I find my La Grise will produce smooth edges, but not really keen enough without some additional finishing (in my case usually 1um & 0.3um film and very light pressure). I am pretty sure my rock can produce better edges, I just don't have the technique at present time.
Fed up with la grise
- Thread starter Krodor
- Start date
i just used this la grise i'm sure it is la grise its just slightly beigier as apose greeny..its super slow with slurry and feels exact same as my other la grise...i used circle method light medium pressure and finished with x strokes slowly diluting ad stopped at misty slurryafter stropping i had a nice hht 3/4 even closer to holding point blonder hair passed . i'm sure thuse hones work well and they will leave a super mellow edge . i also think you will get an hht at a level 3/4 nearer holding point, even though this stone is slower with slurry the bevel was soon set with medium crcles and the razor easily shaved leg hair with rich milk like slurrythey certainly are not slurry dullers.... i don't think you need heavy pressure just use mdium to normal pressure and take your time (try circles ) I'll test this razor soon and let you no how it shaves ..
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Yes medium/normal pressure, like a eraser on paper. I was using very light pressure and it just didn't do anything until I increased the pressure a bit and from than on I got the results I was hoping for.
I use a lot of circles and dilute but not rinse the stone until there is just a hint of slurry left and finish with pigtail strokes (one circle at the end of the stone going into a X stroke, like you make the number 6 on the stone) with lighter and lighter pressure.
I'm certainly no expert but I'm happy to say I finally got my la grise to work the way I want it to, giving me superb edges that remove stubble with ease yet so smoothly that you don't feel it's sharp while using it.
I use a lot of circles and dilute but not rinse the stone until there is just a hint of slurry left and finish with pigtail strokes (one circle at the end of the stone going into a X stroke, like you make the number 6 on the stone) with lighter and lighter pressure.
I'm certainly no expert but I'm happy to say I finally got my la grise to work the way I want it to, giving me superb edges that remove stubble with ease yet so smoothly that you don't feel it's sharp while using it.
One more word of advice I would add for La Grise is not to hone razors with hard steel. If you try to take say a Heljestrand to a La Grise you will be honing until the end of time.
On another note, INOX and most Solingen steel will work nicely after you figure out the stone. I used to have a 50x150, that looking back I wish i would have kept. I could get a HHT 4 with it just like from my La Veinette. I was not used to the mellow edges so I thought the blades were dull, when in reality they were just as keen as edges from other veins.
My newer one is a *****. I have yet to get a good keen edge from it. I had mentioned to maurice once that I was having trouble and he told me to work slowly with the La Grise vein.
Krodor I would be happy to give your stone a try if you like. Gary and Rick can attest to the edges I get from a coticule, and they shave me very comfortably.
On another note, INOX and most Solingen steel will work nicely after you figure out the stone. I used to have a 50x150, that looking back I wish i would have kept. I could get a HHT 4 with it just like from my La Veinette. I was not used to the mellow edges so I thought the blades were dull, when in reality they were just as keen as edges from other veins.
My newer one is a *****. I have yet to get a good keen edge from it. I had mentioned to maurice once that I was having trouble and he told me to work slowly with the La Grise vein.
Krodor I would be happy to give your stone a try if you like. Gary and Rick can attest to the edges I get from a coticule, and they shave me very comfortably.
You can always make ten strokes on a barber hone and then finish on the la grise...
- Thread starter
- #26
Thanks for the tips guys. Hopefully this thread will be a good reference to others as well. I'll try these ideas out over the next several days and see how it goes.
On thing I noticed yesterday were these little...call them hangnails on the bevels of the stone surface. I picked at one with my fingernail yesterday fairly lightly and a "grain" of the rock fell apart into my fingers. This happened on two or three spots. Like it is crumbling. I'll bevel it again to get rid of the main hangnaily things, but has anyone seen that before on a coti? I swear I've not done anything weird to the rock...it's just that way.
On thing I noticed yesterday were these little...call them hangnails on the bevels of the stone surface. I picked at one with my fingernail yesterday fairly lightly and a "grain" of the rock fell apart into my fingers. This happened on two or three spots. Like it is crumbling. I'll bevel it again to get rid of the main hangnaily things, but has anyone seen that before on a coti? I swear I've not done anything weird to the rock...it's just that way.
By the bevel do you mean the chamfered edges?
- Thread starter
- #28
yup, sorry...the chamfered edges of the honing plane. I'll take some pictures later tonight and post.
i can imagine the razor to feel real dull yet remove stubble , this is typical of the most hardest of coticule s to master but rewarding when you do..
gary
So true Gary, it's almost as sharp as honed on my JNAT yet it feels kinda dull gliding on the face just because it's so smooth.
These la grises are a ***** to learn to use (I found my JNAT so much easier to figure out) but when it finally comes together and you can repeat it over and over again it's very rewarding.
Keep experimenting guys, don't give up on these la grises, they may be hard to figure out but they can give you great smooth edges!!
It is good to hear that I am not the only one having trouble getting a shaving edge off these La grises. I, like many, have been having a HELL of a time getting a shaving edge off of these. Slow is no joke about these razors. Setting the bevel with a slurry, the slurry will turn only a light grey. I have been using "Eraser" pressure and it was still hard to get. I used circles and 1/2 x strokes to set the bevel. Then slowly diluting the slurry and finished on lather and stone (thought I would try it out). I was slicing badger hair then stropped it and then could not slice anything any more. Looks like I need to work on my stropping technique a bit more.
Questions;
What is undercutting??
Hard steel?? I have two American razors and Wapi that gave me a hard time. Is this hard steel. I also have two german razor, Kropp and Dorko but these are my high end razors. Should i try the Kropp? Kind of scared to because I do not want to mess up the edge.
Questions;
What is undercutting??
Hard steel?? I have two American razors and Wapi that gave me a hard time. Is this hard steel. I also have two german razor, Kropp and Dorko but these are my high end razors. Should i try the Kropp? Kind of scared to because I do not want to mess up the edge.
The way I understand it is it's when the water/slurry sort of "rides up" the edge of the blade as you move it across the stone, which means that the blade is keen enough to "undercut" the liquid. If the blade were dull, then the liquid would just pass under the edge.
- Thread starter
- #33
If you do it right, your edge will slide right underneath the water in front of it when you are honing (I've found it to only be a good readout after the excess water post-wetting has been honed-away). If there are areas of the edge that undercut and areas that don't (where water would ball up in front), keep going. That non-undercut area will eventually start undercutting...that's the good stuff. Its not a perfect measure, but if you have undercut, and it moves from that to balling up in front, you know you went backwards.
here's a picture showing a chunk missing that I flaked out last night:
stick fingernail in there and give a very light tug and you get this:
after chamfering a bit to get rid of the bumps (to minimize flakes), you can see a little piece missing at the corner:
currently the edge/chamfer is smooth, but I'm worried since it looks like there are just flakes waiting to happen:
- Thread starter
- #34
I'll experiment until there is nothing left of the rock. But lemme tell you, I do admit to whipping out my norton 4k/8k and 3/1micron lapping films last night, spending about 20 mins tops and bob's-yer-uncle, HHT3-4 right away pre-strop. Dang that was easy. Gave me my confidence back that I'm not crazy.
- Thread starter
- #35
tried that. doesn't work. finishing on my la grise kills the edge, unless you know the secret, which I'm finding I don't know consistently.
- Thread starter
- #36
I think that's next.
yeah, I suppose that's extreme.
you know, I don't think I did. Maybe I should explain: I have a personal HHT standard that if I can't get the hair (I have a large chunk of daughter's hair from a haircut) to pop pre-stropping, the shave is not as nice as it could be. In the past from other rocks, if I just get it to violin/shake like crazy, but get it to pop hair post stropping, the shave isn't quite as good. With this Coti, I can get it to violin pre-strop, and get it to pop a hair post strop barely, and the shave is not satisfying (in the show-off-the-coti posting, you notice I said I got an edge from it was going to try the next day...it wasn't good).
I'll try the shave off the last-slurry dilution and see how it goes.
Lots of options here guys, thanks. Will give me things to try over the next couple weeks.
Whoa! Those pics are crazy Krodor! I mean I know my La Grise is soft but for it to flake like that? I wonder if mine will do that after some more use? I'm still new to the whole thing so my stone hasn't seen too much use yet. Is that common for La Grises to flake like that?
- Thread starter
- #38
Id send Maurice those pictures. I wouldnt keep a hone that is going to crumble.
If you do it right, your edge will slide right underneath the water in front of it when you are honing (I've found it to only be a good readout after the excess water post-wetting has been honed-away). If there are areas of the edge that undercut and areas that don't (where water would ball up in front), keep going. That non-undercut area will eventually start undercutting...that's the good stuff. Its not a perfect measure, but if you have undercut, and it moves from that to balling up in front, you know you went backwards.here's a picture showing a chunk missing that I flaked out last night:stick fingernail in there and give a very light tug and you get this:after chamfering a bit to get rid of the bumps (to minimize flakes), you can see a little piece missing at the corner:currently the edge/chamfer is smooth, but I'm worried since it looks like there are just flakes waiting to happen:
- Thread starter
- #40
Not gonna go down that road. I like the idea of the challenge, and its a hobby. I'll figure it out. The whole chippy thing was trying to understand how best to deal with it, not complain that I got sold a bum rock.
We'll get there soon enough, and the river of mojo will flow with abandon.
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