Trying My Hand at Honing.

Gamma · Mar 1, 2014

There's no need to sweat the degree of polish on the stone too much.
I lap my Jnats to 600x. I stopped lapping past that mark that a good while ago.
I've left more than a few stones lapped to 325x without issue also.
Usually, the stones will break in from use to a much higher degree than you'll get with any type of sandpaper, and that happens fairly quickly.
Most importantly, I've found, is that the surface is continuous across the top - not spotted with glossy and matte areas.

After 600x, I usually use a large Tomo to clear the possibility of errant particles from the sandpaper being stuck in the stone.

jasonb8736 · Mar 1, 2014

I don't have any naguras. But I do have the one that came with my chosera 1000 for cleaning it.

global_dev · Mar 1, 2014

That's a soft 600 which is not a slurry but refresher. It could work, I soak mine until the sounds/bubbles stop.

jasonb8736 · Mar 1, 2014

global_dev said:
That's a soft 600 which is not a slurry but refresher. It could work, I soak mine until the sounds/bubbles stop.

Yes. I believe the instructions from the website say not to use it as a honing nagura. It's supposed to be used to clean the surface of the stone if there's build up.

Slash McCoy · Mar 2, 2014

Not much else I can think of except that an 8k Nani can be finessed into making a pretty darn good edge, especially if you use lather, and progressively lighten your pressure until at the end your razor is barely contacting the stone at all, just floating on the lather. If you cant shave off your 8k even a Norton 8k, not much point in a finisher. Max out each stone in your progression. Sounds like you at least got a nice bevel... thats good. Gammas jnat advice sounds solid, though I am not a jnat guy. Ill say this tho... if you are using a dmt to make slurry, for finishing you need to first break down that slurry, not just dilute it. The particles get finer and finer as you work it. But a proper slurry stone is gonna be better right from the start. You should be able to pick up a tomo pretty cheap from a member. Some of these rock rubbers got enough rocks to pave a patio.

jasonb8736 · Mar 2, 2014

Slash McCoy said:
Not much else I can think of except that an 8k Nani can be finessed into making a pretty darn good edge, especially if you use lather, and progressively lighten your pressure until at the end your razor is barely contacting the stone at all, just floating on the lather. If you cant shave off your 8k even a Norton 8k, not much point in a finisher. Max out each stone in your progression. Sounds like you at least got a nice bevel... thats good. Gammas jnat advice sounds solid, though I am not a jnat guy. Ill say this tho... if you are using a dmt to make slurry, for finishing you need to first break down that slurry, not just dilute it. The particles get finer and finer as you work it. But a proper slurry stone is gonna be better right from the start. You should be able to pick up a tomo pretty cheap from a member. Some of these rock rubbers got enough rocks to pave a patio.

Indeed they do! I've experimented a bit with setting the bevel on the Chosera 1000, then laps on the 3000 and 8000, then 1u film followed by 1u film over paper. That's been my best edge so far. I've been so swamped with family and work I haven't tinkered with my JNat lately. This summer I plan to hone on razor on film, one on synthetics, and one on the JNat and compare shaves. Not the best indicator due to my inexperience but still a potentially fun little challenge.

Gamma · Mar 2, 2014

Slash McCoy said:
for finishing you need to first break down that slurry, not just dilute it.

This

jasonb8736 · Mar 3, 2014

Gamma said:
This

And to break down the slurry, I just keep doing laps, correct?

Sharpchef · Mar 3, 2014

And to break down the slurry, I just keep doing laps, correct?

After a while, you can break down slurry with a kitchenknife flank, and continue honing with the razor on broken slurry.

greets Sebastian.

CanonSterVa · Mar 3, 2014

Sharpchef said:
After a while, you can break down slurry with a kitchenknife flank, and continue honing with the razor on broken slurry.

greets Sebastian.

Interesting Idea!

Gamma · Mar 3, 2014

jasonb8736 said:
And to break down the slurry, I just keep doing laps, correct?

Basically, yes.
You won't need to pre-pulverize it - just hone with it.
No doubt you'll need to learn a bit about how to work it; pressure is a delicate concern but I usually start off with 'some' pressure and lighten up as I go. Once the process begins, it pretty much takes care of itself. The main thing is to keep the consistency wet without really thinning it out.

jasonb8736 · Mar 4, 2014

I dulled one of my razors and tried my Jnat again. I'm pretty sure it didn't finish well. I was shaving arm hair but no real treetopping going on. I'm going to keep watching vids on jnat honing. I was feeling the blade sticking to the stone which is good, I think. I'm still trying to figure out how much pressure to use and when to let up.

Gamma · Mar 4, 2014

You'll get 'there' - takes a few trials and some practice.
You should be able to see the edge undercutting the slurry well - all across the blade.

Tonight, I spent a good 20 minutes on Tomo slurry alone. 7 inch stone, mostly x and rolling strokes.
The Tomo in question makes slurry that takes forever to break. Maybe 4 spritzes of water along the way when it got too thick.
Started off with what you might call 'finger-weight' pressure and lightened up way later on.

jasonb8736 · Mar 4, 2014

I could see the blade was definitely undercutting the slurry. I checked using the thumbnail test and I think the bevel was set. That's a start. I'm forcing myself to shave off the 8000 naniwa until I get it right. I was tempted to cheat and use some 1u film but resisted. Lol

Gamma · Mar 4, 2014

Try different techniques, but don't make a lot of big changes all at once.
You'll get it - one thing though, was the stone bought from a user or a seller?
I mean - was it known to be a good stone and working well with that Tomo?
Just curious.

jasonb8736 · Mar 5, 2014

Gamma said:
Try different techniques, but don't make a lot of big changes all at once.
You'll get it - one thing though, was the stone bought from a user or a seller?
I mean - was it known to be a good stone and working well with that Tomo?
Just curious.

I bought the jnat new from a vendor. Fendrihan. I use a DMT card with it instead of a tomo at this point.

jasonb8736 · Mar 5, 2014

I shaved with my Whipped Dog straight today. I dulled it yesterday and set the bevel on the Chosera 1000 then did laps on the Naniwa 3000/8000. I wasn't getting any HHT results so I gave it a bunch of laps on the 1u film until I was getting the HHT to catch and pop. I gave the razor 5 or so laps on CrOx before stropping on the leather and it was a pretty good shave. Still not at the level where my razors from Whipped Dog and Buca were at...but I'm getting there.

I will eventually tackle the jnat again. I watched a few vids from Doc on youtube and I think I can improve from that.

jasonb8736 · Mar 5, 2014

If anyone is reading this, can you send me a link to the best jnat (with DMT card) honing video they know of? I'd like to watch how a blade is taken from no bevel to shave ready. I'm getting closer, but still a day late and a dollar short with the razors.

Chaloney · Mar 5, 2014

Doc226 has some good vids on his website. Once you follow them to YouTube you can find the rest of his channel. Look for the ones with someone's name in the title. The ones I watched showed using a DMT card on a jnat to a finished edge. Very helpful

Gamma · Mar 5, 2014

IIRC, you were honing on synths to 8k, then wanting to use the Ozuku to finish.

In that case, if you're maxed out on 8k, your time on the Ozuku isn't going to be all that long unless it's super hard and/or void of abrasive content. That can happen with inexpensive stones, but not often.
Anyhoo....
Any video showing you finishing technique should shed some light.
Feedback is what it is, hard to impart that on the viewer in a video.

one thing that I'm going to guess at - your time on the 3k isn't nearly close to being enough.
If - and that's a big if - the bevel is set right, you may be cutting your bevel refinement short.
Me - I can spend a lot of time on a 3k... depends on the blade though.

If you're seeing a lot of swarf on the 8k you're 3k work wasn't 'there'.

The 8k should be less than 30 passes. Then Tomo slurry on the Jnat.

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Trying My Hand at Honing.

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