BBW as a one-hone?

I posted this up on another site. Most of the responses I received felt more like a platform for everyone to express their opinion on their favorite stone rather than responding - I'd like to steer clear of that.


> Could a Belgian Blue Whetstone be used as a "one-hone" solution to maintaining a blade? Or, rather, use a BBW as a one/only hone for life (with a Coti-slurry stone)?


Perhaps I've read too much into the Coticles.be article comparing results between BBW, Coticle and Coticle/BBW stones on straight razors but I want to put it out there. Yet many websites list it as a 4000-grit equivalent stone - as though they intentionally want to sway opinion away from it. Yet so many users love their Coti rocks as the one-and-only.
(Link to study: http://coticule.be/heritage.html?fil.../BBW-study.pdf or http://www.coticule.be/the-cafeteria/topic/1452.html)

From all that I've read: it's functionally similar composition as coticle though slower due to the lower garnet content. I would assume that make it easier for new users from causing damage but, based on the results, could still equal the final output of more expensive stones like the Coti.

Are there users that use a BBW to refresh their blades?


I'm not talking about honing from dull but just keeping things going.

It could be a one hone solution but not one I would choose...

Ive never fisnished on the BBW side of my coticules but I hear it is very possible. I am going to have to try myself. Im usre someone will chime in. Great question though and Im subscribed!

In my very limited experience with my single natural combo La Petite Blanche coti I would say "yes" - and in my case it was a bit easier since the coti side is fast enough to cause a beginner, like me, issues with auto slurry i.e. needs to be done with running water.

Have also broached this subject a couple of times here and consensus seems to be that it will do the job but slower without the romance. That is what ultimately convinced me to go with a coti - the fact that I would always be curious about what I am missing and visually there is just more variety. Also not much difference in price if you are willing to settle for a smaller coti - but if you want a big piece of real estate the BBW is waaaay cheaper.

At the moment busy fighting the urge to get a Les Lat ... curiosity again.

Try unicot on BBw

GaryGary

SpikedLemon said:

I posted this up on another site. Most of the responses I received felt more like a platform for everyone to express their opinion on their favorite stone rather than responding - I'd like to steer clear of that.


> Could a Belgian Blue Whetstone be used as a "one-hone" solution to maintaining a blade? Or, rather, use a BBW as a one/only hone for life (with a Coti-slurry stone)?


Perhaps I've read too much into the Coticles.be article comparing results between BBW, Coticle and Coticle/BBW stones on straight razors but I want to put it out there. Yet many websites list it as a 4000-grit equivalent stone - as though they intentionally want to sway opinion away from it. Yet so many users love their Coti rocks as the one-and-only.
(Link to study: http://coticule.be/heritage.html?fil.../BBW-study.pdf or http://www.coticule.be/the-cafeteria/topic/1452.html)

From all that I've read: it's functionally similar composition as coticle though slower due to the lower garnet content. I would assume that make it easier for new users from causing damage but, based on the results, could still equal the final output of more expensive stones like the Coti.

Are there users that use a BBW to refresh their blades?


I'm not talking about honing from dull but just keeping things going.

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Your going to get pretty much the same answers here you got there. It probably could be done but there are much better options.

I've not used coticule slurry on a Belgian Blue, I have used Belgian Blue slurry on a Belgian Blue. It can refresh an edge. I would keep in mind that all Belgian Blues are not created equal and there's a reason so many users love their coticules as one stone solutions, the site's not called belgianblue.be.

The speed difference is not so much an advantage to the beginner imo, more likely a disadvantage. More stokes = more margin for error and a little error could take a long time to correct on the Belgians Blues I've used.

Yes you can, no I wouldn't.

hig789 said:

Your going to get pretty much the same answers here you got there. It probably could be done but there are much better options.

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IMHO, this site is more open to positive, constructive, feedback and less conjecture.

I totally agree with you there. It's much more open minded here. All I was saying is that there are much better options for a touch up stone. For not much more money you could get a coticule bout and and have the option down the road to hone from start to finish on if you want. Or for a bit more get a natural combo and try out the BBW on ot.

If you have a shave ready coticule edge, why not maintain it with a coticule?

SpikedLemon said:

I posted this up on another site. Most of the responses I received felt more like a platform for everyone to express their opinion on their favorite stone rather than responding - I'd like to steer clear of that....


> Could a Belgian Blue Whetstone be used as a "one-hone" solution to maintaining a blade? Or, rather, use a BBW as a one/only hone for life (with a Coti-slurry stone)?
....


I'm not talking about honing from dull but just keeping things going.

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Yes.
Many of us forget that honing is also about pressure and speed. Too much emphasis is put on different grit stones and grit ratings. You can finish on a coticule (yellow or blue) using clear water, soapy water or oil while decreasing pressure and speed leading to edges that are fine, keen and smooth. Yes it takes some skill to develop the proper stroke and in my opinion it's worth it.

If the blade begins to tug I would build a light slurry using light pressure and normal speed strokes, then use clear water using no pressure and slower laps. This can be followed by oil or soapy water for a finer edge.

Just curious, why are you so intent on using BBW?

hig789 said:

Just curious, why are you so intent on using BBW?

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Dunno about the OP, but as for me, it's kinda the same reason we are here and not on a "cartridges and goop" forum, just wanna be different.

aephilli said:

Dunno about the OP, but as for me, it's kinda the same reason we are here and not on a "cartridges and goop" forum, just wanna be different.

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lol yeah I get that part of it.

I do have one piece of BBW that is very fast. But it is mixed with coticule. That's about the only time I have messed with my BBW backed stones very much. Didn't really do it for me.

aephilli said:

Dunno about the OP, but as for me, it's kinda the same reason we are here and not on a "cartridges and goop" forum, just wanna be different.

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This and the fact that I haven't been able to make anything work and am trying everything I can.

I have got some very good edges off bbw.If you spend the time,surely you will get there and get good results,I don't believe it would take a very long time to go from breadknife to hht.I have done it and got some great shaves.If you have big chips in the edge you'd want a faster stone,but to maintain an edge thats shaving good it should work well.

hig789 said:

Just curious, why are you so intent on using BBW?

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I'm just curious and search didn't find anything that answered it. Wondered if anyone uses or used a bbw

I haven't taken a razor from bevel to finish on a BBW (did get a sharp finish, though), but Bart (coticule.be) says it can be done. So does Jarrod (SuperiorShave). I've also read somewhere that folks in Germany use them with razors much more extensively than here, using them as the only hone.

Myself, I've finished a razor on BBW a couple of times and the edge was really good. Passed HHT off the hone, albeit felt a little crispy. It definitely cuts, but slower than a coticule.

It's funny you mentioned the other forum. I happened upon that thread earlier today and had a few chuckles. One thing about forums (that one, this one, - all of them) is that occasionally their collective wisdoms don't align with reality, so you have to use judgement. I've seen too many posts to count from back a few years ago claiming that Arkansas stones aren't suitable for razors. We all know what happened to that notion. Now that on it's own doesn't prove that BBWs work, but when you have one group of people claiming they've done it successfully and then another group denying the hone's merits while trying to upsell you on another rock, you begin to wonder.

At the price, you can hardly go wrong. Besides, you could learn it and show all of us that it can be done. I imagine that a lot of people out there are asking the same question. With prices of sharpening stones these days, we could all use a cheaper option while keeping it natural.

I've shaved straight off a BBW after using a BBW slurry stone and finishing with water (dilucot, in effect), and I got a pretty reasonable shave.

I think it would be a bit slow for bevel setting - although I haven't actually tried it.

Update:

Passed HHT off the hone, albeit felt a little crispy

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Yeah, crispy - that's a good word to describe it.

Guesstimating said:

.....
It's funny you mentioned the other forum. I happened upon that thread earlier today and had a few chuckles. ....

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Laughing at them, not with them, am I right?

Yes, the great CBE conspiracy

Well I posted on that other thread at that other forum telling you about an experiment I did. I don't think anyone was telling you anything different then people at this forum. For the most part every one said it can be done but why. I mostly use arkansas stones. Every one tells me they are slow but thats because most people don't use a full ark progression and they don't know how to use them. Yeah I could get an 8x3 BBW for the price of a small coti but if the stone is a quarter as fast as a coti and half as much bigger that extra few square inches isn't doing you anything. The purpose of my experiment was to learn how to use a bunch of different stones while throwing all my honing knowledge at it. I tried it even with oil. It was a crispy version of a coticule shave if I had to sum it up. I would rather a coticule shave. Being as it is much faster and smoother. Then only reason in my opinion to get a bbw instead would be to save money and be willing to sacrifice for smoothness and speed. Atleast with my arks I sacrifice a little speed but get extreme smoothness almost mushy feel. I am not saying to get a coti instead, get whatever you want. Its your money use it how you want it. I am not trying to convince you to buy a coticule either. I don't prefer to finish off my coticule either and it was picked by Jarrod to be a final finisher and it is. I prefer my arks.

Any ways short answer is to where you said only hone for life is, yes. You could go from bevel set to shave ready on the finest and slowest of hones as long as you are patient.