Lapping Help needed

**Mr_Sparkle** · 03-05-2008, 11:03 AM

Hi Guys,

As you know Im new to all this, and have just bought a norton 4/8 K, Chinese 12K and a stone pond.

I know that I need to flatten / lap both stones but am trying to not spend much more!!!

SO, my stone pond comes with some lapping stuff, but im not sure if its just a gimmick of if it will really do the job,

could you take a look for me - its about midway down the page and let me know if i will be able to flatten my norton and 12k using what they describe as...."* Safety-glass top with PSA-backed laminate & 90x silicon-carbide compound for lapping stones * Glass is guaranteed to be flat enough to lap to a flatness better than 0.001" of stone *"

http://www.woodworkingcentreshop.co....harpening.html

Please let me know guys, if I HAVE to buy a seperate lapping stone I will, the priority is not ruining my razor or stones.

Thanks

John

**FloppyShoes** · 03-05-2008, 11:36 AM

I think 90 grit is way too corse for lapping hones, expecially the fine ones. To get a good, glassy smooth surface on the chinese 12k, you'll need something finer. I personally use the norton flatening stone to level my stones, I then use the norton (both sides) to polish the chinese 12k further. This smooths out the 8k and 12k and doesn't remove material fast enough to really affect the flatness of the hones.

Some users advocate using a medium or fine diamond hone to flatten. While I've never tried it, it sounds like a good idea. It also provides you with a nice corse hone for your razors.

Flatness is important, but I find that smoothness is also paramount. Using other fine hones or wet/dry sandpaper to smooth your already flatened hones makes a difference (I find). Just make sure that if you smooth hone-on-hone, that both hones are flat to start with.

**Bruce** · 03-05-2008, 03:16 PM

John,

If you got the Norton hone new, there ought to have been a pamphlet with the stone mentioning something about truing it. I believe Norton recommends using 220 grit wet/dry sandpaper to get it flat and 600 to finish the hone to a nice, smooth surface. The key is using plenty of water to float as much crud away as possible and placing the sandpaper on as flat a surface as you can find. Plate glass is good, a granite surface plate is superb. Irregularities in the lapping medium will cause irregularities in the lapped medium, that's why in lappping - the flatter more, the better more. Lots of water and a figure 8 stroke is best. If not that then forth and back and circles, then swap ends on the hone, etc, etc. This turning the stone 180 degress will help to even out the unequal forces your hand will always impose.

**ouch** · 03-05-2008, 03:39 PM

According to Joel, who knows his way around hones, the Chinese stone is a bear to flatten.

**Ookla The Mok** · 03-05-2008, 03:43 PM

I just lapped my chinese 12k on a D8C, and it is, in fact, a bear to flatten.

**ouch** · 03-05-2008, 03:55 PM

Originally Posted by Ookla The Mok

I just lapped my chinese 12k on a D8C, and it is, in fact, a bear to flatten.

And that D8C handles my Shaptons, including the very hard GlassStone series, without breaking a sweat.

**matt** · 03-05-2008, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by ouch

And that D8C handles my Shaptons, including the very hard GlassStone series, without breaking a sweat.

The D8C is the best way to lap a hone period. It leaves the smoothest surface. It works wonders on my Norton and leaves the flattening stone in the dust.

**ouch** · 03-05-2008, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by matt

The D8C is the best way to lap a hone period. It leaves the smoothest surface. It works wonders on my Norton and leaves the flattening stone in the dust.

True. At ~$35, it's a bargain, as it can do double duty establishing a bevel on knives, too. Unlike a stone fixer, it won't lose its shape.

**Mr_Sparkle** · 03-06-2008, 04:40 AM

OK I did it and just ordered a D8C!!!

God this has all ended up costing me MUCH more than I origionally thought it would when I wanted to start straight shaving!!!

Ok so I now have a Norton Combination 4000/8000, a Chinese 12K and D8C to lap with, so finally that SHOULD be all my kit I need.

I just need to learn how to use it now!!!!!!

How often should I be re-lapping my Norton and Chinese after there initial lapping?

Also I bought a stone pond to keep it all in, is it ok to keep everything permantly under water in the stond pond for storage? Or will this cause something to disintegrate / warp etc?

If you dont recommend perminant under water storage how should I store all the equipment?

Thanks,

John

**joke1176** · 03-06-2008, 05:01 AM

Originally Posted by Mr_Sparkle

OK I did it and just ordered a D8C...

How often should I be re-lapping my Norton and Chinese after there initial lapping?...
Thanks,

John

The norton should be lightly re-lapped after every use, it wears pretty quickly and is easy to maintain if you stay on it. I don't have the 12k, but if it's as hard as reputed, you shouldn't need to re-lap it even after years of daily use.

Basically, the easier it is to lap in the first place, the faster it wears out. Hope this helps.

**FloppyShoes** · 03-06-2008, 06:55 AM

Originally Posted by Mr_Sparkle

Also I bought a stone pond to keep it all in, is it ok to keep everything permantly under water in the stond pond for storage? Or will this cause something to disintegrate / warp etc?

If you dont recommend perminant under water storage how should I store all the equipment?

Don't store the norton in water. Let it air dry after use, then put it back in the case and store it somewhere cool and dry. Same goes for the other stones.

There's been more than one case of the combo stones coming apart or crumbling from over-soaking.

Personally, I use a 10"x14" plastic tub to soak my stones before use and to store them afterwards (empty and dry). During use I have a small sprayer I got at the dollar store to keep things wet.

**Mr_Sparkle** · 03-06-2008, 09:12 AM

Thanks for all the replys - and thanks Dan for the tip on storage. When I read Joel describe the composition of the combination stone, I did wonder if they would over soak and fall apart.

Great news my chinese 12k and stone pond arrived today and both are EXCELLENT!

I was worried that the 12k would not be the right one but its identical to the ones in the pics on the board.

Also the stone pond is amazing - I would recommned it as a good way to keep the mess down, all in one unit and a lid for storage, but Ill be draining it after use now. I diddnt really like the idea of rancid water sitting about for up to 2 months on end in between honing.

Thanks guys, your advice as always is priceless.

**Sticky** · 03-06-2008, 02:40 PM

After some initial use, your D8C will wear-in (cut finer) and discolor a bit. Won't really hurt it any as long as you rinse & wipe (I use my hand), and dry before storage. At odd intervals I use Comet and a Scotch-Brite pad or nylon bristle brush to clean it better.