors, that there were fakes going around. Just like we see current fakes of popular pocket knives all over the place for a tiny fraction of the cost of a real one.

Shave_Rat said:

I am pretty sure the OP was referring to the trend back when those were brand new on the shelves in stores type razors, that there were fakes going around. Just like we see current fakes of popular pocket knives all over the place for a tiny fraction of the cost of a real one.

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Yes indeed - people were making their own competing goods at the time and marking them dishonestly to pass them off as being produced by more desirable competitors.

Also at the time when these were made, a razor may have been more dear to the purchaser. Probably several days wages.

Is the razor a frameback missing the back, or just a very unusual spine?

Mike H said:

Is the razor a frameback missing the back, or just a very unusual spine?

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It looks like an unusual spine on a near wedge...

looks like almost a wedge, decorated spine, with a stubtail. looks like earely 1800s to me.
i doubt people would make fakes, especially as complex as this one. If they wanted to make a fake, they could have made a more generic looking razor.

Cool blade.

It arrived today and it's pretty nice

There's actually a hint of the GR crown, but the strike has missed because it's right in the indentation along the decorated spine.

Someone has put a bit of restoration work into it and it's shinier than it looked in the listing, but it's not been overdone. It's not quite shave-ready for me, but it's not far off it.

I'd assumed the scales were modern plastic replacements, but they're not - they're horn with a lead wedge, and they've had a number of nibbles quite nicely smoothed and polished. The pins are obviously replacements.

Although they look like vintage scales, I still have my doubts whether they're original - the pointed ends and their flatness don't associate with that era in my mind.

But anyway, a fair bit better overall than I was expecting!

After a bit more examination, it looks like it's been honed on a relatively low grit hone judging by the bevel scratches, but it doesn't look like it will need much work to get it shave ready.

Measuring it, it's between 11/16 and 6/8 from the back of the spine.

And here's some some higher-res photos...

I would love to have seen the original scales and/or set that came from. That would have been an expensive blade in its day. It looks much better in your pics than those posted by the seller.Congrats!

Very nice!! Congrats!