Japanese knife for hard ingredients. Suggestions?

Hi all,

I have recently upgraded some of the kitchen knifes to Japanese western equivalents. I first bought a Kagayaki VG-10 Gyuto 240mm. This knife came with a warning not to cut anything hard, like pumpkin, due to the hardness of the steel and the chance of chipping the blade I guess. The blade is advertised as HRc60-61.

I have also ordered some of the BB group buy knives. Another Gyuto, the Nakiri and the 2 Petty's. I may have missed it but I am not sure of the hardness of these knives. Whilst I am not 100% sure I assume that they will be around the same hardness as the Kagayaki since they are both VG-10 stainless and therefore not suitable for hard food, like pumpkin.

Reading between the lines, I am assuming that because the Japanese knives seem to be thinner and the steel harder then they are unsuitable for hard ingredients. I stand to be corrected.

So my question is, what do Japanese people use to cut their pumpkin?

Would a carbon steel Japanese knife be better (ie softer)?

I have started looking at a cleaver, but some of the prices are out of my price range ($300) and I am unsure if this is the way to go.

Suggestions appreciated.

Dave

Serrated knifes work nice. I keep my old german knife around for occasions like that also.

What are you using your pumpkin for?

Chinese cleaver cheap, cheerful, effective

For the really tough work, a yo-deba is the way to go. Short of that, YetiDave's cleaver suggestion is hard to beat.

I use a Zakuri 240 gyuto kurouchi in blue #1 for the hard tough stuff. Don't know the hardness and don't care.
http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/kitchen-knives/zakuri/zakuri-240mm-blue-1-kurouchi-gyuto.html

I'd be afraid of chipping an edge with a deba which I reserve for fish.

pipeliner said:

So my question is, what do Japanese people use to cut their pumpkin?

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That's not sharp. In fact, he had to borrow my knife to slice that tree in half.

I don't think you are going to chip anything on a pumpkin, though, OP... I think they are talking mostly about bone, etc... when they say it could chip your knife... or as a warning not to cut on a hard surface. Cleavers and debas will be for stuff with bones. The Chinese vegetable cleaver (or just about any knife) is fine for a pumpkin, but not bone.

My Japanese knives all say "for professional use only". I had to start charging my wife and friends a fortune to make dinner ever since I got them.....

Drybonz said:

I don't think you are going to chip anything on a pumpkin, though, OP... I think they are talking mostly about bone, etc... when they say it could chip your knife... or as a warning not to cut on a hard surface. Cleavers and debas will be for stuff with bones. The Chinese vegetable cleaver (or just about any knife) is fine for a pumpkin, but not bone.

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This seems right to me. However my guess is such a knife would be more likely to break if used in a twisting motion to force sides of a pumpkin apart. On the other hand . . . to me thinner seems less likely to bind.

Does anybody have some personal experience?

Alacrity59 said:

This seems right to me. However my guess is such a knife would be more likely to break if used in a twisting motion to force sides of a pumpkin apart. On the other hand . . . to me thinner seems less likely to bind.

Does anybody have some personal experience?

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I use my my Chinese cleaver to cut watermelon, cantelope, etc... it slices them like butter. I have never tried a pumpkin but I'm quite sure it's fine. If we are talking about carving a jack o'lantern, a person would definitely want a gyoto size to cut the top and maybe a paring knife, or something like that to do more intricate cuts... but it's not going to chip the knives. There's nothing hard enough inside a pumpkin to do that.

As Mike mentioned, above, however... you definitely don't want to be twisting your good knives trying to pry stuff, etc.

*edit* Also, as far as the cost of a vegetable cleaver ($300 mentioned in OP), you can get a great cleaver for $30-40. If you want to spend $300 and up, they are out there, but not necessary.

Thanks for all the replies

YetiDave said:

Chinese cleaver cheap, cheerful, effective

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I was leaning this way myself, just a cheap one, so I can learn to sharpen as well and not worry too much about destroying it.

ChefJohnBoy-ardee said:

What are you using your pumpkin for?

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Just cutting up pumpkin for roast vegetable and soup.

ouch said:

For the really tough work, a yo-deba is the way to go. Short of that, YetiDave's cleaver suggestion is hard to beat.

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Thanks! I have googled the yo-deba and it sounds like exactly what I need.

Drybonz said:

I don't think you are going to chip anything on a pumpkin, though, OP... I think they are talking mostly about bone, etc... when they say it could chip your knife... or as a warning not to cut on a hard surface. Cleavers and debas will be for stuff with bones. The Chinese vegetable cleaver (or just about any knife) is fine for a pumpkin, but not bone.

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Correct, I assume the warning is more to warn people about breaking up chickens and rabbits and such, because of the bones. However it specifically mentioned pumpkin which caught me by surprise. Hence the question.

It appears that the solution is a yo-deba or cleaver for the heavy duty work, like chicken, rabbits and dare I say it pumpkin. I might just have to try both!

Roast the pumpkin whole

Now you guys are making me hungry for pumpkin pie and pumpkin soup.

People used to not like being around me because I would come up with good recipe ideas or something in mild conversation. They always left hungry.