Intro safety razor handle question- one cuts better than the other

[BigBrother]

Hey guys, just tried my first safety razor shave! On the bright side, didn't cut my face up nearly at all ;)

It was really confusing, though. I got a sampling of razors to try, including the Parker Butterfly 99R and the Jagger De98bl. Here's what happened- I started with the Jagger (with a Derby blade), and nothing was being cut. I kept going over and over at every possible angle, and it was extremely inefficient- very little hair was being removed no matter my approach. With the grain, against; perpendicular to my face, almost parallel, and every angle in between. I watched a number of videos and there seemed to be no difference between how the guys were stroking the razor across their face and how I was doing it. Looking at the razor itself, it sort of made sense- there was so much distance between the razor's edge and where the blade itself began- maybe 1.5-2mm. I inspected the blade carefully and yep, there was no real way to install it incorrectly! It was right.

Well, undeterred, I grabbed the Parker and decided to give it a try (with a Shark blade.) Now this thing cut! I finally was cutting a sensation of hairs being sliced. I was actually getting a few nicks now (good sign, IMO), and I could see how these actually worked- angle affected how it cut, etc. etc., jibing with everything I saw online. Inspecting this one, I found that the blade was indeed much, much closer to the razor edge.

So my question is, how on Earth do people shave with ones like the Jagger, or am I missing something? With what appears to be a football field of space between the contact edge and the actual blade, how are you supposed to get a clean shave?

I clearly have a promising path ahead with the Parker if I choose to stick with these, but given all the praise I've seen for the Jagger, it just left me puzzled. And if it is such a big factor, I'd think "edge distance" or whatever would be a huge property of any razor you buy (i.e. 0.2mm Jagger, 0.4mm Jagger, etc. etc.) Maybe it's all up to the blade width itself, but then when I laid the Derby atop the Shark, they were an identical width.

Alright guys, have at it!
-BB

[joshuastar]

it's not the blade you use, it's angle of the razor. the Jagger works great IMO but it was different from my first razor.

practice on your arm so you can see exactly what angle to hold the razor in order for the blade to do its work.

[BigBrother]

it's not the blade you use, it's angle of the razor. the Jagger works great IMO but it was different from my first razor.

practice on your arm so you can see exactly what angle to hold the razor in order for the blade to do its work.

I'm telling you though, no angle resulted in a good cut- from completely perpendicular to almost completely parallel.

[joshuastar]

additionally, try to eliminate as many variables as you can: pick one blade, one soap, one method of preparing your face, etc.
it's difficult to diagnose the problem if you're comparing apples and tomatoes.

if you liked the Shark, put the shark in the EJ and try it on small patches of your arm and see what you can see

[Jclifton]

Hmmm I find quite the opposite to be true with my EJ, it cuts regardless of the angle, I have to keep reminding myself not to apply pressure, because it will bring irritation in spades with this razor.
you might want to try a different blade, I think regardless of the maker, every once in a while you will find a dud blade.
but keep on, the jagger is quickly becoming my everyday razor, right along with my Gillette tech.

[Paddy Pucks]

That's interesting. I only have a DE89L and have never had any issues getting it to cut. It shaves smooth, but I think I may start poking around for something more efficient.

[BigBrother]

Hmm, I might try switching out the Derby for the Shark. It really was weird- it was like shaving with almost no blade at all!

I am curious though- *is* there a big disparity in distance between razor edge and blade edge in these ?

[Greyzer]

You probably have the baseplate of the Jagger upside-down. The scalloping should face the blade!

[Sledgehammer39]

Sounds like the blade angle was off, you gotta double check it. The Jagger is really a capable razor.

[BigBrother]

I'll look again today, but it seems unlikely it would be off- not a tough mechanism to botch!

That said, would someone be willing to take a close-up shot for me of how their Jagger looks, blade installed, etc. (specifically the edge?)

Thanks!

[joshuastar]

I'll work on it after some errand-running!

On the flip-side, try to post a picture of YOUR EJ with a blade installed!

[Greyzer]

This is a DE89 assembles the right way:
http://www.shaving.ie/product_images...41565_zoom.jpg

[smalltank]

try a Feather..being the sharpest (made in Japan)...and a very mild and forgiving blade IP dark blue n white pack (made in Israel)

[BigBrother]

This is a DE89 assembles the right way:
http://www.shaving.ie/product_images...41565_zoom.jpg

Yeah, I mean, that's what it looks like (would be pretty difficult to screw it on wrong, I feel!) The blade edge was basically sticking out halfway between the top edge and the scalloped bottom edge, resulting in almost no contact with my face, regardless of angle tried. Weird.

[Jclifton]

Hmmm that is strange, I can't see how you would be able to out I together wrong either, bu it should definitely cut your whiskers, any luck on getting some pictures of your razor up?

[joshuastar]

I don't have a macro lens handy, so iPhone will have to do:






Whatcha say BigBrother? Look familiar?

[BigBrother]

Yep, that's how mine looks. Will try swapping blades and tryi again soon!

[BigBrother]

Hahahaha- so I wake up today and, with a tiny bit of new stubble, decide to give it another shot, at least to get some knowledge out of a small-area shave. I start with the Jagger with the Shark blade, cuts pretty well- much more so than the first time with the Derby. "Must be the blade", I thought. But, ever the experimentalist, I put in the Derby again for good measure and try the other side of my face. Cuts well. "Hmm, I must have learned the trick... I guess?" ran through my head. Then, just to be certain, I re-examine the razor head. Sure enough, for all of my posturing about "no! There's no way I could have installed it wrongly!", that's exactly what happened! I had installed it yesterday scallop-side down, such that it was, looking from the top, smooth edge, blade edge, smooth edge, instead of smooth, blade, scalloped. Hah! So that was clearly why this otherwise world-class razor was barely giving me a tickle.

Now, however, onto a real beginner's question :). I got a very close shave on the parts I tried, but my God, it felt like each hair was being individually plucked out, just as with my old Sensor Excel. The shave was closer, but the plucking pain was greater. Is this a matter of technique? Skin accustomization? I thought these guys were supposed to slice through the hair, not pluck it!

Thanks!

[joshuastar]

indeed! glad you found some success!

plucking is not the norm. what's your method of shaving? (what steps do you go through to prepare and which direction do you shave, how many times, etc.)

[El-a-Menthol]

I'm telling you though, no angle resulted in a good cut- from completely perpendicular to almost completely parallel.

I'm telling you, I had this at first to.
Then it started cutting. But I couldn't get a BBS shave.
SO I switched to the super aggressive R41.
Then I started using Feathers.
Not long ago I put a Feather in my old R89.
With improved technique and a very sharp blade I got a smooth BBS.