Keeping the moisture in is the main reason for the covered CI. (alternative to a water filled bowl)
I guess over proofing is a possibility but it's only rising for a hour.... (after final mix) I'll keep after it... Thanks.
Ken
Tartine Bread
- Thread starter Sullybob
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Keeping the moisture in is the main reason for the covered CI. (alternative to a water filled bowl)
I guess over proofing is a possibility but it's only rising for a hour.... (after final mix) I'll keep after it... Thanks.
Ken
I only usually final proof my loaves for 45 minutes now, it all depends on atmospheric temp
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- #23
Ken,
I have read that you should add a level tablespooof gluten for every 600 grams of ww flour.
I have read that you should add a level tablespooof gluten for every 600 grams of ww flour.
Great thread, gents. The pictorial is very helpful, Shawn, and the discussion is excellent. I became intrigued with the Tartine method after (while?) listening to the audiobook of Michael Pollan's "Cooked." It's a great read and goes into all of the background about how the method works, sourdough, the bugs in it, etc.
I tried Jim Lahey's method first, and got fair results, with little oven spring, but great taste. I've been nurturing a sourdough culture for a year, and had limited success baking with it, but now that I've figured out shaving
, I'm ready to direct my attentions to bread baking.
I tried Jim Lahey's method first, and got fair results, with little oven spring, but great taste. I've been nurturing a sourdough culture for a year, and had limited success baking with it, but now that I've figured out shaving
, I'm ready to direct my attentions to bread baking.- Thread starter
- #26
Thanks Bob. I've tried several no knead type breads, with very limited results. Usually the crust looks great but it's really tough and I don't get much oven spring and the crumb is so dense that it's almost inedible. Have you read Chad Robertson's method for sourdough? It's very different than any other sourdough I've ever read about.
This is the method I used to start my sourdough, click here for the second half of the article. I found that using pineapple juice really helpful to get the starter going.
I think that creating a leaven first and using that for what ever I'm trying to bake is going to make a huge difference in the quality of my naturally leavened biscuits, pancakes, waffles, etc. In the past I was adding straight sourdough starter to an existing recipe and they were pretty much all a uniform flop, they didn't rise very much, if at all and they were very sour.
This is the method I used to start my sourdough, click here for the second half of the article. I found that using pineapple juice really helpful to get the starter going.
I think that creating a leaven first and using that for what ever I'm trying to bake is going to make a huge difference in the quality of my naturally leavened biscuits, pancakes, waffles, etc. In the past I was adding straight sourdough starter to an existing recipe and they were pretty much all a uniform flop, they didn't rise very much, if at all and they were very sour.
That looks really nice.
there is NOTHING like "real" bread.
there is NOTHING like "real" bread.
I haven't tried the tartine method but I'm stuck in my ways of a two day poulish to loaf. I want to try a tartine but I have not. One day...
I became intrigued with the Tartine method after (while?) listening to the audiobook of Michael Pollan's "Cooked." It's a great read and goes into all of the background about how the method works, sourdough, the bugs in it, etc.
I tried Jim Lahey's method first, and got fair results, with little oven spring, but great taste. I've been nurturing a sourdough culture for a year, and had limited success baking with it, but now that I've figured out shaving
Funny, Bob... Pretty much my path also, well, I read the Kindle "Cooked". I can't seem to focus on audio books. My attention wanders and I pop back in going "wait, what happened? How'd we get here?" But aside from technology, that was my path, with the addition that "Cooked" was followed by "Whole Grain Breads" & "Tartine" But I'm seriously excited to read Tartine 3 (skipped 2)
Ken
Pollan describes it pretty well in "Cooked" along with his own, slightly modified version.
Ken
Chad's sounds pretty standard, aside from cooking it in cast iron - there's the usual grow the starter, develop gluten and yeast/bacteria, proof and bake. I think pretty much every leavened bread follows the same formula, just timings and measurements can differ
I cheated with my starter, having received King Arthur Flour's as a birthday gift last year. It's robust and I haven't had a lick of trouble maintaining it. The issues I had baking with it are really a problem with my own expectations. I'm used to bread rising on a pretty reliable schedule when using commercial yeast, but all bets are off with sourdough. In fact, the biggest thing I took away from Cooked and Lahey's book is the need to be flexible, giving the dough more time (sometimes hours more) to get it where you want it to be. This is more intermediate to advanced baking, and it's still a work in progress for me.
Still, that loaf of bread from Lahey's method was head and shoulders above the stuff from the supermarket. I haven't bought Tartine yet, but tracked down the basic recipe online, and will give it a shot once I can master no knead.
Still, that loaf of bread from Lahey's method was head and shoulders above the stuff from the supermarket. I haven't bought Tartine yet, but tracked down the basic recipe online, and will give it a shot once I can master no knead.
Thanks guys, these really helped. I added 1.5 T gluten and only proofed it 45 minutes for this mornings loaf. What a difference. It actually looked like a boule this time! I think I still have to tweak hydration and temps a bit, but it's getting there.
Ken
Can we get a pic? I've never added gluten to my loaves but I'd be interested in trying it
Unfortunately I didn't get one today.
I'll get you one next loaf. I seem to be on an every other day bake.
So not too far out.But I'll say, you could really feel how much stronger the dough was.
Ken
You want to watch out doing that, I managed to put on a stone when I got serious about baking 
I tend to make just one or two loaves a week now. I've got my year old sourdough starter working away on some flour now so I'll have my next loaf by tomorrow afternoon, I'm trying a 90% wholemeal / 10% rye (approximately) loaf so it'll be interesting to see how mine's risen in comparison to yours with the added gluten
I tend to make just one or two loaves a week now. I've got my year old sourdough starter working away on some flour now so I'll have my next loaf by tomorrow afternoon, I'm trying a 90% wholemeal / 10% rye (approximately) loaf so it'll be interesting to see how mine's risen in comparison to yours with the added glutenYou want to watch out doing that, I managed to put on a stone when I got serious about baking
I hear you. Interestingly, I've actually been dropping weight on this bread. So much fibre, I guess? Started at 307 six weeks ago, two weeks ago I was 300!
I need some of the flour that you're using 
I need some of the flour that you're using
I know, right? I keep trying to convince my wife. So far, no sale.
Ken
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- #40
Thanks for the tips guys.
I made some modifications to the technique based on recommendations you guys gave me.
I proofed the dough for the boule on parchment and instead of the 3-4 hour final proof that the book recommends I let it proof for about 45 minutes. I also used bread flour instead of AP flour. These changes made a huge difference in the quality of the bread. Instead of making a second boule I made two small sandwich loaves.
This batch of bread is much better than the first batch, for a number of reasons. The crust is still hard but it isn't as tough as the first batch. I think that the long final proof may have contributed to a drier crust which made it very tough and chewy. The oven spring on this batch was higher, I didn't have any trouble getting the boule into the CI so it didn't lose any volume.
The sandwich loaves are a bit misshapen. It will probably take me a few tries to dial in the shape and mass of the final loaf in order to have a uniform loaf.
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