Do people dress like slobs today? Or were people 100 years ago just plain and drab?

[rob_NH]

"Clothes make the man. Naked people have little or no influence on society" - Mark Twain.

Poorly dressed people fall somewhere in between. - my thoughts.

Really? In this day and age, all kinds of poorly dressed people have dramatic impacts on society. Musicians, actors, CEOs: Steve Jobs in jeans and a turtle neck had profound impact on society.

I think in the information age, the marketplace of ideas serves to reduce that quote quite a bit.

I'm a self proclaimed slob. I wear cargo shorts and polos to work, and until recently shaved every 4-5 days. I am highly regarded nationally in my field and within my company because I am creative thinker within my areas of specialty. And I work in a conservative field where most people do wear business formal clothing more often than many other fields.

I only dress up for conference presentations at the national level. The second the presentation is over, the tie comes off and the top button is undone, and the other days of the conferences are back to polo shirts and dockers. I also wear plain black new balance sneakers (designed for the USPS) with my suits, as I have not found a shoe yet that competes with the comfort level. People just think I'm quirky. But I have influence.

[xXClockwork]

^^^ LOL. That is rich.

[GrimmFu]

Really? In this day and age, all kinds of poorly dressed people have dramatic impacts on society. Musicians, actors, CEOs: Steve Jobs in jeans and a turtle neck had profound impact on society.

I'd have to disagree that Steve Jobs was an example of a poorly dressed man... I think he's more an example of sharp-casual. His rationale for his uniform made a lot of sense, and the items chosen were of high quality and met his very high standards.

His turtlenecks were made for him by Issey Miyake... Probably familiar to some here.

Gf

[shaveitoff]

Do people dress like slobs today? The term slob is pretty vague so there is no easy way to answer this. Two people could look at the same picture of a guy and have two different opinions.

I think that you have to take your cues from the workplace itself and any dress codes it has. Within your work environment dress the best you can. One thing that I see that I absolutely can't stand the look of is khaki pants. These things usually look like they have been washed about 100 times. To me they are the office equivalent of track pants. They look ratty in no time. The dark ones look the worst, but the tan ones aren't far behind. It isn't just because they look ratty. It is that they look lazy. Wearing khakis is basically saying you couldn't be bothered to shop for and wear nice dress pants. If you aren't wearing dress pants, I'd say put on jeans if that is acceptable in your office. But if you're doing that and you haven't got a decent pair of dark wash jeans, forget it. Stick to dress pants.

[rob_NH]

I called steve jobs poorly dressed because he did not wear suits, jackets or ties. I agree that he was sharply dressed, but the other posts in this thread seem to indicate that not wearing the collared button down shirt and a jacket is somehow dressing more like a slob. I don't feel like I need to dress like the 1930-1950 business man to be well dressed. Steve Jobs supports this. He does wear jeans though, and those have been clearly labeled slob clothes in this thread.

I'm just saying, dressing "up" is subjective, and I am playing a little bit of devil's advocate in this thread, as I value comfort over fashion.

For total disclosure, I am a little aspergery, and am very sensitive to tactile stimulation, and thus my need for comfort to be functional. That being said, I also question authority and societal norms by habit, and this my angle in this thread. I am hoping to challenge the default assumptions that suits > comfort wear, and that clothing makes the man.

[rob_NH]

Do people dress like slobs today? The term slob is pretty vague so there is no easy way to answer this. Two people could look at the same picture of a guy and have two different opinions.

I think that you have to take your cues from the workplace itself and any dress codes it has. Within your work environment dress the best you can. One thing that I see that I absolutely can't stand the look of is khaki pants. These things usually look like they have been washed about 100 times. To me they are the office equivalent of track pants. They look ratty in no time. The dark ones look the worst, but the tan ones aren't far behind. It isn't just because they look ratty. It is that they look lazy. Wearing khakis is basically saying you couldn't be bothered to shop for and wear nice dress pants. If you aren't wearing dress pants, I'd say put on jeans if that is acceptable in your office. But if you're doing that and you haven't got a decent pair of dark wash jeans, forget it. Stick to dress pants.

I find a nice pair of khakis to be more dressy looking than jeans, and much more comfortable. Jeans are less comfortable to me. Khakis are also the cool weather standard where I work.

I do think a tailored pair of wool dress pants with braces are the utmost in comfort. I also think wearing something without a restrictive waist is better for your health, and thus prefer braces to belts. I just find them to high maintenance to take care of them when used for daily wear. I have too many competing priorities for my time, and this one loses.

[Ethan.Bassist.]

Guys, I'm literally just wearing board shorts right now (okay, and underwear if you must know... perverts). No shirt, no socks, no fedora. But after I get home all sweaty from serving food to old people (classy bunch they can be... -_- ), if I'm not leaving my apartment for some time, I strip as many layers as I need to to achieve a certain level of comfort. That might mean a t-shirt and some nice relaxed lounging pants, or in today's case, no shirt and board shorts. Presentation trumps comfort only when presenting. So to an audience of none, comfort reigns supreme. So no need to don the khaki's and sweater vest Mr. Rogers style (God bless that man).

For me, I don't dress like those homeless guys in the picture because for one, that style of dress isn't befitting of my personality, two, that style of dress isn't applicable in my workplace (which is wear I spend almost 1/2 my waking day), three, why would I get dressed up like that after work to go to the store for milk and beer? And finally four, as much as I'd love to, I can't justify spending the money on a tailored (or otherwise) suit that I'll wear MAYBE once a month.

Gotta remember that not everyone works an office job and if you don't, why should you be held to office job attire? It's unpractical.

To address something someone said earlier about today's people needing variety. I'm one of those guys that has one razor, one brush, one soap (well, two... GFT Rose Cream for full shave days and a Mama Bear sample for in between). I have one scent of aftershave, deodorant, and body wash. I wear one brand of jeans/pants. I might be in the minority, but when I find something that works for me, I don't change a thing.

Also, polos... gross haha. Maybe it's because my dad wears polos (he also tucks in any shirt, t shirt/polo/button up). I can't wear a polo with a straight face. And you'll NEVER see me tucking in a t-shirt... unless it's under a dress shirt.

Did I answer the question? I don't think I did. Styles and standards change. It all depends on who you ask. This is a very romantic crowd here at B&B who is stuck in the first half of the 1900's... with all due respect may it please the court ;) and if you ask modern day fashion designers, I'd bet they'd say something different. They wouldn't have jobs if they kept designing the same things.

Phew.

[Stevew443]

Do people dress like slobs today? The term slob is pretty vague so there is no easy way to answer this. Two people could look at the same picture of a guy and have two different opinions.

I think that you have to take your cues from the workplace itself and any dress codes it has. Within your work environment dress the best you can. One thing that I see that I absolutely can't stand the look of is khaki pants. These things usually look like they have been washed about 100 times. To me they are the office equivalent of track pants. They look ratty in no time. The dark ones look the worst, but the tan ones aren't far behind. It isn't just because they look ratty. It is that they look lazy. Wearing khakis is basically saying you couldn't be bothered to shop for and wear nice dress pants. If you aren't wearing dress pants, I'd say put on jeans if that is acceptable in your office. But if you're doing that and you haven't got a decent pair of dark wash jeans, forget it. Stick to dress pants.

For most of my working career I was a network admin/PC repair tech. I frequently was found crawling around on the floor or with my head poked through the ceiling running cable. I wore khakis because my slacks could become very soiled or damaged. However, I made sure that my khakis were always starched and pressed when I arrived for work. At that time in my career I did not wear a tie, but I always tried to dress as well as I could, given the limitations of my meager salary and the demands of my work. Now (at least for the next couple of weeks until the contract runs out and I have to find a new job) I try to dress as well as I can, which is much much better than even the supervisors for whom I work. I am comfortable being dressed well, and it affects my attitude, and when I have a good attitude I tend to produce better work. Khakis are now my Friday casual wear, although I will still be wearing a nice shirt and a bow tie (I have come to love bow ties so much because NOBODY in this area wears them). Tomorrow will be lawn mowing day, so I will be in jeans and a clean t-shirt, but when it is time to go do my weekly shopping I will be cleaned up, wearing pressed khakis, a nice sports shirt, and most likely a bow tie. Hey, I gotta give the folks at the store something to point at and laugh about. :-)

[shaveitoff]

I find a nice pair of khakis to be more dressy looking than jeans, and much more comfortable. Jeans are less comfortable to me. Khakis are also the cool weather standard where I work.

I do think a tailored pair of wool dress pants with braces are the utmost in comfort. I also think wearing something without a restrictive waist is better for your health, and thus prefer braces to belts. I just find them to high maintenance to take care of them when used for daily wear. I have too many competing priorities for my time, and this one loses.

My idea is that khakis look nowhere as good as dress pants. So you are better off wearing dress pants than khakis. Khakis are too much of a compromise. Either dress up or dress down, but don't try to split the difference. Admittedly, this is a personal subjective presence.

[TnutsShave]

I enjoy dressing well for work (slacks/shirts that fit/are pressed, polished shoes, etc) or when going out with my wife. I ALSO enjoy dressing down when not at work. I have a 3 year old son. This essentially means that every outfit at home becomes the tarp at a Gallagher show to protect me from flying milk, "washable markers" (I still get a kick out of that), "pee-pee", the list goes on and on. I'd happily dress "up" whilst playing with the little man if it wasn't ridiculously inappropriate.

I would just as happily send you naysayers the dry-cleaning bill.

[zethreal]

You can count me in with the 'unfashionable' ones... I normally wear khakis, a belt & a Hawaiian shirt. I will only wear jeans & a t-shirt if I know I'm going to be doing a lot of hard labor ( working on a car or something similar ), but I don't wear sport coats and I only have a few 'dress' shirts.

I do always have my pants pulled up & belted in place though. I keep my black hiking boots polished & in good shape ( I need the ankle support or I'd wear dress shoes )

[Mojo88]

I dress for what is necessary to do my job. I have had different positions in sales and have worn everything from a suit to jeans. It all has depended on the situation but, my clothes are always neat and clean and I am clean shaven every day. You can wear a suit that is wrinkled with a wrinkled shirt and look like a slob or you can wear jeans and look clean and neat

In my current position I wear a long sleeve shirt and jeans everyday. It is a necessary part of my job as sometimes I do work that exposes me to solvents and pigments. I make sure everyday that my boots are clean and I wear fresh clothes. A customer commented one day that I always am ready for work, my clothes are clean and am always clean shaven. In sales ,even if you don't think people don't notice your apperance they do.

[jlanger]

Back 'in the day' there was a lot more social pressure to 'dress appropriately'. Everyone basically bought into the notion of how one was supposed to dress, and they did it. Yes, a poor man's (only) suit would be of poor quality (although he'd put a premium on durability) and probably rather ill-fitting, but it'd be a suit.



In the "old days" average people (that is, the non-wealthy) spent a lot more of their total income on a lot fewer items of clothing. In part, they had no choice as the world was not yet flooded with incredibly cheap stuff made overseas and sold at Walmart, and in part it was a different mentality ... people looked for durability in their clothing, and there was an acceptance of wearing the same clothing very frequently that we do not have today ... the sarcastic "didn't you wear that yesterday?" is a new phenomenon.


I remember going on a vacation to Vegas with a couple buddies back in 2005 or so ... and being struck by the omnipresent slobbishness of the people I saw there. This was on the strip, and no doubt 95% of the people I saw were on vacation like me ... so I'm not expecting suit & tie (although that'd be cool ... we can all get dressed up and live out our "cool Rat Pack Vegas" dreams in lounge suits, fedoras, and givin' a damn ... ) but "nice casual" are no longer words that go together apparently.



Too true.

But I think it now goes deeper than that. Hard-core individualism has taken over as a quasi-religion in much of modern society (at least western society ... I cannot speak for the rest of the world ...) to such an extent that otherwise-right-thinking people get highly upset if you start talking about how there are or ought to be standards for dress ... "how dare you (or anyone) tell me how I ought to dress" ... as if they've just had their moral fibre called into question. Start a thread here about how it'd be nice if everyone took their hats off when they sit down at a restaurant "just like in the good old days" and the arguments lead to thread-lock.

Oh dear.



One more thing there ... nowadays, we are conditioned to not want to wear the same stuff over and over again. And it's not just about keeping up with fashion (although that doesn't help ), we just get bombarded with so much advertising and urgings to buy that we're just not satisfied with owning a few things ... we have to have a lot of things. (How many of you own ONE razor, ONE brush, ONE shave soap, and ONE aftershave ... the way all our grandfathers did?)

And then, we have the post-war phenomenon of having some third-world country/ies out there ready, willing and able to make mountains of cheap crap to satiate our current desire to own a bunch of new stuff. Depending on how old you are, you will remember back when "Made in Japan", "Made in Hong Kong", and "Made in Taiwan" all had the same "this is cheap crap" connotation that "Made in China" now does.

That was a big thing that I struggled with when I started my court job and took to wearing ties and sportcoats. For the first 6 months or so I only had one blue blazer, and a black sport coat which was way too dressy for my station. So I had the blue blazer, luckily I had numerous ties and shirts and got my Red Wing Iron Rangers a few months into it. I'm amazed no one said a word about the same blazer, but I got tons of complements about dressing nicely and even a few from coworkers that I was dressing too nicely. I didn't care and just kept at it. Finally found a few additional sport coats that were at the price/quality I wanted to pay and I'm slowly expanding my wardrobe. Now if I could just find a couple of pairs of pants that will last I'll be good. (BTW Iron rangers are kinda tough on the cuffs of pants!)
I'll admit that wearing the nicer clothes makes me feel better. In good shirt, shoes, tie and blazer I'm quite comfortable. Even in the very warm summer we're having. I'll admit that when it gets over 90 or so I'll take even my tropical weight blazer off for periods that I don't have to be in court. However when I'm wearing less than the ensemble I feel kinda naked. Even going to a couple of very nice short sleeve shirts, doesn't feel quite right, though IMO at 98-100 degrees F it's kinda necessary.

[Doc4]

That was a big thing that I struggled with when I started my court job and took to wearing ties and sportcoats. For the first 6 months or so I only had one blue blazer, and a black sport coat which was way too dressy for my station. So I had the blue blazer, luckily I had numerous ties and shirts and got my Red Wing Iron Rangers a few months into it. I'm amazed no one said a word about the same blazer, but I got tons of complements about dressing nicely and even a few from coworkers that I was dressing too nicely. I didn't care and just kept at it. Finally found a few additional sport coats that were at the price/quality I wanted to pay and I'm slowly expanding my wardrobe. Now if I could just find a couple of pairs of pants that will last I'll be good. (BTW Iron rangers are kinda tough on the cuffs of pants!)
I'll admit that wearing the nicer clothes makes me feel better. In good shirt, shoes, tie and blazer I'm quite comfortable. Even in the very warm summer we're having. I'll admit that when it gets over 90 or so I'll take even my tropical weight blazer off for periods that I don't have to be in court. However when I'm wearing less than the ensemble I feel kinda naked. Even going to a couple of very nice short sleeve shirts, doesn't feel quite right, though IMO at 98-100 degrees F it's kinda necessary.

A navy blue blazer is one of the most versatile pieces of clothing you can own, and ... imho ... one of the most suited (no pun intended) for wearing on a daily basis without it seeming stale or repetitive.

[Robert45]

In our workplace, we have a saying: Always dress for the job you want next.

[stuy119]

I've somewhat remedied the situation by dressing mostly in navy. I have 5 navy suits, 1 gray suit, and a black suit. Navy is my go-to, gray is my warm, sunny day wear, and black pinstripe is my C-suite attire.

[Bill Smith]

I started commuting into NYC about 35 years ago. Then and today, my very early 5:15 am train was largely populated by either the construction trades or Wall Street types. In the decades past the construction guys were all in clean work clothes and were well groomed (no 2-day stubble). Finance folks in suites, usually navy or dark grey with white or pale blue shirts and subtle ties. Shoes were immaculately polished (most office buildings had a shoeshine station). Today many of both groups look like they just rolled out of bed (or the gutter after a hard night). Many are so slovenly that I really wonder how they leave their homes that way. I wouldn't take my garbage can to the street looking like that. This is not everyone, the majority still look sharp (except for their shaving habits) and take pride in their appearance even though styles have certainly changed with suites in the clear minority and "business casual" the uniform of the day.

I was reading Michael Lewis' book the "The Big Short" and his observation was that the wall street traders dressed casually while the investment bankers and lawyers stuck to more formal business attire.

In one previous job the office environment was all over the place in terms of dress code, most of the time it was pretty casual unless you were in new business development or a senior member of an account team with a client meeting to go to. One friday I was wearing some nice fitting dark rinse jeans, a polo shirt and well polished penny loafers. A sales rep paid a surprise visit from a vendor I had been trying to reach for weeks. The guy looked like his wife tossed him out on his ear the night before, slept in his suit in the back seat of his car and had unpolished shoes. Yes you can dress casually but you're not necessarily a slob either for doing so.

Then again I work in more creative profession than average, a Wall St. or Bay St. corporate law firm will have a more formal dress code and if I was in their marketing department, I would follow said dress code.

[hotreds]

Dunno if I'd say "most" people, but certainly "many" or "too many!"

[Den]

Forget how men have gotten lazier in how they dress, look at the women! They've taken it a step (or 100 steps) further than the men.

I work in a office environment that consists of approx 70% women and it amazes me how most show up for work. No makeup, hair in a ponytail, flat shoes, male golf shirts, whatever.

Regardless if they have 12 kids, and are a single mom, a little effort goes a long way.

The men have gotten pretty sloppy, and I do agree that sloppy is a good term to describe what we're talking about, but the women took it to a whole other level.

[rob_NH]

I find the natural look of a healthy woman to be way more appealing than one in makeup and high heels. It just amazes me that standards set less than a century ago are the ones we are holding people to today.

I should just stop reading this thread.

To me, a person who looks healthy and dressed down is more attractive than one who looks less healthy and is all dressed up or made up, male or female. Basic hygiene helps of course, but beyond that, it is all just trying to make a silk purse from a sow's ear. It amazes me how we accept the current state of affairs of the american lifestyle and the poor health indicators that generally come with it for most of the population. Brainwashing by mass media hasn't helped this issue, it has made it worse, as people strive to be thin instead of healthy, and then they look gaunt and sickly instead of attractive at their "ideal" body weight. Argh.